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monkees4va
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02 Mar 2009, 6:50 am

I have a philosophy I thought up in my spare time.
I have compared the human race to other predators and omnivores, particularly those that hunt in groups.
For instance, I compared humanity to lions and noticed significant similarities. Lions, although they may not be Einstein’s, have intelligence, as they work out a specific attack for each different group of prey, the preys’ formation at that time and the numbers in the groups they hunt. Therefore I have reasoned that they must have problem solving abilities to be able to think how to best attack the groups to greaten the chances of a successful hunt. I believe this is how human intelligence first began in the Stone Age, and how they were able to take down such animals as the mammoth. I believe this problem solving ability was then applied in other senses as well, such as fire making and seed sowing, slowly at first using things provided in nature but quickening when they discovered a new use for an object or a method in which to make things themselves. I believe that mans inquisitive nature (also found in animals such as squid, monkeys and elephants), combined with this problem solving ability, helped to evolve the prefrontal cortex, which enables man to ‘think’.
We are also not the only creatures to dream. Experiments have found that mammals, birds and some reptiles also dream, whilst fish and insects do not. This could also be a factor in man creating weapons and such, perhaps even art.
I proposed this idea to my Religious and moral education teacher (who is interested in philosophy) and he told me that comparing humans to animals was wrong and immoral, that god created us specially to take care of the animals on this earth (I could mention so many contradictions to this statement but I don’t have the time :P). Yes, he is religious, but generally open to the subjects of evolution and such.
I’m confused. I thought humans were animals? Even if what this man says is true, surely god didn’t choose a very reliable race to carry on god’s ideals throughout the ages. From what you can see here it must be obvious I myself am not religious, as I have a mind that needs solid facts to believe in anything, from Pythagoras theorem to the theory of natural selection (Both of which I believe in, of course :P)
Please help me, I’m beginning to think I’m a heretic and will surely be an outcast from all religious discussion in my class from now on. Is this idea so outrageous?


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Henriksson
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02 Mar 2009, 7:36 am

Humans are two meals from barbarism. Ignoring what our instincts tell us to do is the first step from breaking free from our evolutionary chains.


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Sand
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02 Mar 2009, 7:41 am

The first suspicion should be aroused when people tell you it is wrong to think about anything. Once you've got over that you're on your own.



ruveyn
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02 Mar 2009, 7:45 am

monkees4va wrote:
I have a philosophy I thought up in my spare time.
I have compared the human race to other predators and omnivores, particularly those that hunt in groups.


That is what we are. What else is new?

ruveyn



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03 Mar 2009, 7:15 am

monkees4va wrote:
I’m confused. I thought humans were animals?


If you have any idea what the word animal even means in the biological sense, you'll know we are animals. We are also chordates, choelomates, deuterostomes, and gnathostomes. And on that note, deuterostomes .. they are choelomates (animals w/ tubular internal digestive cavity) that develop a blastophore that creates the opening for the anus BEFORE the opening for the mouth. Some species of worms, starfish, sea cucumbers, sea urchins, and every single thing that has a spinal cord ALL develop the opening for the anus first. That's a strange thing to share with every single higher life form. There is no reason at all why we couldn't develop our mouths first, yet there are no exceptions period... and that's just based on taxonomy, a mere classification system. Both evolution AND genetics independently confirm this finding. This is just one teeny tiny bit of evidence that highly confirms evolution in that there just hasn't been any selective pressure to change this particular characteristic, and so it propagated down the lineage unhindered for many many millions of years.

Anyway... Animal: multicellular organism of the kingdom Animalia, differing from plants in certain typical characteristics such as capacity for locomotion, nonphotosynthetic metabolism, pronounced response to stimuli, restricted growth, and fixed bodily structure.



monkees4va
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03 Mar 2009, 7:37 am

I do understand what an animal is (but not all those wonderful scientific terms for it) but the argument being presented here is that man is not an animal as god created man to look after his creations, so therefore we are higher than animals


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Sand
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03 Mar 2009, 9:16 am

monkees4va wrote:
I do understand what an animal is (but not all those wonderful scientific terms for it) but the argument being presented here is that man is not an animal as god created man to look after his creations, so therefore we are higher than animals


Every living thing is basically a machine to extract energy from the environment and reproduce. Different kinds of life live in different kinds of environments and therefore have different systems for performing this process. Aside from animals and plants domesticated by humans for their own use animals and plants don't need humans to look after them. They either do that themselves or don't survive. There is no "higher" or "lower". A human could not survive like a clam or a honeybee or an eagle because it is not built to do so.



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03 Mar 2009, 9:32 am

monkees4va wrote:
he told me that comparing humans to animals was wrong and immoral


Whats immoral about it?

Consider that it is mans free will that enables sin. Therefore, animals(in the Christian sense), are free from sin, and by nature, completely moral.

Thats simplistic, as I believe that animals have free will too(as much as I believe that humans actually do), but the judeo-christian party line is that original sin comes from free will, right? Animals were not given that, and thus, are free from amoral behavior.


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Sand
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03 Mar 2009, 10:13 am

Fuzzy wrote:
monkees4va wrote:
he told me that comparing humans to animals was wrong and immoral


Whats immoral about it?

Consider that it is mans free will that enables sin. Therefore, animals(in the Christian sense), are free from sin, and by nature, completely moral.

Thats simplistic, as I believe that animals have free will too(as much as I believe that humans actually do), but the judeo-christian party line is that original sin comes from free will, right? Animals were not given that, and thus, are free from amoral behavior.


On the basis of that logic comparing animals to humans indicates how immoral humans are compared to animals. That's why comparison is shunned.



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03 Mar 2009, 10:19 am

Sand wrote:
Fuzzy wrote:
monkees4va wrote:
he told me that comparing humans to animals was wrong and immoral


Whats immoral about it?

Consider that it is mans free will that enables sin. Therefore, animals(in the Christian sense), are free from sin, and by nature, completely moral.

Thats simplistic, as I believe that animals have free will too(as much as I believe that humans actually do), but the judeo-christian party line is that original sin comes from free will, right? Animals were not given that, and thus, are free from amoral behavior.


On the basis of that logic comparing animals to humans indicates how immoral humans are compared to animals. That's why comparison is shunned.


I woulds agree. Its an ugly face looking back in the mirror.


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ruveyn
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03 Mar 2009, 3:25 pm

Fuzzy wrote:

I woulds agree. Its an ugly face looking back in the mirror.


Yes. But it is Your face. Rejoice!

Ruveyn



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03 Mar 2009, 6:27 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Fuzzy wrote:

I woulds agree. Its an ugly face looking back in the mirror.


Yes. But it is Your face. Rejoice!

Ruveyn


Haha! Yes it is! :)


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