Stephen Hawking's Disbelief in the Afterlife

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SPKx
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16 May 2011, 1:21 pm

Stephen Hawking: 'There is no heaven; it's a fairy story'

It really strikes a chord when one greatest scientific minds in the world disavows the existence of an afterlife. I am less upset by Hawking's atheism (not really surprising) than by the matter of fact way he just compares the human mind to a computer that will one day just stop working.

I personally believe that life in general can't be described in such simplistic terms and whether or not an afterlife really exists, I would like to be described as more than just a machine!

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16 May 2011, 1:24 pm

the similarities between the human mind and computers is astonishing.

other than that i wouldnt have called such a definitive statement from hawking.

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16 May 2011, 2:18 pm

Oodain wrote:

the similarities between the human mind and computers is astonishing.

other than that i wouldnt have called such a definitive statement from hawking.

At the molecular level there is little resemblance between a brain and a computer.

And there no such thing as a Mind. Have a PET scan, MRI scan and X-ray made of your brain. You will not find the least trace of a Mind therein.

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16 May 2011, 2:42 pm

Hawking knows a bunch of stuff about physics.. the physical world. The natural world. His expertise and devotion to those phenomena doesn't lend any credibility to his opinions on supernatural claims. He is no credible than your average man on the street. Even if that guy is dumb as a rock.

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16 May 2011, 2:53 pm

dionysian wrote:

There is not an iota of evidence that the supernatural exists.

ruveyn

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16 May 2011, 3:00 pm

ruveyn wrote:

dionysian wrote:

There is not an iota of evidence that the supernatural exists.

ruveyn

I'm inclined to agree. But Stephen Hawking wouldn't have expertise on the subject if there was such a thing as the supernatural.

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16 May 2011, 3:02 pm

dionysian wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

dionysian wrote:

There is not an iota of evidence that the supernatural exists.

ruveyn

I'm inclined to agree. But Stephen Hawking wouldn't have expertise on the subject if there was such a thing as the supernatural.

The only things that exist are natural and physical.

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dionysian
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16 May 2011, 3:20 pm

ruveyn wrote:

The only things that exist are natural and physical.

ruveyn

Idealism is equally likely as materialism... But neither is a satisfying metaphysics on its own.

My main problem with materialism is that it simply has nothing to say about a huge swath of human experience. Particularly its richest and most meaningful aspects. It's a nice tool for cutting through some glaring fallacies, but it has very little to say about a lot of what matters to me.

Tell me that all of my thoughts, ideas, and emotions are nothing more than electric currents shifting in my brain... you might be right, and I'd probably be inclined to agree, but you're not saying anything meaningful. You're missing the forest for the trees.

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16 May 2011, 4:18 pm

ruveyn wrote:

Oodain wrote:

the similarities between the human mind and computers is astonishing.

other than that i wouldnt have called such a definitive statement from hawking.

wasnt really thinking of the physical makeup.
more of the conceptualized "parts"

in my world brain=mind

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MarketAndChurch
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16 May 2011, 5:30 pm

If god doesn't exist, then of course there is not afterlife. I do hope there is one. Other organisms don't "hope" to live on, they either do or don't depending on their ability to survive and thrive. It is unique to our species.

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ruveyn
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16 May 2011, 5:53 pm

MarketAndChurch wrote:

That does not follow logically.

ruveyn

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16 May 2011, 5:57 pm

SPKx wrote:

I personally believe that life in general can't be described in such simplistic terms and whether or not an afterlife really exists, I would like to be described as more than just a machine!

The problem for you is that our world makes sense. A particular event is followed up by a particular effect, and due to this fact it is possible for us to empirically test scenarios, and we always come up with underlying mathematical ratios (with stochastic elements in QM). So it's impossible for us not to reduce systems to "machines"; that is what they actually are.

Quote:

If god doesn't exist, then of course there is not afterlife

Er, your B doesn't follow from your A. An afterlife without God is no less likely than one with Him, Her, or It.

Quote:

My main problem with materialism is that it simply has nothing to say about a huge swath of human experience. Particularly its richest and most meaningful aspects. It's a nice tool for cutting through some glaring fallacies, but it has very little to say about a lot of what matters to me.

There's no reason that materialism won't be able to explain how and why consciousness arises, to some degree. Beats the non-explanations Priests and Vicars give.

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MarketAndChurch
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16 May 2011, 5:57 pm

ruveyn wrote:

MarketAndChurch wrote:

That does not follow logically.

ruveyn

how so

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16 May 2011, 5:59 pm

MarketAndChurch wrote:

ruveyn wrote:

MarketAndChurch wrote:

That does not follow logically.

ruveyn

how so

It is still a logical possibility for an afterlife to exist with out a God; it is not a self-contradictory proposition. However, we have no empirical reason to assume the existence of an afterlife of any form.

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16 May 2011, 6:16 pm

ruveyn wrote:

dionysian wrote:

There is not an iota of evidence that the supernatural exists.

ruveyn

I for one don't believe in the supernatural; I do believe there is the possibility that there are natural things that occur in our experience as humans that we currently do not have the ability to measure.

But, for one that believes in the 'super'natural as soon as physical evidence was established it would then become part of the natural world.

So if something supernatural exists; by definition we wouldn't be able to measure something that doesn't exist in the natural world and couldn't expect to ever have evidence of it.

Why would Hawkins believe in something he can't measure; he's a scientist? Is it any surprise?

Imagine what kind of reaction he would get if he stated there was an afterlife with no scientific evidence; wearing his scientist hat. He would lose credibility in the scientific community.

Now that he has come up with this new "unusual" statement. Should those that believe in an afterlife suddenly change their mind. The news article said Hawkins "surprising" view on the afterlife. Did it surprise anyone?

Maybe if the Pope answered it that way it would be surprising.

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16 May 2011, 6:21 pm

MarketAndChurch wrote:

If god doesn't exist, then of course there is not afterlife.

I can imagine a logically consistent possible world where there is no God, and people have rich and rewarding afterlives. I don't think you can demonstrate your statement... I'd like to see you try, though.

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