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We all have some varying degree of "Autism"

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League_Girl
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07 Jan 2018, 12:13 pm

savavdpeas wrote:
We all have some varying degree of every "disorder", "condition", and "syndrome". What makes it any of those three things is the extremity of it. If someone has "Autism", they really have an extreme amount of it. What is "normal"?



I don't believe everyone or lot of people having traits of autism because that is like saying lot of people have traits of schizophrenia or a learning disability or a personality disorder.

Dr. Phil defines normal as having a behavior or quirks that don't make your life dysfunctional and don't hold you back making you unable to function.

If you have a diagnoses and you are functional and doing well, you're normal. Some people need diets or medicine to function in life to be normal. Some need a certain environment to be normal. If you learn coping mechanisms and how to manage your symptoms, you are normal.


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DancingQueen
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07 Jan 2018, 1:16 pm

I think there's just a line, everyone in the world is on it somewhere, the severity of autism increases as you go further down the line, at some point they have to make a cutoff point where everyone past that line is diagnosed with autism and everyone before it isn't. Same for mental illnesses and personality disorders. I don't think it's a black and white thing so no one is 100% "normal", we're all varying degrees of it. I do wonder where the average of the population is though. Obviously further towards the NT end than we are. I wonder who the most NT person in the world is.

That AQ test stumped me on the first question. "I prefer to do things with others rather than on my own." Well that depends what the thing is! I would prefer to travel with others, I would prefer to cook a meal by myself. I always have this trouble with personality tests, I seem to have the world's most split personality. :roll: (I don't believe in star signs but I actually am a Gemini :lol: )


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07 Jan 2018, 1:34 pm

League_Girl wrote:
If you have a diagnoses and you are functional and doing well, you're normal. Some people need diets or medicine to function in life to be normal. Some need a certain environment to be normal. If you learn coping mechanisms and how to manage your symptoms, you are normal.

The problem that I have with this is that coping mechanisms have their limitations. Often, things like stress cause coping mechanisms to fall apart. You could have someone who has no visible symptoms until demands exceed what the coping mechanisms can handle.

I could see people getting into really serious trouble here - someone learns to "pass" to the point that there are no visible signs most of the time, but then gets into a crazily stressful situation and suddenly has a severe meltdown in public that results in this person being arrested. Don't you think that having the diagnosis in this situation would be a good thing to help explain exactly what happened?

The definition of ASD requires that "Symptoms must cause clinically significant impairment in social, occupational, or important areas of current functioning". Based on this, although ASD is a lifelong condition, someone could actually be diagnosed, undiagnosed, and rediagnosed, not because their brain has changed in any way, but because the "important areas of current functioning" have changed.


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savavdpeas
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07 Jan 2018, 1:43 pm

DancingQueen wrote:
I think there's just a line, everyone in the world is on it somewhere, the severity of autism increases as you go further down the line, at some point they have to make a cutoff point where everyone past that line is diagnosed with autism and everyone before it isn't. Same for mental illnesses and personality disorders. I don't think it's a black and white thing so no one is 100% "normal", we're all varying degrees of it.


Agreed.

DancingQueen wrote:
I do wonder where the average of the population is though. Obviously further towards the NT end than we are. I wonder who the most NT person in the world is.


Perhaps someone who is extremely social? Lol.

DancingQueen wrote:
That AQ test stumped me on the first question. "I prefer to do things with others rather than on my own." Well that depends what the thing is! I would prefer to travel with others, I would prefer to cook a meal by myself. I always have this trouble with personality tests, I seem to have the world's most split personality. :roll: (I don't believe in star signs but I actually am a Gemini :lol: )


I'm a Gemini, too. :)



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07 Jan 2018, 1:52 pm

SplendidSnail wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
If you have a diagnoses and you are functional and doing well, you're normal. Some people need diets or medicine to function in life to be normal. Some need a certain environment to be normal. If you learn coping mechanisms and how to manage your symptoms, you are normal.

The problem that I have with this is that coping mechanisms have their limitations. Often, things like stress cause coping mechanisms to fall apart. You could have someone who has no visible symptoms until demands exceed what the coping mechanisms can handle.

I could see people getting into really serious trouble here - someone learns to "pass" to the point that there are no visible signs most of the time, but then gets into a crazily stressful situation and suddenly has a severe meltdown in public that results in this person being arrested. Don't you think that having the diagnosis in this situation would be a good thing to help explain exactly what happened?

The definition of ASD requires that "Symptoms must cause clinically significant impairment in social, occupational, or important areas of current functioning". Based on this, although ASD is a lifelong condition, someone could actually be diagnosed, undiagnosed, and rediagnosed, not because their brain has changed in any way, but because the "important areas of current functioning" have changed.



I never said "normal" people can't have a diagnoses. I used Dr. Phil's definition of normal. He isn't going to call you abnormal just because you have a disorder or a mental illness. He isn't going to call your behavior abnormal just because a piece of paper says it's not normal. Just as long as you are functioning, you are fine and you don't need to be fixed. Put it this way, someone with Bipolar may be doing well, then their pills need to be readjusted so at that time they are not normal so they need to get their pills readjusted so they can be "normal" again and if they went through a mania phase and got arrested and the officers became aware of their diagnoses, they put them in the hospital instead than jail. Same can go for autism there, there will be moments where you won't be normal and you just need to take care of what is causing the issue so you can function again.

Normal is a subjective term and must be used wisely and understand how it's being used to avoid getting offended and make sure others understand how you are using it to avoid causing offense. I believe people can slip in and out of being normal. Lot of people ask what is even normal and have a hard time defining it but I liked Dr. Phil's explanation on the word normal and what he calls normal and I thought it was pretty open and diversity.


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magz
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07 Jan 2018, 2:01 pm

I like dr Phil's definition.


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07 Jan 2018, 2:03 pm

savavdpeas wrote:
DancingQueen wrote:
I do wonder where the average of the population is though. Obviously further towards the NT end than we are. I wonder who the most NT person in the world is.


Perhaps someone who is extremely social? Lol.
They'd be likely to be extremely social, unless they had some other mental health problem that stopped them from being so I guess. It's animal nature to socialise, it's probably just people who struggle with it that don't like it.

savavdpeas wrote:
DancingQueen wrote:
That AQ test stumped me on the first question. "I prefer to do things with others rather than on my own." Well that depends what the thing is! I would prefer to travel with others, I would prefer to cook a meal by myself. I always have this trouble with personality tests, I seem to have the world's most split personality. :roll: (I don't believe in star signs but I actually am a Gemini :lol: )


I'm a Gemini, too. :)
*high five*


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savavdpeas
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07 Jan 2018, 2:22 pm

DancingQueen wrote:
savavdpeas wrote:
DancingQueen wrote:
I do wonder where the average of the population is though. Obviously further towards the NT end than we are. I wonder who the most NT person in the world is.


Perhaps someone who is extremely social? Lol.
They'd be likely to be extremely social, unless they had some other mental health problem that stopped them from being so I guess.


True. I was officially diagnosed Paranoid Schizophrenia by my psychiatrist. I really don't know what exactly it is that I have. I just see myself as not cut out to be social.

DancingQueen wrote:
. . . it's probably just people who struggle with it that don't like it.


Like me, lol.

DancingQueen wrote:
savavdpeas wrote:
DancingQueen wrote:
That AQ test stumped me on the first question. "I prefer to do things with others rather than on my own." Well that depends what the thing is! I would prefer to travel with others, I would prefer to cook a meal by myself. I always have this trouble with personality tests, I seem to have the world's most split personality. :roll: (I don't believe in star signs but I actually am a Gemini :lol: )


I'm a Gemini, too. :)


*high five*


*high five*



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07 Jan 2018, 2:25 pm

League_Girl wrote:
I never said "normal" people can't have a diagnoses. I used Dr. Phil's definition of normal. He isn't going to call you abnormal just because you have a disorder or a mental illness. He isn't going to call your behavior abnormal just because a piece of paper says it's not normal. Just as long as you are functioning, you are fine and you don't need to be fixed. Put it this way, someone with Bipolar may be doing well, then their pills need to be readjusted so at that time they are not normal so they need to get their pills readjusted so they can be "normal" again and if they went through a mania phase and got arrested and the officers became aware of their diagnoses, they put them in the hospital instead than jail. Same can go for autism there, there will be moments where you won't be normal and you just need to take care of what is causing the issue so you can function again.

Based on what you say, this seems like a really good definition of "Normal". Where can I find Dr. Phil's definition of normal?


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nephets
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07 Jan 2018, 2:37 pm

EzraS wrote:
To me that sounds like saying we all have a varying degree of cerebral palsy or epilepsy.

Indeed, you are either autistic or not. My son for example has definite autistic traits, but is very sociable (which pleases me greatly). He is not autistic. On the other hand, Autism gallops through my family, rather than runs. I am autistic and clearly different to my son in this. You are diagnosable or you are not.



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07 Jan 2018, 2:46 pm

nephets wrote:
EzraS wrote:
To me that sounds like saying we all have a varying degree of cerebral palsy or epilepsy.

Indeed, you are either autistic or not. My son for example has definite autistic traits, but is very sociable (which pleases me greatly). He is not autistic. On the other hand, Autism gallops through my family, rather than runs. I am autistic and clearly different to my son in this. You are diagnosable or you are not.


So, like DancingQueen said, there is a demarcation line to be made; which allows for an official diagnosis.



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07 Jan 2018, 3:09 pm

savavdpeas wrote:
nephets wrote:
EzraS wrote:
To me that sounds like saying we all have a varying degree of cerebral palsy or epilepsy.

Indeed, you are either autistic or not. My son for example has definite autistic traits, but is very sociable (which pleases me greatly). He is not autistic. On the other hand, Autism gallops through my family, rather than runs. I am autistic and clearly different to my son in this. You are diagnosable or you are not.


So, like DancingQueen said, there is a demarcation line to be made; which allows for an official diagnosis.

Yes, there will always be people on the border for diagnostic purposes. My son, for example is a few points on the standard ASD test below being diagnosable. When it affects your life significantly, you are autistic, if it does not, you are not.



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07 Jan 2018, 3:43 pm

SplendidSnail wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
I never said "normal" people can't have a diagnoses. I used Dr. Phil's definition of normal. He isn't going to call you abnormal just because you have a disorder or a mental illness. He isn't going to call your behavior abnormal just because a piece of paper says it's not normal. Just as long as you are functioning, you are fine and you don't need to be fixed. Put it this way, someone with Bipolar may be doing well, then their pills need to be readjusted so at that time they are not normal so they need to get their pills readjusted so they can be "normal" again and if they went through a mania phase and got arrested and the officers became aware of their diagnoses, they put them in the hospital instead than jail. Same can go for autism there, there will be moments where you won't be normal and you just need to take care of what is causing the issue so you can function again.

Based on what you say, this seems like a really good definition of "Normal". Where can I find Dr. Phil's definition of normal?



He said it on one of his shows. It was in the episode about this one young man being so obsessed about being a rock star and his parents picking up his slack and paying for his bills and stuff. He refused to get a job and other things and was kept waiting for a contract and stuff and for his songs to get famous and give him money. Did he really think that all singers make a living off their music? Lot of them have other jobs and do singing as a hobby and very few make it in the industry for fame. Even actors have other jobs because very few can make a living off of it. Then Normal was brought up and Dr. Phil was like "what is normal, that is what we have a hard time defining what normal is but I like to define normal as..." and then he said "this isn't normal what he is doing."

It would be like me refusing to get a job just because I write so I keep posting my stories to the publishing companies only for them to get rejected so I keep on writing other stories and submitting to different publishing companies thinking I will get lots of money for my work. That is pretty delusional there. Normal would be if I just continue working and write as a hobby and then submit it to publishing companies or posting them on Amazon Kindle but not expect to make a living from it and get thousands of dollars. This is a healthy way of pursuing your dream.


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07 Jan 2018, 3:45 pm

nephets wrote:
savavdpeas wrote:
nephets wrote:
EzraS wrote:
To me that sounds like saying we all have a varying degree of cerebral palsy or epilepsy.

Indeed, you are either autistic or not. My son for example has definite autistic traits, but is very sociable (which pleases me greatly). He is not autistic. On the other hand, Autism gallops through my family, rather than runs. I am autistic and clearly different to my son in this. You are diagnosable or you are not.


So, like DancingQueen said, there is a demarcation line to be made; which allows for an official diagnosis.

Yes, there will always be people on the border for diagnostic purposes. My son, for example is a few points on the standard ASD test below being diagnosable. When it affects your life significantly, you are autistic, if it does not, you are not.



I wonder what about people out there that do not have enough for a diagnoses but have symptoms that are significant causing them impairments?


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07 Jan 2018, 4:25 pm

League_Girl wrote:
nephets wrote:
savavdpeas wrote:
nephets wrote:
EzraS wrote:
To me that sounds like saying we all have a varying degree of cerebral palsy or epilepsy.

Indeed, you are either autistic or not. My son for example has definite autistic traits, but is very sociable (which pleases me greatly). He is not autistic. On the other hand, Autism gallops through my family, rather than runs. I am autistic and clearly different to my son in this. You are diagnosable or you are not.


So, like DancingQueen said, there is a demarcation line to be made; which allows for an official diagnosis.

Yes, there will always be people on the border for diagnostic purposes. My son, for example is a few points on the standard ASD test below being diagnosable. When it affects your life significantly, you are autistic, if it does not, you are not.



I wonder what about people out there that do not have enough for a diagnoses but have symptoms that are significant causing them impairments?

Here <waving>.
Coping until you fall apart and then misdiagnosed.


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07 Jan 2018, 5:26 pm

magz wrote:
League_Girl wrote:
nephets wrote:
savavdpeas wrote:
nephets wrote:
EzraS wrote:
To me that sounds like saying we all have a varying degree of cerebral palsy or epilepsy.

Indeed, you are either autistic or not. My son for example has definite autistic traits, but is very sociable (which pleases me greatly). He is not autistic. On the other hand, Autism gallops through my family, rather than runs. I am autistic and clearly different to my son in this. You are diagnosable or you are not.


So, like DancingQueen said, there is a demarcation line to be made; which allows for an official diagnosis.

Yes, there will always be people on the border for diagnostic purposes. My son, for example is a few points on the standard ASD test below being diagnosable. When it affects your life significantly, you are autistic, if it does not, you are not.



I wonder what about people out there that do not have enough for a diagnoses but have symptoms that are significant causing them impairments?

Here <waving>.
Coping until you fall apart and then misdiagnosed.



What misdiagnosis were you given?


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