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Autism caused by stomach bacteria??

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Sea Gull
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02 Jan 2012, 8:45 pm

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But everybody has bacteria in their stomach, but the majority of people are born NT.


The video relates to the use of antibiotics to cure other types of infections; such as reoccurring ear infections. The antibiotics work and cure the infections, but they also destroy healthy stomach bacteria in the process. The bacteria that remain in the stomach then breed out of control, many of these surviving bacteria release toxins which in larger proportions can affect the brain chemistry.

The video suggests the use of Vancomyocyn to kill these dangerous stomach bacteria then immediatly replace them with healthy, less dangerous replacement bacterial 'ecosystems' which then crowd out any of the surviving spores of the problematic variety.


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aspie48
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02 Jan 2012, 8:54 pm

Repent wrote:
Quote:
But everybody has bacteria in their stomach, but the majority of people are born NT.


The video relates to the use of antibiotics to cure other types of infections; such as reoccurring ear infections. The antibiotics work and cure the infections, but they also destroy healthy stomach bacteria in the process. The bacteria that remain in the stomach then breed out of control, many of these surviving bacteria release toxins which in larger proportions can affect the brain chemistry.

The video suggests the use of Vancomyocyn to kill these dangerous stomach bacteria then immediatly replace them with healthy, less dangerous replacement bacterial 'ecosystems' which then crowd out any of the surviving spores of the problematic variety.
bacteria do not have spores. that means this is unscientific because it is blatantly wrong.



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Sea Gull
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02 Jan 2012, 9:22 pm

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bacteria do not have spores. that means this is unscientific because it is blatantly wrong.


And your personal professional qualifications are...

If you're not a doctor or a research scientist, I will remain skeptical.


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DerStadtschutz
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02 Jan 2012, 10:01 pm

Well, he's right that bacteria doesn't have spores, that's something fungi have, but where did it mention spores in the first place? I musta missed that. Oh, and by the way, not having a piece of paper that says you know something doesn't mean you're full of s**t, and having said piece of paper doesn't mean you know anything either.



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02 Jan 2012, 10:32 pm

Autism is caused by differences in the brain, not too much bacteria in the stomach.


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Verdandi
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02 Jan 2012, 10:46 pm

Gnomey wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
Gnomey wrote:
I watched it and I thought it was a good theory for a specific type of autism which they mention. That being the regression kind where a child develops normally than suddenly regresses.


That sounds like it technically isn't autism, it sounds like the non-autistic PDD whose name I forgot. The other two are fragile-X and Rett Syndrome.


I might of been unclear, but I am referring to the more Classic Autism. In a lot of cases the child develops normally until 18 months and then suddenly they regress into autism. The kind where vaccines was blamed as the trigger for by some until recently.


One of these days I'm going to start a thread on the history of perceptions of autism.

The regression is likely due to autism's unusual brain development. The brain appeared to be developing neurotypically, but hit a point where the child could no longer function like that - suddenly, autism becomes obvious, but it was really there all along.

Anyway, childhood regression is not unknown, but it's most definitely not the classic definition of autism.



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Sea Gull
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02 Jan 2012, 11:20 pm

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Autism is caused by differences in the brain, not too much bacteria in the stomach.


Or by too much bad bacteria in the stomach, releasing too many neurotoxins to the body causing the differences in the brain. As the scientists in this video claim. (Page 1, initial post).


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Verdandi
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02 Jan 2012, 11:40 pm

Repent wrote:
Quote:
Autism is caused by differences in the brain, not too much bacteria in the stomach.


Or by too much bad bacteria in the stomach, releasing too many neurotoxins to the body causing the differences in the brain. As the scientists in this video claim. (Page 1, initial post).


It also claims a 600% increase in autism, when empirical research supports the fact that the rate has been constant, it's just diagnostic criteria that's resulted in more diagnoses.

As far as gastrointestinal symptoms, those are common with fibromyalgia as well, but there's no validated link to stomach bacteria. This is most likely snake oil and quackery at best.



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02 Jan 2012, 11:44 pm

Verdandi wrote:
Gnomey wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
Gnomey wrote:
I watched it and I thought it was a good theory for a specific type of autism which they mention. That being the regression kind where a child develops normally than suddenly regresses.


That sounds like it technically isn't autism, it sounds like the non-autistic PDD whose name I forgot. The other two are fragile-X and Rett Syndrome.


I might of been unclear, but I am referring to the more Classic Autism. In a lot of cases the child develops normally until 18 months and then suddenly they regress into autism. The kind where vaccines was blamed as the trigger for by some until recently.


One of these days I'm going to start a thread on the history of perceptions of autism.

The regression is likely due to autism's unusual brain development. The brain appeared to be developing neurotypically, but hit a point where the child could no longer function like that - suddenly, autism becomes obvious, but it was really there all along.

Anyway, childhood regression is not unknown, but it's most definitely not the classic definition of autism.

I regressed at around 2 years. My mum told me. You know how parents show you photos and say 'remember when you were like that?' She was showing me a photo of me as a baby smiling at the camera. And I've seen videos of myself at around two years where I'm just disinterested in everything.
Wasn't vaccinated too. Not until I was five.
I do believe I had the markers for autism, increased by womb trauma. And I think most of my siblings had the markers too, something just switched them on for me.

It's like these days when I have days where I seem almost neurotypical and even socialise a bit, but then I get tired both mentally and physically and if I don't take some time off I'll either explode into a meltdown or shutdown. Hmm, I'm beginning do develop my own theory out of this...


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02 Jan 2012, 11:53 pm

Repent wrote:
Quote:
bacteria do not have spores. that means this is unscientific because it is blatantly wrong.


And your personal professional qualifications are...

If you're not a doctor or a research scientist, I will remain skeptical.
I have enough qualifications. I passed my high school biology course last year. This is basic stuff man. Fungi have spores, bacteria do cell division. You don't need to be a scientist to know that. And btw... What are your qualifications may I ask?



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03 Jan 2012, 12:06 am

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What are your qualifications may I ask?


I'm a skeptical critical thinker, which is rare these days. If you watch the video, rather than make blind critism of me, midway through the video a researcher says 'During aggressive antibiotic treatment the bacteria release spores as a last ditch effort at survival, these spores can persist and no known antibiotic can destroy them'.

Dare I say it this is writ by career credentialed seasoned professionals who might have a better understanding of these problems than your high school science class does.

Please watch the full video before commenting further, this distracts from serious debate and contemplation. If we can improve our lot in life is it not worth doing?


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03 Jan 2012, 12:25 am

Repent wrote:
Quote:
What are your qualifications may I ask?


I'm a skeptical critical thinker, which is rare these days. If you watch the video, rather than make blind critism of me, midway through the video a researcher says 'During aggressive antibiotic treatment the bacteria release spores as a last ditch effort at survival, these spores can persist and no known antibiotic can destroy them'.

Dare I say it this is writ by career credentialed seasoned professionals who might have a better understanding of these problems than your high school science class does.

Please watch the full video before commenting further, this distracts from serious debate and contemplation. If we can improve our lot in life is it not worth doing?


The video isn't available, at least not to me.

As for spores, he might mean endospores, which bacteria create as a means to survive when they have nothing to eat or in an unfavorable environment.

The problem is that the 600% figure that the professionals are using to promote a sense of crisis in the story are already explained. There is no 600% increase in autism rates, simply an increase in diagnosis. The diagnostic criteria in that time period changed to make diagnosis with autism easier and added two new categories (PDD-NOS, AS). Any reasonable scientist would be unsurprised at an increase in diagnoses, and would actually question the lack of same. It's primarily people working from unfounded research and theories who try to promote the idea of an epidemic.

As a skeptic, you should be aware of existing research as well as the use of alarmist phrasing to promote questionable treatments and theories.



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03 Jan 2012, 12:52 am

Here's the Kilee Patchell-Evans Autism Research Group main page:

http://www.psychology.uwo.ca/autism/index.htm

Thought I'd add this for reference or to entice one's curiosity.


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Verdandi
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03 Jan 2012, 1:14 am

Thank you for the link.



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03 Jan 2012, 1:37 am

Repent wrote:
Quote:
What are your qualifications may I ask?


I'm a skeptical critical thinker, which is rare these days. If you watch the video, rather than make blind critism of me, midway through the video a researcher says 'During aggressive antibiotic treatment the bacteria release spores as a last ditch effort at survival, these spores can persist and no known antibiotic can destroy them'.

Dare I say it this is writ by career credentialed seasoned professionals who might have a better understanding of these problems than your high school science class does.

Please watch the full video before commenting further, this distracts from serious debate and contemplation. If we can improve our lot in life is it not worth doing?
Well I think most people on this forum are skeptical critical thinkers. I for examPle am skeptical of anything that seems fear mongering and uses false information. And btw. The laws of the universe don't suddenly change when you become a scientist. It's just a fact that bacteria divide to reproduce. What you are saying is like saying that humans plant seeds in the ground that pop up as babies when you water them. I'm sorry man. This article is just too far fetchEd for me to believe it.



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03 Jan 2012, 1:39 am

aspie48 wrote:
Well I think most people on this forum are skeptical critical thinkers. I for examPle am skeptical of anything that seems fear mongering and uses false information. And btw. The laws of the universe don't suddenly change when you become a scientist. It's just a fact that bacteria divide to reproduce. What you are saying is like saying that humans plant seeds in the ground that pop up as babies when you water them. I'm sorry man. This article is just too far fetchEd for me to believe it.


I haven't read enough to be sure, but bacteria do turn into spores for self-protection. It is a non-reproductive strategy, rather self-protection. Endospores can survive all kinds of things that will kill active bacteria, and it can stay like that for a long time.

Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endospore

Reproduction is still through fission.