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BeaArthur
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11 Feb 2016, 10:24 pm

beneficii wrote:
You know, I don't think CBT has really worked for me. One big reason has to do with my chameleon-like disposition. Basically, most CBT done on me insists on trying to take a can-do attitude toward things and getting me to express agreement. At that point, the psychotherapist thinks they've done their job. The problem is that when pressured enough I will seem to agree with something, because making such expression is unavoidable. If I think about it enough after the session, however, I'll note in my head how disappointed the psychotherapist is going to be. I will then wonder why I couldn't seem to express anymore my belief that such a thing was not doable.

I understand, now. My common practice is to tell the other person what they want to hear, so they are satisfied and I can go back to doing whatever I want to do. I think my last psychotherapist had caught onto that, when he said he thought I was going to be disabled for life, but it takes a while for new psychotherapists to get that.

It's good that you can identify that CBT is not helpful for you. You can and you should pass this information along to anyone you are seeing for therapy or counseling. It sounds like the number one thing you really need right now is a supportive relationship, to get hooked up with services you need and not to become any more discouraged.
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I guess that's what the world gets for trying to make people on the autism spectrum pass for neurotypical, while ignoring the executive functioning and other problems. As well, clinicians implementing CBT often pass on an unconscious message that any negative thinking, no matter how realistic, is not OK and must be discarded, which triggers my camouflage.
The executive functioning thing is key, and please try to remember to mention it to whoever you work with, including medical doctors. My daughter started going to a social worker in the county, who simply works on problems with her such as filling out applications or making phone calls. It amazes everyone that such a smart girl can get so stuck on those kinds of things.


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beneficii
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12 Feb 2016, 5:03 am

Unfortunate_Aspie_,

Thanks. Next time I go and they take my order, I will ask, 日本語でいいですか?


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beneficii
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13 Feb 2016, 3:23 am

I'm looking at a factor of my personality: Agreeableness (see Wikipedia). At first I was thinking that my level of agreeableness was intrinsically low, and that it only seemed to increase because of social skills training, but now I think it's actually intrinsically quite high, higher than you'd expect for someone diagnosed at different times with autism spectrum disorder and schizotypal personality disorder. I get this from some of my records:

When I was 5 1/2 years old, a child neurologist interviewing me said that I was "quite cooperative" "during one-to-one periods during the examination." When I was 8 1/2 years old, a school psychologist said I was "ostensibly cooperative" during the session, then went on to mention how my impairments showed. I guess his point was that though I presented myself as cooperative, the impairments kinda got in the way of that cooperation. That might be why I was often thought of as "difficult" as a child (and was put in special ed to boot!).

Generally, throughout my life, I have sought to attain harmony with my surroundings. I don't like starting trouble for no reason. Like when I go to grandma's, I ask the helpers to direct me as I help clean things up around the house, as I have difficulty doing the task by myself. That way, we can all get something out of my trip to grandma's each time.

I think the reason why I like to use my learned social skills is because it helps to show my agreeableness. Prior to that, it was often hard for me to show my agreeableness, I think.


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13 Feb 2016, 3:56 am

One time, at the gender center, I was at the group, and there was this man with obvious dyed blonde hair and a red dress (and terrible skin, I might add). He was constantly doing things with his legs that exposed himself. I told him to knock it off, but he kept doing it. Needless to say, I didn't stay much longer. Talk about autogynephilia. Jeez. Also, virtually everyone at those groups is white, even though the staff and the surrounding city are very diverse (in the city, whites are a plurality, but not a majority).

I don't see how I can acclimate to the people at the gender center when I am faced with behavior like this.


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16 Feb 2016, 1:20 am

As of today, I have not yet been approved for Medi-Cal. As the lawyer said, I should only lose it for January, because of the IRA withdrawals. I applied on December 9th for Medi-Cal, and it's supposed to only take 30-45 days. We called a couple weeks ago and they said they needed my income verification letter again, because the bozos at the county health office didn't correctly image the one I sent in on December effin' 9th. If I do not get my approval letter tomorrow, then I will call my state legislator and explain what has happened. Maybe they can apply some fire to the county health office's butts.

EDIT: And the county worker we spoke to last Monday said he'd get back to me by the end of the week. I ain't got no phone call from him. It's time to get the state legislator to put them through the ringer.


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Evam
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17 Feb 2016, 11:07 am

beneficii wrote:
You know, I don't think CBT has really worked for me. One big reason has to do with my chameleon-like disposition. Basically, most CBT done on me insists on trying to take a can-do attitude toward things and getting me to express agreement. At that point, the psychotherapist thinks they've done their job. The problem is that when pressured enough I will seem to agree with something, because making such expression is unavoidable. If I think about it enough after the session, however, I'll note in my head how disappointed the psychotherapist is going to be. I will then wonder why I couldn't seem to express anymore my belief that such a thing was not doable.

I understand, now. My common practice is to tell the other person what they want to hear, so they are satisfied and I can go back to doing whatever I want to do. I think my last psychotherapist had caught onto that, when he said he thought I was going to be disabled for life, but it takes a while for new psychotherapists to get that.

I guess that's what the world gets for trying to make people on the autism spectrum pass for neurotypical, while ignoring the executive functioning and other problems. As well, clinicians implementing CBT often pass on an unconscious message that any negative thinking, no matter how realistic, is not OK and must be discarded, which triggers my camouflage.


Chameleon-like that is also how Asperger-Goethe describes himself, and how others described him. I have had very negative experiences with people on the spectrum for that dispostion: it can be very confusing if someone professes one belief against one "expectational context" and the opposite belief with apparently the same degree of conviction against another expectational context. With NTs you can also see their motivation or lack of motivation quite clearly. But with people on the spectrum not or not that much. In extreme cases, and with bad habits setting in, this chameleon-like disposition leads to compulsive lying for every little advantage one might get.

At least in therapy it is important to delay answering. Aspergers need more time to answer , in particular with cognitively complex things like people things or emotions. It is mainly not the world that puts the pressure on you to pass as neurotypical, but yourself, It is YOU who dont want to appear as disabled and you who dont want to loose the benefits that are linked to being non-disabled. In fact, you DO need more time to think things through, and sometimes during your thinking process you get lost. Get that into your therapists head, even if it is painful for them, too, and insist on a one-minute reflection time before answering even a small question, plus the possibility to get a question retaken at the end of the session or to put it to the next meeting).

I think it should also help, if you try to express at least retrospectively your lack of motivation as clearly as possible.

As for therapists and their wrong attitude towards "negative thinking, no matter how realistic", I can understand your aversion against it very well. Only that some of the examples you gave were not realistic, and you gave these smalll incidences (lost coins, ramen order that went wrong) also far more concern than they deserved. Exaggeratedly negative thinking can drive someone (further) into a depression.



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17 Feb 2016, 1:07 pm

Hi Evam,

Maybe the ramen order, but the lost coins occurred within a greater context of "lapses" that have left me concerned. I've had these lapses for a while, but in the past few months, the lapses have become more frequent and have led me to lock my keys in the car with the car on, requiring me to call a locksmith; run red lights because I didn't know the light was red or even that the light was there; have to stop immediately because I didn't realize a pedestrian was there; and other problems. When I left the coins, I saw it as just one more in a long list of sometimes dangerous lapses that I have struggled to overcome.

Then again, if that context is not known to the listener, they may just assume that the speaker is just overreacting. This stuff is hard!

Nevertheless, I find the first part of your post interesting.


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17 Feb 2016, 3:09 pm

Those "lapses" have me concerned, too. I have to wonder if you are having small seizures. Please do mention this to your therapist or a doctor.


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17 Feb 2016, 11:28 pm

So I went today, and we hashed crap out for like 2 hours. He even called my dad and had a long conversation with him. I think we accomplished a lot. I found out I was approved for Medi-Cal today, as well. He talked a lot about schizotypal personality disorder and ADHD, and suggested the best thing for me would be a structured living environment with clear expectations.

He warned me about my lapses, that I might lose my license. I might have something like narcolepsy. If I'm sleepy, I will make efforts to sleep. Generally, when I nap, I wake up feeling refreshed and my mental performance is so much better. I just keep getting hit during the day with these periods of intense sleepiness, for lack of a better term, and I need to learn not to resist sleeping so much. I have learned to resist napping, thinking it's a character weakness, and because like at a work and school those were situations in which sleeping would get you in trouble, but I think the best thing now would be to sleep.


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BeaArthur
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18 Feb 2016, 1:36 am

That's great ... it sounds like this person is pretty down-to-brass-tacks. I hope you like working with him and will continue to try to be collaborative. I couldn't agree more about the value of naps. If you find yourself feeling guilty, just call them "power naps."

How is the hunt for stable shelter coming along?


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18 Feb 2016, 6:08 am

BeaArthur wrote:
That's great ... it sounds like this person is pretty down-to-brass-tacks. I hope you like working with him and will continue to try to be collaborative. I couldn't agree more about the value of naps. If you find yourself feeling guilty, just call them "power naps."

How is the hunt for stable shelter coming along?


Well, he says I need a structure environment. This, though, sounds like what a lot of people have said. They say it, I have some hope, nothing comes of it. I guess I need to push it every time I see them over and over again. He may say that I'm "perseverating" like he did yesterday, but damn I feel like if I don't bring it up over and over again nothing will ever happen. It'll be like April, and nothing would have happened.

Why the heck are services in California like this?


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kraftiekortie
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18 Feb 2016, 6:41 am

Because California feels that they are strapped for cash.

I hope you get the Medi-Cal soon.

How are you feeling today?



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21 Feb 2016, 2:05 am

I spoke to the psychiatrist in a 2-hour session. We hashed out a lot. He recommends I do a sleep study, and will write the referral letter if he needs to. For my mental health, it seemed he was considering the following diagnoses (DSM-IV):

depressive disorder NOS
autistic disorder
ADHD
gender identity disorder

He put me on hydroxyzine and bupropian, but I can't fill the latter because Medi-Cal won't pay for it. I will get a list of board & care places next week.

I am at my grandma's right now.


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21 Feb 2016, 8:35 am

Let the doctor know you are unable to get the buproprion. They may put you in touch with a patient assistance program where the manufacturer provides a substantial reduction in price for indigent people (broke, in other words). If that's not possible, they may select a different drug.

You've done a good thing in working with the psychiatrist on your problems. Although it's a long road, you are taking the right steps to get to your eventual goal. Do you have a follow-up appointment? If yes, be sure to keep it. If no, try to get one scheduled.

Good job!


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02 Mar 2016, 7:19 pm

It looks like I may have a roof over my head, and they are a family who are giving me room & board at a discount. I have trouble believing or understanding this. Unless they are an organization (public or private), your relatives, or a lover, I don't understand why you would open your house up to them.


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02 Mar 2016, 7:25 pm

Maybe they like you!

How did you manage to meet these people?