R.I.P. The Greatest Show on Earth

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If it was a local Humane Society, I'd take their word for it. If it was the Humane Society of the United States, then I would ignore anything being said. HSUS, as far as I'm concerned, is nothing more than a front for the People for the Ethicsl Treatment of Animals (PETA), which, in my view, is a terrorist organization. (Remember the Got Autism? Billboard campaign the developed with Autism $peak$?)

I am not an advocate for the use of bulls hooks such as viewable in that video, but the facts are still the facts: Bull hooks for elephants and bits in the mouths horses do not cause physical injury when used properly. I have only ever handled one elephant -- I am far from being highly-experienced and/or well-seasoned in relation to elephants -- and there was the one time I have mentioned when someone else stepped in and treated "Lisa" in ways I would not when I could not get her to return to her post (ankle chain) after a show. My concern at that time, however, was more for my own safety than whether or not the elephant might feel any pain even apart from actual injury, so I stepped back quite a bit while the other handler got her into position. I later asked that man what he would have done if she had turned on him, and he responded, "I would run like hell! What would you do?" Overall, I am actually glad I will never again find myself in that kind of situation and have to even consider an answer.

Coming from someone who has raised cattle and other large animals there are circumstances when you do need force,like when an animal escapes and might get onto a road.
My remark was about beating an animal to train it.No way would I have beat the horse we had to train it.Not only would it be cruel but you will have a shy fearful animal that dosent trust the handler.I use treats to train my animals.My dog does tricks for pepperoni,not out of fear.
Bull hooks are banned from use on elephants in several states.
One thing for sure,you never beat a mule,old timers have told me this.The mule will remember and pay you back one day.

There is where I think it would be great if better techniques had been known and utilized even before any elephants has been brought into service for entertainment...

My parents took me to see Wringling Bros. long, long ago and I thought it was a miserable, depressing thing.

The whole atmosphere seemed exploitative and abusive--of the animals, sure but even more of the people. The impression I got was that the performers disliked the customers, or at least saw them as rubes and marks, targets for additional exploitation at every opportunity.

I can't find words to explain it properly, but the scenes in "The Elephant Man" when the guards allow people into the hospital at night created a similar atmosphere. A little vestige of the worst of the Victorian age, right there in the 20th century.

I liked the acrobats, the rest was pretty awful. There are other outfits like Cirque du Soleil that do acrobatics much better now.

I would never have take my kids there and I'm glad to hear the thing is folding. I feel bad for the people who are losing livelihoods, but also hopeful that they can now move on to something better.

I root for the bulls at Pamploma; love it when one of those idiots gets gored.

The Milk causes Autism billboard?Yes,I remember that.
Some of their petitions I will sign,some I won't.They got all bent out of shape years ago over a Wheaties box with a bass fisherman on it.Fishing for food is not the same as a factory farm.They have good intentions but seem to lack common sense at times.

I didn't think so, but still seems mean. I'm sure the pachyderms are happier wherever they're grazing now.

My own limited experience traveling with even just a small show would suggest that is fairly accurate. All the smiles and styling (posturing, waving and so on) began promptly at opening time when the "townies" were allowed onto the midway and then quickly ended as the performers exited the tent following the closing parade around the center ring. The one exception I saw, however, was from the clown. He was a retired school teacher who truly loved passing out smiles to anyone and everyone at any time of day or night.


My favorite was a performer on a slack-rope (not a tight-wire) "cloud swing" between the center poles who could do some pretty amazing stuff such as lying on the rope while swinging far enough to slap canvas with one hand at each high spot. But then I believe he was exploiting his young daughter after having trained her from a very young age to lie on her back with her legs in the air to "juggle" boxes or whatever and spin a long double-ended torch with her feet. Circus is all about fantasy, and it seems even the performers sometimes even have their own.

I am not convinced the "grazing" is as idyllic as Ringling might want it to sound, but I do agree those handlers were being mean. When I was trained as a handler, I was told to only ever use the bull hook for light touches -- no whacks -- behind the knee along with "Move up!" to get Lisa moving, for example, and then similar touches and verbal commands for other things. The handler who had whacked her hard on the forehead that one night -- no blood was drawn -- to get her to her post was an old-school "carnie" (not purely circus) type of person who just happened to be nearby at the time and who I knew had some past experience with elephants. In contrast, there was another animal handler there with riding ponies who could use nothing more than verbal commands to get Lisa to roll over (side-to-side) a time or two as necessary whenever she had become constipated.

^^^^
I've enjoyed the circus on several occasions...but the last time I noticed I wasn't the only one...in fact this other party was enjoying the show more than anyone....who??? The Dogs These dogs were having a great time. You don't need to administer pain to train dogs....they've been companions of man for thousands and thousands of years.

It's not to say some people don't abuse dogs but overall I'd say dogs are doing better with people than without. Of course this may not satisfy a PETA person. But comparing dogs in the wild to domesticated life is a no-brainer...what intelligent dog, or cat, would choose tooth-and-claw vs. home life? Perhaps ask a gazelle if they would like to be eaten?

It's a nice thought to consider "The noble beast" in their natural surroundings, but the reality is that it will kill the animal much sooner than in a domesticated situation. The fantasies of PETA are not worth it.

Closer scrutiny of people entrusted with animals should be suitable.

Food is a great way to motivate an animal.We had a rooster that my son trained to crow for a bread crust.The rooster would eat the whole crust in one piece.He loved it and so did he.He lifed to a ripe old age stuffed with bread.

I saw part of a TV news segment last night with the Ringling closing being presented as a PETA victory, and then the reporters even went so far as to use a rigging failure as an example suggesting Ringling has been abusive of human performers. I am glad to know the Ringling elephants will no longer have to endure boxcar confinement for extended periods of time followed by mistreatment administered by punk handlers (or anyone at all), and it is fine with me that some people might find any and every circus completely disgusting. But to now suggest Ringling's voluntary closure driven by low attendance as driven by the absence of elephants might also represent some kind of victory on behalf of human performers allegedly "abused" by Ringling is to completely ignore the actual facts:

PETA is a PITA. A bunch of buzz-kills.

I did not get the impression PETA was making any allegation, just that the reporters were trying to capitalize by adding some ill-begotten drama of their own.

To me it's disappointing that it closed down, it's a staple in the history of my hometown. It was founded in the town I grew up and still live in.