what's the difference between INTJ and AS?

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TPE2
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03 Mar 2009, 12:40 pm

Hector wrote:
That said the Myers-Briggs type indicators are, as far as I can tell, pseudoscientific rubbish.


Probaby (some alternative tyologies, like the LeSenne-Bergier characters, seems more scientific).

But, it was the concept of "Asperger Syndrome" (and the majority of psychiatric and neurologic diagnosis) itself much scientific also? After all, there is any scientifical expriment that can be made to prove or disprove the real existence of AS?

More exactly - if AS is a false theory, there is any way to prove that is false?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falsifiability



TPE2
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03 Mar 2009, 12:45 pm

And "Introvert iNtuitive" types are probably also over-represented in internet discussion foruns.


Then, probably there was less INTJ (and INTP) aspies than what appears in these forum (or similar foruns).



starvingartist
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03 Mar 2009, 12:50 pm

whitetiger wrote:
I'm INFP. I still have AS. I'm barely a P, could be a J if I'd answered one or more questions differently. I'm an F because I think logically but don't always act logically.. sometimes I'm impulsive.


i would say the same--i am a logical person but my feelings are still quite powerful and can take the helm often when it comes to decision making. i wonder if there is a correlation between INF- types and the combination of autism and bipolar disorder? (i've noticed you've mentioned in other posts that you're bipolar--i am, too, as well as having AS)



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03 Mar 2009, 1:31 pm

I always thought I was ISTJ, but I took another MB test with my Psychologist and it turns out I'm INTJ.

I guess AS is much like being an INTJ minus the social skills and communication abilities that are inherent to 'normal' folks.


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01 Jul 2009, 3:16 pm

Maybe an INTJ personality is more likely to emerge as a result of the neurological differences of autism? What makes someone INTJ yet not autistic? Is it the severity alone?

Is a personality type anything more than neurological differences? It seems to me that the same neurological differences could manifest themselves as AS, an INTJ personality, both, just one, or maybe even neither.


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01 Jul 2009, 3:33 pm

Definitely different yet correlated. I am an INTP, yet as neurotypical as can be - my aspie quiz scores are lower (more neurotypical) than almost anyone I'd ever seen, Aspie or NT, and I show no signs of things like trouble reading body language, NLD features like motor-skills problems, special talents and ultra-intense focus, or sensory integration and processing differences like quirks in how I see, hear, feel, taste, and smell. The high rate of IN personality types among Aspies, however, might lead to a number of IN neurotypicals misdiagnosing themselves as Aspies. (I'm not accusing anyone here, or anything - I'm mostly just an occasional lurker here these days so don't really know the members anymore.) It also can lead to people who don't know much about AS/Autism incorrectly suspecting IN's of having Asperger's - my little sister thinks I'm a mild case, but I know I'm not because I know how my brain works and it doesn't have any of the specific quirks I've heard Aspies have. And I think there may also be some degree of pathologizing introversion in American culture.

So while a correlation between autism spectrum conditions and certain kinds of temperament may be notable, I think it is an error to consider personality traits like being logical and emotionally distant as primary indicators of Asperger's/ASC's. I think they should be secondary or even tertiary indicators.


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01 Jul 2009, 4:25 pm

fiddlerpianist wrote:
Maybe an INTJ personality is more likely to emerge as a result of the neurological differences of autism? What makes someone INTJ yet not autistic? Is it the severity alone?

Is a personality type anything more than neurological differences? It seems to me that the same neurological differences could manifest themselves as AS, an INTJ personality, both, just one, or maybe even neither.


If there is a continuous spectrum with AS at one end and NT at the other, then possibly neurotypical INTJs and INTPs are towards the aspie end of the NT part of the spectrum. They may have some personality traits in common with aspergers, such as prefering systemizing to empathising, not being too keen on socialising, not being too interested in appearance, and being honest without worrying about offending people.

The difference is that they will probably be able to read facial expressions and body language, have theory of mind, can make eye contact and can make small talk even if they don't necessarily enjoy it.

Although I'm ISTP/INTP, my grandparents and possibly my father are INTJ - I wonder if neurotypical family members of someone with AS are more likely to be INTJ? In that case the INTJ personality type could be seen as a precursor to aspergers - perhaps INTJs are more likely to give birth to people with AS, even if the Aspie isn't INTJ him/herself.



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01 Jul 2009, 6:15 pm

I'm generally either eNTJ or INTJ (depending on what sort of mood I'm in when I answer the questionnaire).


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02 Jul 2009, 6:09 am

I'm an ISTP, which is rare for this site I've noticed, so does that mean I have a personality type that introverted NTs would have? but still there is no doubt that I have AS aswell.
I find it interesting to see people on this site with the opposite of INTJ, like ESFP or something, because it's the opposite personality type to what aspies usually are.


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02 Jul 2009, 6:45 am

MONKEY wrote:
I'm an ISTP, which is rare for this site I've noticed, so does that mean I have a personality type that introverted NTs would have? but still there is no doubt that I have AS aswell.
I find it interesting to see people on this site with the opposite of INTJ, like ESFP or something, because it's the opposite personality type to what aspies usually are.

I suspect that the official "write-ups" for each personality type were based on actual people, and that the people that they selected for INT* were likely on the spectrum somewhere. There certainly is an AS stereotype, and it so happens that many of the NT ("intuitive thinker", not "neurotypical") traits happen to correlate with that stereotype. But since we are all very different, there are different personality types across WP.

INT* is supposedly pretty rare. INTJ is the rarest, at less than 1% of the population. Autism is, what, somewhere between 0.25% and .5%? If you said that "all autistics are INTJ" (which isn't true, of course), if you were to randomly select an INTJ, the chances that they had some autism in them would be very high... 25% to 50%. Even if those numbers were lower, there is a good chance that you'd notice personality trends of autism among the INT* population and would write them up.

Interestingly, on an INTJ forum, they heard about this, too. So a bunch of them took the Aspie Quiz, and something like 1/3 to half of them came back with an Aspie rating.

http://intjforum.com/showthread.php?t=2071

It's amusing, though. Most of them just shrugged it off and said either that the test was horribly inaccurate or that it simply didn't matter.


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zer0netgain
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02 Jul 2009, 6:55 am

The difference.

INTJ is a personality classification. It stands alone and you can be an INTJ without having any form of autism.

AS is an autism spectrum disorder. Perhaps many people with AS would classify as INTJ, but it isn't automatic and one does not require the other.



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02 Jul 2009, 7:48 am

Quote:
Easy:

Someone without AS can partake in proper two-way reciprocal conversation, whereas the person with AS can't (it's either of the one-sided and lecturing make, or not at all, in the majority of cases; those who can appear somewhat normal are only reading from a script in their head--throw something unexpected at them and they'll stop and won't know how to continue).

Someone without AS who has an intense interest isn't seemingly controlled by it, and their life doesn't appear to revolve around it entirely, as they can do and complete things that aren't involving said interest without any allowances given.



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02 Jul 2009, 8:21 am

INTJ here. While there might be a strong correlation between INTJ and AS, it's a far cry from equating them.


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02 Jul 2009, 11:45 am

crabdog62482 wrote:
I'm INTj. I'm always the minority on these tests. Funny story: E-harmony told me I'm not compatible with the rest of humanity, lol... I just made myself sad. :(


I'm also INTJ, though sometimes I test INTP. I also had the exact same eHarmony experience. :cry:



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02 Jul 2009, 12:42 pm

DarrylZero wrote:
crabdog62482 wrote:
I'm INTj. I'm always the minority on these tests. Funny story: E-harmony told me I'm not compatible with the rest of humanity, lol... I just made myself sad. :(


I'm also INTJ, though sometimes I test INTP. I also had the exact same eHarmony experience. :cry:

I'm morally opposed to eHarmony, actually. They will only work with you if you are straight. While I am straight, I have a serious problem with that type of discrimination.


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08 Jul 2009, 11:14 pm

I'm an INFJ. Aspies CAN be F-types.


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