How common is AS?

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People with any type of Schizophrenia may have difficulty keeping friends and working. They may also have problems with anxiety, depression, and suicidal thoughts or behaviors. It seems that these symptoms have been cited by a lot of self-diagnosed Aspies, as well...


Fair enough. I can not dispute that assessment.

Childhood-onset schizophrenia is rare, according to the article. Probably not enough to account for more than a fraction of self-diagnoses. Although I suppose there could be a huge number of cases of childhood-onset schizophrenia without delusions or hallucinations that never get diagnosed to begin with.

How would you tell that it's not autism in that case? Try antipsychotics and see if they work?

I know you don't refer to all who are self-diagnosed, but do you really see these tendencies? Many would remain undiagnosed professionally for the known reasons. Why should people admit their self-diagnosis was wrong if there's no professional supervision? I see people here doubting their self-diagnosis, anyway. As for superstitious/religious thinking, IDK, perhaps a survey would point out the differences statistically. I don't believe in supernatural, but wouldn't exclude all forms of idealism on a strictly logical basis. I'm self-diagnosed and I would admit (if woefully) if I was wrong, and I've already hinted many times before I might not qualify for a diagnosis.

Why do you keep asking me? I am not a trained mental-health professional!! ! I can only observe and comment, not diagnose.

So, by observation, it seems that most people who self-diagnose have done so at or after an age when schizophrenia might begin to manifest (late teens). Clinical depression can be diagnosed in pre-adolescents, but it seems that most people that age do not self-diagnose.

Thus, there seems to be a correlation between the age of onset of schizophrenia and the age when people start to self-diagnose for AS.

Only a trained medical professional can say for sure.

Sorry, I am asking you because you're willing to talk about it and I am very interested. And I want to keep trying to falsify my own self-diagnosis so I can be really really sure. You hazarded a guess that the vast majority of self-diagnosers did not have any form of autism... that grabbed my attention and I wanted to know if you knew something I didn't that motivated your guess.



But those who do the research will then look at their early childhood history. If they don't find similar signs, they'll reject AS and keep looking, right?

Wayne, the best thing for you to do is seek a diagnosis from at least one trained mental-health professional. That is the only way that you will ever know for certain - don't let the poseurs convince you otherwise.

I think that statistic is far too high, I honestly believe its closer to 1 in 80.

I'd like to point out here that most trained mental health professionals still don't consider themselves qualified to diagnose Asperger's, especially in an adult. Maybe by going down the line with the DSM IV, but Tony Attwood has serious objections to the DSM IV criteria.

Hmm. From the CDC page at

http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/data.html

The link is to a journal article:

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5810a1.htm



I'd guess the page the OP is referencing is either using outdated information or is cherry-picking their stats due to some social/political agenda.

I also don't see how undiagnosed people have anything to do with incidence numbers. If you're no diagnosed you don't get counted as being ASD in the statisics.

There have been several scientific studies that suggest a significant overlap between schizotypal personality traits and Asperger traits.

Informal surveys done here on personality disorders show a strong schizotypal component as well, among those that are diagnosed and undiagnosed:

Here is one; there are several more that have done on this site that show a strong correlation between schizotypal traits and those that report themselves diagnosed and undiagnosed with Aspergers:

http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt130947.html


And here is an article from Scientific American that pursues the topic in more depth:

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/2011/08/17/a-call-for-new-measures-of-aspergers-and-schizotypy/


[url]The significant relationship found between unusual experiences and the details/patterns factor is also not all that revealing. Here are some items from the details/patterns section of the AQ: “I often notice small sounds when others do not”, “I tend to notice details that others do not”, and “I notice patterns in things all the time”. As my friend and colleague Marco Del Giudice pointed out to me, it’s very easy to imagine how a person with strong SPD traits would endorse these items, but for a completely different reason than why a person with strong AD traits would endorse the very same items!

Perhaps those with schizotypal traits endorse these items because they see mystical numerological connections between them, while the person with strong autistic-like traits is fascinated by numbers and patterns in a mathematical, very domain-specific sense. Therefore, the attention to details section of the AQ can measure either autistic-like traits or positive schizotypal traits, depending on whether you have autistic-like traits or positive schizotypal traits![/url]

Polls suggest that anywhere from 30 to 50 percent of the population believe in the supernatural; some polls also suggest that those that are less religious tend to believe in these type of things more than the religious, because they are not condoned in many religions. That in itself is no specific indication of mental illness, but it does relate to traits measured on schizotypal surveys.

From preconceived notions I was surprised to see so many people score highly in schizotypal traits, because of the stereotype of strictly logical minds among those with Aspergers.

Hearing sounds other people don't hear, and seeing patterns others don't notice, as suggested in the Scientific American article may play a part in this; it also very well could play a part of the beliefs in the supernatural, that have been deducted from what is personally judged as logical analysis of patterns seen from experience.

Whether or not the patterns seen as logical are truely logical is a matter of subjective analysis by each individual; it's not likely that someone is going to convince a person with Asperger's that something they see as logical is not logical unless conclusive evidence is provided to refute it. At least from what I have seen on this site.

If an individual with Aspergers has taken self surveys, and analyzed themselves to logically have Aspergers, it's not too surprising that they are sure of their analysis, in many cases, and can become quite annoyed, if one were to question their logic. In addition some, either can't afford a diagnosis, or are concerned that it might have a negative impact on employment prospects.

Whomever designed the registration question on this site, appears to have a good idea how people with Aspergers that consider themselves to have the condition, that aren't officially diagnosis, look at the issue.

Above and beyond that there is nothing stopping anyone from checking any option they care to, so the registration options as listed might provide the best method of determining who actually has a diagnosis as opposed to who doesn't.

If there were an option for who may or may not have aspergers, one could easily just check the diagnosed option. Listening to the feedback from people who have had their self diagnosis challenged, I think that likely might be their response to such a change in the registration process.

A lack seen in current studies on the prevalence of Aspergers in the population is that the studies are often restricted to children that are in school situations that are specific to specific educational needs of those with a diagnosis. These limitations have been acknowledged in some of the studies.

My understanding is that we don't have as reliable a measure of Aspergers in the population because of this factor, and also because a lack of awareness of the specific condition among adults, that may have escaped both awareness and diagnosis.

It seems reasonable that statistics for Aspergers may not be as accurate as those for the disorders on the spectrum that are caught by government studies, in the specific demographic that they study.

It could also be part of the reason why ASD's were screened 1 in 38 in the recent study done in South Korea. They attempted to screen everyone in the school setting, instead of relying on current diagnoses.

That's right. It goes farther than that, actually - the undiagnosed adult autistics in the population, be they happy or miserable, form a bulwark of resistance to any softening of the cultural hard line on autism. I work in an organisation that, for various reasons, has accumulated in some of its parts disproportionate numbers of seemingly autistic people. Highly qualified people, distinguished careers, but prone to leaving the transpersonal domain to others. If that one in a hundred holds true across the whole population, there's a lot of us. Making a world where it's OK to be us seems important.

There might be a misunderstanding in Fnords initial response to the Op, that was in reference to those reporting themselves as undiagnosed having Aspergers on this specific website.

The Op's reference was specific to the number of diagnosed cases of Aspergers as reported in the reference he offered as somewhere in the range of 1 in 10,000 and seemed surprised that the number was that low, in relation to the study you cite here, that is the actual reference for the 1 in 110, official current US government report of prevalence of all ASD's by the CDC supported study done in 2006.

My suggestion, is that the 1 in 10,000 number for Aspergers has not fully been captured in the US, because of the limitations of current research methods; which have been acknowledged by researchers.

Quote from the CDC study:



The study from the CDC acknowledged they used the same criteria as measures done in the Atlanta Metro Area. The most recent study from the Atlanta Metro Area, done in 1998, acknowledges the limitation of capturing the full incidence of Aspergers by focusing on assessments of those that need special educational services. I saw no mention of the limitation in the CDC supported study, but if they are using the same method, I don't see why there would not be the same limitation.

Of course, if they changed the method of the demographic, used, they would not have a reliable way of noting the increase of prevalence of total ASD's from 2002 to 2006.

I'm not sure where the OP's reference got the close to 1 in 10,000 number for Aspergers, but I have heard it before, and wondered too if it was really that rare. Current research methods may provide the answer. Improved research methods may provide a more accurate count.

It seems to me that the only way this could be accomplished is if enough money was afforded a study to accurately diagnosis a more diverse demographic like the study did in South Korea, but it would certainly be a costly endeavor if one were to ensure accurate diagnoses by qualified professionals, rather than screening tests.

When I self-diagnosed I had so many doubts that sometimes I could barely function due to trying to address and understand them. I avoided discussing the matter on a personal level with people who were not my therapist because my impression was that most people tend to hold fairly stereotyped views, or don't seem to care or be aware of the impact their words can have on someone else. I do not think that the questioning I did experience from just about anyone who was not directly involved in my mental health was actually helpful or useful, and served primarily to increase my stress levels, and most of their objections were due to elaborate assumptions about me based on extremely limited information.

When I did start bringing it up with friends, many of them said "this makes sense" or "I thought you might be."

I don't really see the point in questioning other people's self-dxes. There are so many reasons that anyone might have trouble getting diagnosed in the first place that I assume people who can access the care and want to will do so. In the US, however, getting diagnosed with an ASD can cost you your insurance, or future access to insurance. At least, it can until it is no longer legal to deny insurance based on pre-existing conditions. Also, getting a complete diagnosis can cost $1000 or more, which is not really affordable for a significant number of people, especially given how many autistic people tend to have difficulties with long-term employment. Also, something like 50,000,000 people in the US are uninsured, which goes back to the difficulties with long-term employment.

I do think if someone is self-dxed, they should be honest about it, but that's about as far as it goes. I am fairly sympathetic to the difficulties in getting a diagnosis and the possible costs of getting one.

Well, Asperger's syndrome is at the mild end and PDD-NOS is like almost autism but not having enough symptoms for a diagnoses even if it's all over the spectrum. If people without a diagnoses of autism still exhibit some traits than it makes sense that the mild end of the spectrum or the almost-autism type are the most commonly diagnosed forms.

As for self-diagnoses, many conditions mimic Asperger's: ADHD (especially ADHD-PI), Bipolar, dyslexia, dyspraxia, William's syndrome (to a degree), social anxiety, avoidant personality disorder, schizoid personality disorder, auditory processing disorder, sensory processing disorder (though you can have both together), etc.

Sometimes I wonder whether I could have something else then I tell myself to shut up because I've already been diagnosed twice and had an MRI just to be diagnosed with ADHD as well.
I know I'm autistic because I've been this way since I was a toddler. I have severe sensory issues and if my routine is disrupted I will lose control. And I have no desire to be around people, unless they are rock stars.

I was self dx'd with both autistic disorder and ADHD. I'm still self dx'd with some type of seizure disorder, I'm thinking temporal lobe because of the auditory and visual hallucinations and changes in behaviour. I try to keep that one to myself unless the situation calls for me to reveal it.

My feeling too, working in the government, about half the people there I worked with fit at least some areas of autistic traits; it's a structured environment; protected from discrimination, unlike the private domain; an excellent environment to thrive with autistic type traits.

Many of those worker bees that do the routine analytical work of government, I believe are individuals with autistic traits, at least from my experience. For all we know they may be the backbone of the country, able to exist well within that domain.

There are probably at least a hundred other examples if one looks close enough. Judging from personal experience in high school, there were at least 3 people, in my class, just those that stand out clearly in my mind of over 30 years ago, of 380, that would have easily met a diagnosis, I think. Possibly, significantly more, they were just the ones I was very familiar with, and can still remember clearly.

The South Korean Study may be closer to reality, but there are some that live with the traits, without it disabling them enough to need any type of assistance; I'm not sure we could ever have a full analysis of those that have the genetic propensity for Aspergers, that have learned to integrate themselves in society.

I am of the opinion the world is becoming more of a virtual world for most everyone. I'm not so sure it a place, that is okay to be us, for many people anymore, with or without autistic traits. It may even suit some with Autistic traits better than those without them, depending on their domain. The answer for that, I think, is well beyond the human paygrade.

That's an interesting question. In the US Autism is the most common ASD reported by the CDC research, the limitations in the identification of Aspergers in those children is limited by methodology, so we likely don't have an accurate count.

As far as I know, at least, in the US, there have not been studies done to determine the prevalence of actual diagnoses of Aspergers, or other ASD's, in the Adult population; i'm thinking the diagnoses may be lower than specific Autism Disorder because of awareness issues, but I guess without an accurate study, it would be difficult to determine, what the actual diagnosed numbers of people with Aspergers, both children and adults are.