Bruce Jenner: "Call Me Caitlyn"

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Kraichgauer
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05 Jun 2015, 9:42 am

Dillogic wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

And even if being gay - like being an Aspie - puts one in a group that faces stress and discrimination, being gay or an Aspie in itself isn't the cause of the mental strife. Therefore, neither qualifies as a mental illness.

Exactly, but they need to be if we're to receive help for them, whether that's because of internal and/or external factors. Whilst it can be demeaning to be seen as mentally ill, you have to accept what you are and how it makes you suffer in comparison to other people without it, otherwise you will suffer more due to not getting the help you probably need.

GID being a disorder allows for medication and other treatment options to be administered under insurance/government health, for example (various degrees of success there, of course).

(The implication is that you're suffering and/or have trouble with functioning. If you don't, there's no point in labeling yourself with something.)

But a disorder like autism, and mental illness, are not the same thing. Whereas homosexuality isn't even a disorder, but simply one's sexuality.

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progaspie
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05 Jun 2015, 5:58 pm

beneficii wrote:

This African-American woman I think makes good points on gender dysphoria, points which are not well-addressed and when made often result in the maker being no-platformed:

Quote:

Paradoxically, the more our society tries to free itself from gender stereotypes, the more it becomes enslaved to them. By saying that people can be born in a body of the wrong gender, transgender activists are saying there is a set of feelings that are only allocated to women and another set for men. Therefore, they believe, those who feel things that do not conform to their sex’s acceptable set of feelings must outwardly change their gender to match their mind.

Why are we colluding with narrow ideas of femininity or masculinity? What does it mean to “feel” like a woman? Should we question that idea as much as we have questioned ideas of a “woman’s place” or a “man’s role”? When did we come to accept the idea of “gendered thoughts” or “gendered feelings”?

Quote:

People opposed to the transgender movement are often accused of being bigots. In truth, I—like many others—harbor no hate for people who suffer from gender identity disorder. Rather, I feel deep compassion and concern for them in their suffering. As someone in the field of psychology, I hope we can one day find a more holistic, less invasive means to treat this disorder. However, I will concede that I find something quite insulting about the entire phenomenon. It is an insult to the other sex to think that by “dressing like them,” “talking like them,” or claiming to “feel like them,” you can therefore be them. Being a man is about more than wearing a suit, and being a woman is about more than putting on makeup. If we feel confined in our bodies, perhaps it is not our bodies we should try to correct but our spirits we should reconnect with.

http://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2015/06/15108/

The article the way I read it, is full of mistruths, half truths and sweeping generalisations. To compare someone suffering from Gender Dysphoria to an Africian American wishing they were a white American is plainly mischievous to me. Usually these type of articles are linked back to some form of religious connection, namely God made you who you are and only God can change you. Applying the logic in the article, people suffering from intersex conditions, or those with ambiguous genitalia should receive no treatment since only those with clearly defined biological and genetic sexual identities can function in the sexual framework of their biological sex.

beneficii
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05 Jun 2015, 6:39 pm

progaspie,

As I understand it, people with intersex conditions generally do NOT want doctors operating on them as newborns or anytime in childhood in order to "normalize" them. They want to first be old enough to decide for themselves, if such operations would occur at all.

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progaspie
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08 Jun 2015, 6:58 am

beneficii wrote:

Benefici

People with intersex conditions may or may not decide to seek surgical intervention, but my objection is with the people who sit in judgement of those who are trapped in the gender they don't identify with and receive no sympathy when they attempt to seek help.

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08 Jun 2015, 1:12 pm

Spike TV To Cut Clint Eastwood's Joke About Caitlyn Jenner From Awards Show

Quote:

reportedly compared Johnson, who currently stars in the action flick "San Andreas" and HBO's new series "Ballers," to other athletes who have gone into acting, saying: "Jim Brown and Caitlyn Somebody."

I do not find this offensive at all. It is not knocking transition but the athletes who have become actors and the massive publicity surrounding this particular transition

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10 Jun 2015, 7:16 pm

Fnord wrote:

It's the makeup. If you'd ever seen Jenner without it, you'd think they were two different people. Of course, Jenner is also wealthy, so the best and most skillful cosmetic surgery is not out of the question. The average trans-female will likely end up looking more like a man in drag, unless the transitioning began before puberty.

There is also the corset, the wig, the padded bra, and the special cup for Jenner's "package" (which is still obvious in some shots).

Jenner might 'pass' is West Hollywood, but not in Anaheim!

You're probably quite correct, but I'msure that many of the married men in Anaheim would have no issue hitting on Caitlyn knowing full well that 'she' isn't yet entirely a woman.

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10 Jun 2015, 7:35 pm

Fogman wrote:

You're probably quite correct, but I'msure that many of the married men in Anaheim would have no issue hitting on Caitlyn knowing full well that 'she' isn't yet entirely a woman.

but what about "the surprise"?

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10 Jun 2015, 8:44 pm

auntblabby wrote:

Fogman wrote:

You're probably quite correct, but I'msure that many of the married men in Anaheim would have no issue hitting on Caitlyn knowing full well that 'she' isn't yet entirely a woman.

but what about "the surprise"?

Amy Schumer, on her show, Inside Amy Schumer, had interviewed a transsexual woman, who honestly could pass for a natural born woman, and says she gets all kinds of attention in the small town she has moved to. Her husband has no problem with this, even when she had been upfront with him from the beginning that she has a penis. Who'd have expected that kind of tolerance from a small town guy?

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10 Jun 2015, 8:49 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

Fogman wrote:

You're probably quite correct, but I'msure that many of the married men in Anaheim would have no issue hitting on Caitlyn knowing full well that 'she' isn't yet entirely a woman.

but what about "the surprise"?

I wonder if they take turns?

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10 Jun 2015, 9:00 pm

auntblabby wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

Fogman wrote:

You're probably quite correct, but I'msure that many of the married men in Anaheim would have no issue hitting on Caitlyn knowing full well that 'she' isn't yet entirely a woman.

but what about "the surprise"?

I wonder if they take turns?

She said she likes anal, so I took that to mean she was on the receiving end.

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auntblabby
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10 Jun 2015, 9:22 pm

Kraichgauer wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

Fogman wrote:

You're probably quite correct, but I'msure that many of the married men in Anaheim would have no issue hitting on Caitlyn knowing full well that 'she' isn't yet entirely a woman.

but what about "the surprise"?

I wonder if they take turns?

She said she likes anal, so I took that to mean she was on the receiving end.

but since she also has the male equipment, "what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander," as they say.

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10 Jun 2015, 9:27 pm

Her keeping the male equipment, was that a choice or from a financial burden?

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10 Jun 2015, 10:01 pm

AnonymousAnonymous wrote:

Good for her! However, this has already caused debate whether gender-reassignment surgery is worth it. Like many, I'm tired of transphobes shooting their mouths off at the idea of transgenderism, which is not going anywhere anytime soon.

I agree. I've dealt with the whole nine yards in my lifetime so far. It's bad enough that my mum is in denial about my own gender issues. She accused me of telling everybody on Facebook that I was Gay last February, because I came out as a transman. I wasn't surprised that she saw it on my status. I was dropping little hints here and there, since the Spring of 2011. If only I had the money to have the operation.

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auntblabby
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10 Jun 2015, 10:11 pm

beneficii wrote:

Her keeping the male equipment, was that a choice or from a financial burden?

it is a choice no matter how you slice it [oops, bad pun :oops:

] in that jenner is clearly wealthy enough to afford the full monty but chose to keep the package intact.

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10 Jun 2015, 10:18 pm

auntblabby wrote:

beneficii wrote:

Her keeping the male equipment, was that a choice or from a financial burden?

it is a choice no matter how you slice it [oops, bad pun :oops:

] in that jenner is clearly wealthy enough to afford the full monty but chose to keep the package intact.

I know about Jenner. I'm not talking about Jenner. I'm talking about the person either you or that other person brought up in the last few posts.

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Kraichgauer
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10 Jun 2015, 10:35 pm

auntblabby wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

Kraichgauer wrote:

auntblabby wrote:

Fogman wrote:

You're probably quite correct, but I'msure that many of the married men in Anaheim would have no issue hitting on Caitlyn knowing full well that 'she' isn't yet entirely a woman.

but what about "the surprise"?

I wonder if they take turns?

She said she likes anal, so I took that to mean she was on the receiving end.

but since she also has the male equipment, "what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander," as they say.

In all honesty, going just by the interview with Amy Schumer, I have no idea.

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