Turning age 18 shouldn't change everything

Post Reply New Topic

IdahoRose, I'm surprised by the negative comments, too. It's just a recent development in society that we don't have extended families who stuck around and helped each other enhance our strengths and help us through our weaknesses. Now we're considered wrong because family members like being around each other?

Children who have grown and married have asked their parents for advice for many generations. 18 is NOT a magic number for maturity.

I'm with OregonBecky. If her son is using the extra time to get ready, kudos for him. The important point is to do it right, not by age blah-blah.

My mother was never wrong either, and she wrecked me.

I hope that you are capable of the insights that she fought off.

Uh, no.

If you can be quite certain that you are being allowed to be an adult, power to you. My mother fought it long after I was 21 years of age. She withheld help that would have been actually useful and forced "help" on me that was destructive. It was rather like "you can work and earn a living but I know you will mess it up and just to make sure you can first walk off a cliff and try to work as a bag of broken bones." Plus she will suck the life out of me every chance she gets.

I don't know if Becky is encouraging independence, but there is one way to definitely destroy a person on his way to adulthood. Attack him through his vices even when he is old enough to be legal. Make him aware that if he "messes up" it will all collapse around him. "Direct" his life choices. Even tell him that he's "not ready" to be out on his own. I live like this. I'm 47.

I'm sorry about your mother. Sometimes I see parents who make me wonder if they're trying to mess up their kids on purpose so that they'll never be alone.

I'm friends with people who had experiences like yours. I don't want to get into details about how I was raised but I learned a lot of what NOT to do.

As for my son, he is my greatest teacher, along with my other son and daughter. I love watching him become more independent. I need him to be independent because I have a profoundly autistic daughter who needs me and will always need me. Btw, he has kept is cool when dealing with her seizures. He's learned how to not freak out when she has her gigantic super meltdowns. He's had a lot on his plate to handle but he continues to progress.

I don't think there is an exact age, and you're doing what you need to do. But in the real world, parents of kids in general are not doing that. They are hovering over their kids to the point they are going to the first day of classes at college, and going to job interviews to negotiate terms.

We had a series of lectures that dealt with these issues and how they impact the world of academia and the world of work. If I hadn't had experience dealing with some of these issues, I would have called bs. My concern is that there are people trying to get their kids through college and into jobs without the kid (who is adult age at this point) having to learn how to do it herself. I'm not just talking about AS kids-I talking about most kids. It seems the main concern is the amount of pain it would involve, and the parent is trying to make it easier, and that somehow their kid needs the assist. I'm talking about kids in general, so I'm not even talking just about AS kids.

There is no magical age, but I think we have lowered our expectations of young people's ability, whether it's to learn how to navigate a collegiate setting or a social one. Some need to get to a certain place to do that, and that's all right. There's a lot of things that need to be done better in the schools and in therapy, but at the same time we shouldn't throw the baby out with the bath water. We do need to be more flexible in when education happens, and how people are trained for work, but we need to challenge ourselves as well. For some people it's too easy to become complacent .

And while it's nice to think the child will leave the nest when ready, if the parents don't encourage that independence, it doesn't happen. Granted, my anecdotal experience isn't advanced, yet studies are showing that if independence isn't planned for, it doesn't happen.

I'm surprised my post was considered negative. I wasn't slamming anyone, just noting what I've experienced in dealing with parents of students, and the people in my own life, not to mention the workshops and lectures I've attended addressing the issues. If there's a possibility for independence, it should be encouraged, and you're doing it. Soo....?

If people feel extended families are the way to go, good for you. It doesn't work any better, but that's my opinion, and I'm too Aspie to think it a good thing for most people. Extended families tend to put the burden and limitations on women, AFAICS.

Hm. Interesting responses.

R.

You got that one right.



I know what you mean there.

It's tricky though, isn't it? Knowing when to help and when not to? Or just how much to provide? As a child I suffered through a lot. My dad had died when I was just 7 and I worked the fields to make money to survive, starting at 13 years old. I learned some things from those experiences that are very hard to teach my own children without subjecting them to similar suffering, as well. And no child should have to experience that kind of life. It's not right. Not if you don't have to, anyway. Yet they are missing something important inside that will take them much, much longer to acquire, too, not going through those experiences. But as I said, it is wrong to subject them to something like that -- it's risky, for one thing; and secondly, each person has their own responses to experiences like those and while I may have gotten through the similar ones with values I value now, others may not. In fact, others might learn entirely different messages, altogether. If they survive, of course.

It's just not an easy road. You are always questioning yourself.

In the case of AS (I'm Oregon Becky's husband and we have two children diagnosed autistic, one profound, one we expect to acquire sufficient skills to cope on his own, with some additional time to develop them), the questions are sometimes easier and sometimes even harder. Our daughter is profound and I don't _ever_ expect to see her living on her own, even in an assisted living situation. She operates at about 5 yrs old and has most of her 23 years of life. So that is easy, in this sense. We just need her to live safely and with joy and friends who like her for who she actually is, but in a contained environment for the rest of her life. End of story. Hard to achieve in practice, but the concept is easy and doesn't require wrestling whether or not we are stunting her future by doing too much for her. Our son is another story and we not only question ourselves about each step, but we also talk things over with other professionals and practitioners of various kinds, literally each and every month if not more often. So we are getting feedback from 3rd party outsiders about what we can and should do, etc. And those things are probably harder to judge about which way to better go. He contributes to the decisions in his own way, but he is pretty much unable to express opinions so we have to take it slowly with him to gain his own perspectives here and integrate them into our other discussions.

I think it's important that we keep an active discussion like this. One can certainly interfere, not just by taking over so to speak but also by causing our own children to begin to believe things we say about them in or near their presence that affects their own sense of self and may set their own sights too low and hinder their willingness to press on when they could have succeeded and from that gained a measure of pride in themselves, too, that can become the base for more to come.

In my own childhood, my mom told me repeatedly that I couldn't sing. (She sang well.) I believed her and stopped even considering the idea of ever trying. In the end, I think this was a self-fulfilling expectation she laid on me and that I could very well have learned to sing just as well, if I'd put myself up to it. But she put me down and I believed her and didn't work at it, at all. So yes, that's a problem. Adults creating a self-fulfilling reality out of mere assertions when much better could have been the result, instead. In this singing case, Oregon Becky now pays the price, by the way. She loves to sing and misses something from me because of all this. The small consolation here is that I can play some piano, at least.

Jon

I say that the age each child becomes able to care for themselves, or should be encouraged to stretch their neck out and see if it gets chopped off is individual to each child. Some autistic children will never leave the house. some could probably leave earlier and it would be better than staying with their parents.

I can tell you. I have a mother who continually tries to get me to move back in with her. Even though she lives half a state away and i am in the middle of my junior year in college. I haven't lived with her for 5 years now. Everytime she brings it up it hurts because it is like she doesn't think i can make it. Two of those years I lived in my own apartment, by myself, and lookit i am still alive!

Admittedly the apartment got cleaned about once every two months and my credit isn't that good, but i am learning. If i had been specifically taught about finances beyond a banking account before I left the house my credit wouldn't be as bad.

the once you turn 18 thing is all cultural in america, i think its funny that as soon as someone hits that age everyone automatically assumes someone is somehow different than they were the day before they turned 18. also autism does grow up most people probably dont relise this and think it dissapears or something once someone turns 18

Puberty means nothing when it comes to mental development. The human prefrontal cotex (thought to be the seat of judgement) doesn't finish developing until the mid twenties and is in the highest state of flux during adolescence until then. In cultures than put importance on education first, family and work later, children are given more time. In cultures where work is expected as soon as you can hold yourself upright and creating a family is expected after puberty, well those kids don't have much deciding freedom either. They may be doing adult things, but their lives are still being arranged by the real adults.

Now kids that are simply allowed to do whatever thay want end up getting eachother pregnant, hooked on drugs or killed. If you've ever seen a 15 or 16 year old try to be a mom, and see how it effects mom and child later in life, I don't know how you can suggest that's a good thing. As for drinking, other cultures that let kids drink don't stress early driving. They have country roads, and in the bigger cities, people generally take the metro or bus to get around. I live next to a highschool, and I know how stupidly kids can drive. Teenagers are supposed to be the best drivers, but a developmentally chaotic prefrontal cortex makes them the worst drivers. We definately don't need more drunk kids driving everywhere, there's already enough as it is. Teens need guidance and rules for everyones well being. That's all there is to it.

As far as adults living at home, I see no harm in it as long as the parents are staying out of their work and school responsiblities, and as long as they have responsiblities for that matter. I think with the current direction of the economy, people are going to have to learn to be less judgemental about families sticking together. It's really none of their business anyway. If an adult thinks their parents are stifling them and preventing them from growing and having a life, then for them that can be incentive to leave. Otherwise I've seen countless examples of people turning out happy and successful after staying at home past 18. It's really not a big deal. As an aspie, life is going to be a challenge regardless of where you live, but having a supportive and loving family to go home to can give them strength to keep moving that they might not have had. Who's to say then what's healthy for every individual?

I think this is truer than many realize, just yet. With the high costs today of buying property to live and the increasing costs of energy (which will only continue to rise, really) and food, as well, we may very well need to return to earlier styles of living. Not in some retro-way. But simply because we cannot continue to afford the high cost of dividing up people into the smallest possible living unit -- the single family. That tends to maximize consumption and is the most expensive way to live -- things must be purchased in tiny, packaged units at higher cost; more necessary skills must be purchased externally because no single family can contain all the skills needed for daily living in this excessively complex world (welding, wood working, roof repair, home maintenance, water management, yard maintenance, etc., are often bought instead of acquired skills.) Also, broken into these tiny units, we need to buy more cars. I need two here -- one for general use and the second one as a backup for emergencies that may occur (my daughter has grand mal seizures, for example, and may need to be rushed to the hospital if she breaks something... but really, backup emergency use is a very common reason for a second car.) In larger family units, the per-capita number of cars is reduced and this reduces insurance outlays, etc.

I believe that economic pressures and realities will gradually force more and more people to consider what you are talking about. Perhaps even, some of us, into more communal living situations or at least loose multi-family arrangements where everyone's fortunes are a little more closely allied but where that also becomes their strengths in dealing with the world.

Land isn't growing on trees, neither is the bulk of our energy supplies which are mostly "in the ground" and rapidly depleting as we speak, and population increases remain on an exponential curve and show little sign of stabilizing (let alone the fact that no civilization has ever found a stable way of coping with the shifts in age distribution of their populations should they hold a steady population.) A change in lifestyle may be in the cards sooner than later.

Jon

I would like to second that of you being a great parent! My mother is allowing to stay as long as i can, i have extreme problems with self help skills, and im so immature, that its very hard for me to even think about moving out yet, and I'll be 23 in two weeks. My brother who has adhd, is going to be 25 in 3 weeks, and still lives home. Now my nt bf moved in with us, and my mother opened her house to him, because she knows sometimes pushing a kid out of a nest isnt always the best.

I'm so thankful i can still live home, my brain can barely handle simple transitions in life, like all of a sudden now my bf is living in my house, and its driving my tourettes nuts, which is driving my autism off the roof, but, i know eventually if i want to marry this guy, i need to learn to have him around constantly. I think its better he moved in here, rather then we move out together in an apt, because i'm not ready for that. To some ppl it looks like my mother is babying us, or keeping us from our goals, and dreams, but its defintely not like that at all. Some parents just know best for their children, and understand that sometimes kicking them out, pushing them to leave isnt always the best decision!

Age1600, since you and your brother seem to both be on the sectrum, I'm guessing, maybe your mother is, tioo. If she's like me, then, she's sparked by being around her hyper=aware kids. My son is a lot of fun to be around. For instance, when I say something, often, he finds the funniest appropriate puns.

Right now, I'm finishing up the last details for a group I'm starting at my son's college at the end of February that's for parents and spectrum adults to get together and figure out real life stuff. I think it will be a fun group. At the meetings, it's okay to sit in the corner and be shy and invisible, play quiet stratagy games while listening, draw pictures, work on puzzles, tune out when someone (like me) doesn't know when to shut up. I don't know of anything like this anywhere else but, we all have so much the same problems. I'll leave each meeting with some homework, checking into whatever we talked about that the meetings.

My son would probably enjoy the easy low key socialization while listening and maybe, he'll speak up by the fourth meeting. We'll see how this goes. I didn't realize that I had it in me to get something like this going but I'm doing it. My son's college is being so supportive, too.

My brother is not on the spectrum, he just has adhd. Were both adopted also, both born in columbia, south america. Hes my half brother. My mother is all nt, except for the narcolepsy part, shes pretty much normal as can be hahaha.

A cool NT mother would be great because I think NT's keep track of household things better than spectrum people.

My husband and I decided that both of us really need an NT wife.