Page 3 of 3 [ 43 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

memesplice
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 Feb 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,072

09 Mar 2010, 1:38 pm

So maybe the question this raises is that whilst social class probably doesn't mean as much to us
if we want to communicate effectively then we have to be aware of it and its implications in the culture we are in.

I am going to spend £20.00 max and buy some secondhand middle class clothing from a charity shop for next time I go and see a GP. It seems a more effective strategy than trying to bring about a social revolution and a classless society.



Ambivalence
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 8 Nov 2008
Age: 48
Gender: Male
Posts: 3,613
Location: Peterlee (for Industry)

09 Mar 2010, 3:31 pm

Asmodeus wrote:
A lot of people in the north of the UK act like the industrial age isn't over yet.


We know damn well it's over, what with the missing shipyards, pits, steelworks and all.


_________________
No one has gone missing or died.

The year is still young.


Inventor
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 15 Feb 2007
Gender: Male
Posts: 6,014
Location: New Orleans

09 Mar 2010, 4:37 pm

In the USA, up to a hundred years ago, most were small farmers. They had a fairly limited world.

The educated class was very small. Few were rich,

Most education was within the family, and being able to speak the language, read, write, do math, in your head, was the mark of being acceptable.

Class evolved late, as robber barons amassed great wealth, through buying politicians. The 400 were families who mixed with each other, for the general population would have killed a few.

So it starts with an economic class, which others then aspire to, in fashion, about all they could afford, they could look like they might be worth something. Since everyone was looking for the same, they used each other.

Work was sweat shops and factories, but the pictures of the time show very well dressed wage slaves. Clothes were about all they could own.

Few were educated.

The class divisions were country hicks, who wore work clothes, had their Sunday best, and a very small world. Five years of readin, writin, and cypher were considered enough wasted time.

City people were a class above, they were moderns in industry. Seeing the photos of railroads being built, the men wore suits, white shirts, ties, to drive spikes.

Most lived in rented rooms, it was not an ownership group.

Blue collar comes from the skilled tradesmen. they ran production machines, or trains, and each adopted a uniform of work clothing to denote they were Skilled Labor. They made $2 a week more.

WWI and the Flu reduced the male population and sent it overseas.

This caused lower rent and higher wages, for young women. By the time th emen got back the women were wearing short hair, short skirts, and had some money saved up. The economy boomed, till 1929.

During the Depression, those in bread lines at soup kitchens were well dressed, even if their suit was a few years old.

America was basically two classes, those barely holding on, and those looking to start over.

Many of the rich were highly leveraged, and the crash lead to them jumping out of windows.

Post WWII, we were one big class, as only those who are well trained to kill can be.

The goal was still small, a little house, a car, dress well but not fancy.

War industries had broduced a lot of good technology, it was being applied to civilian use, it was a boom. By 1957 it lead to over production, By 1960 another war. Viet Nam. I was 15.

I think of myself as Technology Class, for it was great stuff, and by 18 I was running room sized IBM punchcard systems.

I see a watershed. Before, people used the technology that existed, my group was a market for Science Fiction. We looked forward.

Some sought education for technology, some for the money. We were the first broadly educated generation. We were fairly equal, even freeing Blacks, and Indians in 1974.

The rest was the era of Yuppi Scum tring anything to rise, which lead to the Savings and Loan looting, Worldcom, Enron, the Dotcom Bubble, and Goldman Sachs stealing the future.

Yuppi Scum wanted the Mercedes and the Armani, the big house, and they are our big losers now.

America is still one Class, the angry.



memesplice
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 Feb 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,072

09 Mar 2010, 4:44 pm

Ambivalence, pits, steelworks, heavy industry- if you had the chance would you put them all back
or offer something else? I worked in industry. It can be alienating , exploitative, dangerous , an lead to a shorter life expectancy. I'e been exposed to asbestos by unscrupulous employers . I have been royally screwed by contractors and banks, stood on top of scaffolding that defies known laws of physics, I have customers who would not evn make eye contact with me when they were perfectly neurologically capable of doing so. I am the only male generation in six to work with the sky over my head so I get it good . I'm not sure I would want any this for my kids.

I dislike out of control capitalism and globalization turbo- capitalism, but I don't think socialism
can mitigate its effects. What do you think its ability to limit capitalism are, and is there a lateral solution that incorporates some of its values and ideals? I would really like to go to Cuba and work
as something like a medical porter for a month to get a look at their set up.



Moog
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Feb 2010
Age: 47
Gender: Male
Posts: 17,671
Location: Untied Kingdom

09 Mar 2010, 5:28 pm

memesplice wrote:
So maybe the question this raises is that whilst social class probably doesn't mean as much to us
if we want to communicate effectively then we have to be aware of it and its implications in the culture we are in.

I am going to spend £20.00 max and buy some secondhand middle class clothing from a charity shop for next time I go and see a GP. It seems a more effective strategy than trying to bring about a social revolution and a classless society.


Be careful to ensure that the fact the clothes are second hand is not evident. I think that NTs believe that 2nd hand clothes are for the destitute, the mentally ill, and hippies. The real middle classes buy new.



Moog
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Feb 2010
Age: 47
Gender: Male
Posts: 17,671
Location: Untied Kingdom

09 Mar 2010, 5:39 pm

memesplice wrote:
Ambivalence, pits, steelworks, heavy industry- if you had the chance would you put them all back
or offer something else? I worked in industry. It can be alienating , exploitative, dangerous , an lead to a shorter life expectancy. I'e been exposed to asbestos by unscrupulous employers . I have been royally screwed by contractors and banks, stood on top of scaffolding that defies known laws of physics, I have customers who would not evn make eye contact with me when they were perfectly neurologically capable of doing so. I am the only male generation in six to work with the sky over my head so I get it good . I'm not sure I would want any this for my kids.

I dislike out of control capitalism and globalization turbo- capitalism, but I don't think socialism
can mitigate its effects. What do you think its ability to limit capitalism are, and is there a lateral solution that incorporates some of its values and ideals? I would really like to go to Cuba and work
as something like a medical porter for a month to get a look at their set up.


I feel that the mainstream idea of the industrial age seems to be that it was a wonderful golden age of techno-progress and rising living conditions. I think the reality is that people who once were self sufficient, self organizing, and self possessed got royally screwed. I definitely wouldn't want to bring it back.

I think the only limitations that will slow down turbo capitalism are energy related. Oil running out perhaps? I can see a kind of mental energy running out in the victims of this, the people around me. They seem like husks. But the globalists seem to find ways to animate these already dead shells and keep them moving with some kind of necromantic spell.

I can't see anyone willing the beast back down. I see it like a forest fire that's gotten way out of control, the only thing that can make it cease is it burning up all its fuel.



memesplice
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 Feb 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,072

09 Mar 2010, 5:42 pm

They usually have big paper price labels on them . Sometimes they are tied on with string. They are this big because many of our pensioners can't afford new clothes hence buy second hand and have poor eyesight. Our pensioners also buy woolly jumpers and fleeces because they can not really afford the fuel.

If I remove these labels it will be a most effective form of social subterfuge .



Moog
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 25 Feb 2010
Age: 47
Gender: Male
Posts: 17,671
Location: Untied Kingdom

09 Mar 2010, 5:50 pm

I don't think it's just as simple as the labels, which is why I mentioned it. NTs have some kind of six sense for this sort of thing. It was just some friendly advice. If you know what you're doing, then knock yourself out.



memesplice
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 Feb 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,072

09 Mar 2010, 5:52 pm

Quote:
I can see a kind of mental energy running out in the victims of this, the people around me. They seem like husks. But the globalists seem to find ways to animate these already dead shells and keep them moving with some kind of necromantic spell.


Love that language !


Bedtime for me Moog. Have HTML buttons to make in morning then I have go out and work.



memesplice
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 13 Feb 2010
Age: 62
Gender: Male
Posts: 1,072

09 Mar 2010, 5:53 pm

HMMM NT sixth sense. Had forgot about that. Maybe pass on all five , and wing it.



CockneyRebel
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 17 Jul 2004
Age: 51
Gender: Male
Posts: 121,245
Location: In my own little country

10 Mar 2010, 2:18 pm

All that matters is that a person is a nice, decent person. Class or money doesn't matter to me.


_________________
The Family Schlager