Atheist quote up for discussion

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We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes. – Gene Roddenberry

I seem like a "militant atheist" sometimes, but I just want to know the logic behind religion. Anyway, I've asked the question to a Rabbi at my school (I was born Jewish) about why God can't fix the problems on Earth if he or she (everyone insists on calling God "he", I don't know why) is all-powerful and why did he want to create imperfect creatures such as us. He said that God and Man have a "partnership".

In the Bible, God seems very jealous and calls him/her/itself merciful when he/she/it doesn't attack someone to death. It just wants everyone to love it, even though we've never seen it and heard it (yes, I'm calling God it!). Did it seriously just create faulty humans to boost its self-esteem?

Gene Roddenberry has a good point. Why don't people question this theory?

They do. They have. Just look around.

And yet it does move.

Truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth - at any level, about anything, will rarely make sense.

Do not look for sense and the whole truth in a bureau drawer.

People do hold the Gene Roddenberry view though. In fact, its a common criticism of Christian teachings.

Philologos, while we should be on our guard for complexity. It isn't as if this guard justifies, or even gives us a lot of reason to be skeptical to anti-religious impulses. I mean, the real problem is that theisms and religions outright lack justification altogether beyond a whining subjective glitch. We can have these glitches, but they don't have to point to something real and absolute.

gailryder17, IK do not mean to hijack your inquiry, but if you will bear with me this once I will not do it again in this thread:

AG:

While I never worried about it so deeply as to come to the Roddenberry conclusion [is that who I think it is? Never mind, if it is I have fewer problems with him than Hawking and goubt he is as hyped], if I had in the day run across it I would have found no problems with it. See my list

Drawing conclusions contrary to those of religions is perfectly reasonable and natural - I did it for years.

But there is a tipping point where the evidence stacks too high for the previous conclusions to stand, at which point the inquirer must recalibrate. That point came in my data stream. Whether it will at any point for you of gailryder17 remains to be seen and cannot be predicted.

But if you have never seen the aurora borealis and I have [actually I have not, wish I could say otherwise, pictures and reports are impressive] there is no harm my saying so.

I have seen and picked a 7-leaved clover. Believe it or not. No facts are changed by your acceptance or rejection of this proposition,

Philogos, you aren't hijacking my inquiry. I respect your point of view. I wasn't saying I fully believe the quote, I just put it up for discussion. I do see Gene Roddenberry's point though.

Clearly, by the quote on the first post, if you follow the Christian idea of theism, you don't follow logic. That's basic logic.

PS: Your data is not different, it is inexistent.

AG,YOU have to evaluate and work with the evidence comes your way.

If the positions were reversed, I assure you I would have strong reservations about your alleged percepions

In the nature of things, I cannot show you the 7-leaved clover. I used to have it around, but have not seen it for years, and can't even photograph it for you. How much less my night in Hagerstown.

More quotes to ponder:

"The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." -- Benjamin Franklin (1706-1790), American public official, writer, scientist, and printer who played a major part in the American Revolution.

"Question with boldness even the existence of God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." -- Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826), 3rd American president, author, scientist, architect, educator, and diplomat. Deist, avid separationist.

"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less, in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry, and persecution." -- James Madison (1751-1836), American president and political theorist. Popularly known as the "Father of the Constitution." More than any other framer he is responsible for the content and form of the First Amendment (freedom of speech, press, and religion).

... and yet some people still believe that America was founded as a Christian nation or solely on Christian principles.

Fnord:

Franklin is wrong.

Jefferson is quite right.

Madison has a serious point - politicians need to keep their hands OFF religion.