The "social skills" dellusion

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Social skills are little more than BS skills. Smile. Nod. Feign interest. Follow the script. Is it any wonder those who are most expert in social skills are often successful con artists? Lack of social skills is seen as a far greater crime than being plausibly deceitful.

LOL! I completely agree! My mother is one of the most social people I know. She is well-liked and very nice in public. My whole life, I've watched her be syrupy sweet and nice to people in public only to trash them the minute they are out of earshot. She's a duplicitous beyotch as far as I'm concerned. Faking who you are is considered social skills. I do have decent social skills and people are shocked to learn that I am on the spectrum. But dealing with people wears me out fast. I get so stressed, I have to concentrate hard on making eye contact, on not saying what I really think, and playing nice. I hate it.

One of my biggest problems with social skills is that I come off as too nice or too flirty. I've had many people misunderstand my intentions. I had a neighbor who practically stalked me for over a year because she seemed to think I wanted to be her best friend. I couldn't and still can't stand this gal or her mosterous bratty children. LOL! We have a cordial relationship and I would consider her my "friend" but I really am annoyed by her to the extreme and I don't allow my kids to play with her kids because they are undisciplined, crazy, monsters who literally climb the walls of her house. WE are neighbors though and our kids will go to the same schools and we will be living across the street from each other for a LONG time- she's got no plans to ever move and neither do we.

I agree with what you're saying - that Aspies simply can't 'relate' as opposed to managing to learn a few social tips and tricks. However, showing interest in what the other person says/appreciation, et al, has won me a friend or two in my time. The kind of people I attract are those who like to talk incessantly while I nod along agreeably. I've always been called a 'good listener,' but when I start talking, that's when the trouble starts. My dad was a car salesman for 30+ years and I could never understand how he could just walk up to someone and start talking. Next thing you know, he'd end up shaking their hand and selling them a car. I always marveled as his ability to talk people into doing stuff or buying stuff. It was second nature to him. I, unfortunately, did not inherit the Car Salesman gene. I do not have a 'sales-oriented' bone in my body. It's hard for me to show interest in what other people are saying and I have to force myself to pay attention. I believe you're right in that there's some unspoken connection going on between two 'normal' people socially. Whatever that is, I don't have it and try as I might, I can't learn it. I did learn one thing from my dad, though, if you want to talk to someone and keep their attention on you, then ask them questions about themselves. Everyone - and that means Aspies included - LOVES to talk about themselves above everything else. If you keep asking questions (as long as they're not too personal or otherwise crossing a 'line') they'll think you value what they say. People are always connecting with others who seem to value them.

There aren't too many people I know in real life that I actually want to have a long conversation with, but the ones that do like to go on and on about their problems to me. It gets tiresome, trying to remember all the rules of conversation.

There are absolutely such things as social skills, some of which can be learned, some not. I learned over many years to make inane small talk with strangers to put them at ease (doesn't make me feel any better, but they're less likely to perceive me as a rude ass than if I stand there avoiding eye contact and ignoring them). Little things like a firm handshake grip and eye contact itself are also learned behaviors, especially for Aspies. On the other hand, I've lost many a job because I simply don't have the ass-kiss gene. Doesn't come naturally, can't seem to learn it, don't really want to, but I'd have gone a lot farther if I had. I also have never learned to show a great deal of interest in the things that seem to make others happy and excited, thus I avoid their get-togethers and activities and they think I'm a snob. On the other hand, I have learned to say "Oh my God, I'm sorry for your loss" when someone loses a loved one, even if I don't really give a rat's ass.

They do exist, some can be learned, others not so much. But they are valuable, even if ocassionally pesky and annoying. Still, I hate those moments when an NT makes a statement and then stares at me, and I know theyr'e expecting some specific reaction or gesture of comfort and I'm at a total loss as to what the hell they want me to do. I hate being made responsible for the emotional well-being of another person. (one of my mantras)

My father is like this. As a result, I have learned that even though it isn't naturally within me, I can "work people" as needed in situations that require it. The thing is I need "scripts". Put me in some random social situation where small talk is going on and I am painfully uncomfortable. Dealing with people, even ones I like and enjoy being around, wears me out too. I need major down time afterward.

I don't think that people expect learning social skills to diminish the AS. I don't think that's the goal at all.

However, learning some of the BS stuff can make life a little easier. People really think it's weird if you can't small talk a little. Consequently, my husband says that I have become the master of the queue conversation. I actually use it to practice. You're waiting in line, probably unreasonably long for whatever reason, and you are bored out of your skull. You don't know these people usually and you thus, have nothing invested in the entire interaction, and likely, you'll never see these people again. Bonus, because if you bodge it, then no one cares and if those people think you're weird, who cares?

It's everything I want in interacting with others. Little commitment, and bonus no reason to be involved after the interaction.

I think the goal of learning social skills is mainly to avoid the stress that social interactions cause.

Learning social skills is a good idea, nobody would disagree with that. It takes time, effort and plenty of false starts but it does reap the benefits in the end. However, I see your point that it's hard to impossible for somebody on the Autistic Spectrum to ever master the whole range of social cues and unspoken etiquette that comes to most people naturally.

We will always make blunders. We will always say the wrong thing at the wrong time. We will always do something that's inadvertently funny. But being able to fake some of the pointless social conventions is much better than not even bothering.

Not to mention that how we aspies learn "social skills" is also problematic.

When I applied the rules of my assertiveness course - I was called rebellious.

When I applied what I learned about active listening - I became the dump for everyone's mindless blabber. As someone mentioned here above.

When I applied the teachings about empathy/sympathy/consideration for others - I became everyone's doormat.

"Social skills" for aspies is like car-driving for infants. The technical mastery of the steps is not enough. You still need judgement about how to apply it, and it's precisely that judgement what we lack.

I once met a guy who was into self-improvement and making friends. His "social skills" were so obviously classroom-acquired, so blatantly artificial, that I dreaded being like him.

He'd go through all the perfect social motions, which made him all the more ghostly. He'd respond the perfectly appropriate thing at each of my comments, but he lacked any spontaneous utterings of his own. He was like a "social skills" machine. It made me cringe just to interact with him briefly and matter-of-factly over the phone.

He was obviously a victim of the consumer trap of "learning social skills".

I know how to socialize [how others do]; this doesn't mean I actually can socialize [how others do].

Even if I were "high-functioning" (which is funny, because I am), and I could put what I've observed into use, I'd only be mimicking what I've seen, throw a new situation at me I haven't seen played out before and I'll falter in an instant, nor will I be able to recover from said falter.

I did this mimicking back in my "high-functioning" days, it was false, and it wasn't how I innately socialize.

My socialization equates to speaking when I have something meaningful [to me] to say, and that's it.

Hmm, I see both sides of the argument.

There is a lot to social interaction that can't be learned. Even if we were given a unassailable chart of what each facial expression and body movement meant, it wouldn't help us because we don't see it. It would be like carrying on a conversation where you had to stop, translate what was said into your language, formulate a reply, and translate it back. And just as rife for errors.

However, there are a lot of habits that can be developed, and a lot of habits that can be fixed. For example, I now know that the surest way to alienate people is to bring every conversation around to myself or some story of mine that relates to the conversation. To me, that was relating to people, but to people, that's me trying to run the conversation. Similarly, I also have learned some of the null-pointers that NTs use in conversation... ways to say "I acknowledge that you have spoken and that I have digested it. But I have nothing specific to say in response. Do go on."

And I must agree to the point that some of the "rules" of social interaction aren't. Frankly, I think some of them are cultural issues that need to be fixed for their own sake-- when a woman says "no" she doesn't always mean no. And might get offended if you think she does. I choose to err on the side of caution, but that cost me a lot. And to be fair, this drives NTs up the wall too.

And then there's the fact that not all of the "rules" cover interpersonal relationships with Aspies. For example, just about any woman I am with is going to become insanely possessive. (And when I say "insanely" I mean it.) I don't know why, but after years of experience, I know this to be true. It doesn't even make any damned sense, because I'm not much of a catch AND I generally suck at fishing.

But by and large, I have to say that there is some stuff that can, and should be learned, both for professional and personal use.

IMO, social skills can be learn't and applied to every day social interactions. The thing is, if you are not born with the ability to read people/apply social skills naturally, they will NEVER be natural.
I know of some people who say that certain therapies can "train your brain" to make social interaction more natural, but I believe that it will never be natural, although possible to do on a concious level.
IMO, it's like training a dog to walk on their hind legs. Once they've learn't, they practise and as time goes along, it appears to get easier for them. However, no matter how much they train/practise this ability, it will always be done in concious thought...thinking of what to do next and how to do it will be unavoidable.

All very well said and totally agree with you.

Damned if you do and damned if you don't at times isn't it.

Wow. Brilliantly put.

Yes all of this is true, sadly, but not to the same degree for everyone.



True, but it's the old saw about sincerity--- if you can fake it, you've got it made.