aspies and asians

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Im Asian and aspie, and theres really no correlation, a few steriotypes might be similar. For example: steriotypical asian girl might be very sweet, quiet, pleasant and maybe nerdy. (let me emphasis steriotypes, I know many asians that dont fit them) And me as an aspie: quiet, monotone, odd, rude and very aloof. I cant speak for aspie girls on the whole since ive barely met any. And I've never met another asian aspie female, that I know of.

[quote="reddingcal"
I believe that a vast majority of perceived differences in people are cultural, not biological. You also have to understand that most of us are coming from a biased perspective of a western country. The Asians you have the most experience with are more affluent, achievement motivated, and have a passion for learning. They will tend to give off that nerdy Asian vibe. The ones leaving their country for the west are the smartest Asians who will of course be "nerdy" in ways.[/quote]

True that many immigrants who come over to this country, do not give a complete representation of their country as they are often the ones who are looking for very good jobs. This is probably more true for India, Chinese and Africa.

There is a strong biological/neurological difference American, Jamaicans and Japanese. Those with stronger neurological differences, aspies, don’t always comply to that culture.

No.

It's just a coincidence.

There are also many aspects of Asian culture, or at least Confucian culture which are very anti-Aspie.

For example there is a much heavier emphasis on "unspoken" communication than in Western culture. People are a lot more indirect and you are supposed to "pick up" all the sub-text and read between the lines. It *is* very rules based but you have to have the social skills to quickly work out the situation, your expected role, read between the lines and work out what people really mean and then apply the right rule. Also, there is more emphasis on acting together as a group, conforming and fitting in than in Western culture. Networks are extremely important. There is also a lot less sympathy for victims of bullying than in Western culture.

I grew up in both a traditional Chinese environment and a Western environment. I also lived in Japan for a time. I find interacting with Westerners can be a lot less stressful at times largely because I don't have to read between the lines as much.

Westerners and even Chinese who are no longer "truly" Chinese (their senses have all become foreign as the Chinese saying goes) tend to be exempted because they don't know better and they are not really part of the "inner" group either. The Japanese are similar.

And as for the stereotype of Asians being quieter and polite - it depends, on what city you are talking about for example, the class or even whether the person is from the country or city. And of course whether the person is drunk or not. One thing is it is sometimes not immediately obvious someone is being rude or uncouth unless you understand different dialects of the same language well and the conventions/norms. Sometimes it is not as obvious as using bad names. Lack of titles, not taking inordinately long to say one sentence could all be considered really rude.

As for the nerdy stereotype. The intense studying comes from the Confucian tradition of the exams for the bureaucracy. The emphasis on things like maths and engineering and medicine is more modern. If you look at more traditional Confucian studies there is actually a very strong emphasis on more humanities based subjects. For example the ability to make up poetry on the spot was important. The most infamous example is when the emperor Cao Pi forced his younger brother to make up a stanza about brotherhood (i.e. explain why I shouldn't kill you) by the time they walked 7 steps - and he couldn't use the word "brother". At the same time as the stories go Cao Cao and his sons were also fair inventors. Anyway a well rounded Confucian scholar was one who was capable of many skills. As the saying goes, a second-rate man is only good at one thing, the sage is good at many things.

When Western learning first came to places like China and Japan there was heavy opposition from traditionalists and even the government at times. Things like maths, engineering and medicine were seen as a lot more "neutral" and hence were more encouraged than say humanities or law. Then as people who got skilled from studying Western technology/medicine got rich and powerful naturally it was seen as being more prestigious. Though there were opposition (sometimes with religious/ideological basis) against Western technology as well so it wasn't all fun and games. Another reason for the emphasis on things like maths and engineering is due to the fact that they require less language skills and are easier for people for whom English is not their first language. Even for Asians who grew up in the West there is the build up of the prestige of the occupations from the last 100 years of history to contend with and they are often heavily influenced by their parents.

The point is, just because two things may be coincidentally similar in some aspects don't mean they are in any way related or even really that similar when you look at it closely.

I thought that Japan being more of a group culture, also made it more clear and unambiguous how one should behave. So to the outside western world it would appear more strict.

Wouldn’t one also be protected by the group somehow, where contribution to the group is appreciated, much the same way it is at work. In western individualistic society, who is there to appreciate my contributions? Where woman are appreciate the individualistic materialistic selfish Jerk guy, opposed to contributes and providers that make the group strong. There is less of a pressure to an Alpha male.

It was not a remark from myself, but something I read in one of the topics here.

But the idea was that Scandinavians are more closed people and do not make contact easily. And that is a trait found in a lot of Aspies.

actually i have deemed my city in many ways a ASD heaven as here people leave me alone and they are pretty closed.. so in a way you are right...although it is a stereotype not worthy of everybody..

There are rules and if the situation is obvious then it is clear how one should behave but very often the situation is not obvious.

For example if people won't tell you a direct "no" you need to work out the difference between a "yes" which means "yes", a "yes" which means "may be" and a "yes" that means "no". And yes, people *will* get pissed off if you can't work it out.

Another example is you should not appear to eager to receive gifts. So sometimes you might refuse a gift when it is first given to you (good manners). So the gift-giver should work out when someone really doesn't want a gift because they hate it, doesn't want a gift because it's not appropriate but they really do want it or really really wants the gift but is only refusing it to be polite and so you're supposed to spend the next 3 minutes trying to "convince" them to take it. And yes, people will get pissed off if you go "OK, you don't really want it so I guess I won't press you." when they do in fact really want it or vice-versa. Another example is when they don't want the gift and they are refusing it to be rude and they are trying to embarrass you in front of everyone. The words may be exactly the same in each situation, but the body language and tone is different. Not to mention the reaction of any audience present.



If you are considered part of the group in the first place and it is *not* dependent on talent. But even if the group will protect you from outsiders (which they have to if you are family because otherwise it will look bad) within the group you will be bullied. Yes, there may be less pressure to be an Alpha male as defined as being loud, brash etc. At the same time you have a greater need to be able to *conform*. In a Western setting talent may excuse lack of social skills. In a Confucian setting, social skills is considered part of your talent.

A possible reason for this is because the actions of the individual reflect on the group a lot more in a Confucian setting. For example if because of your quirks you behave "rudely", the "group" you belong to such as your family or work group will get blamed because they should have "taught" you better. So there is even more reason to behave "properly" and conform because it is not just *you* who will be horribly embarassed or lose their job. Your entire "group" is on the line. A "group" cannot afford to tolerate a smart individual who has horrible social skills. You need to be whipped into line or gotten rid of (or hidden at home). It doesn't matter how smart you are if you can't behave properly you are not making the group "strong"- you are *weakening* it in the eyes of the world because they are considered to bear part of the responsibility for any trouble you cause because you can't work out body language.

Also the importance of networks means that people with good social skills and good networking skills will tend to advance faster than those who less great social skills.

Actually it is possible to get away with being individualistic and with weird quirks - if you are also a complete charmer with natural charisma and great social skills and with lots of natural talent.

＼（－－）／ That seems even worse then living in the UK.
It must also be pressure on the Chavs of Japan as well as the Aspies. I wonder of Japan is a happy nation.

If there's a significant genetic component to AS then it would not be surprising to have a racial connection. I'm not aware of whether there have been any academic studies.

Within Asia, few people consider themselves as Asian. National identity, culture, and ethnicity are much more meaningful.

AnnieK made extremely insightful comments about social conventions. The only counterpoint that occurs to me is the tremendous Japanese enthusiasm for "special interests" ranging from trains to insects.

For some balance ... How do you tell a Finnish extrovert from a Finnish introvert? the introvert will look his shoes when he's talking to you, the extrovert will look at your shoes...

WTF! This is complete stereotyping. That's like saying all black people like rap and sports, and trust me I'm black and don't like both of them. I have Asian friends who don't fit the stereotype.
Most likely they act like the way they do because of their culture. Our culture supports sports while theirs support academics. Of course, this could also be because of history to. THe Japanese had to agree to trade with the U.S., but they vowed to take part of the world's industry. By the twentieth century the Japanese already controlled a sixth of the world's industry. Now they control a much larger part of the industry while we Americans produce crap and go into debt. Their ideas affect they way they act to. "It's all about Sociology," I would say.

^Smart kid.

I had similar experiences in Scandinavia - people are less intrusive and curios. There's also less chit-chat, nosy neighbors, strangers trying to pick you up and such (at least if there's no booze involved ). On the other hand, there's a lot of non-verbal communication going on that's very hard to read for a foreigner and even harder for an aspie.

i have never thought of it like that, but yes i think there are allot of non-verbal things...i pick up some of the non verbal stuff which non Norwegians do not seem to pick up...but at most times i am pretty clueless...

but Norwegians are not that cold, just on the outside.. inside they are warmer then most peoples i have met....

I hope my post didn't imply I found Scandinavians cold as that was not my intention.

My experiences were mostly in Sweden and some in Denmark and I really appreciated the lack of nosiness and chit-chat... As for the non-verbal communication, I'm usually very quiet so I didn't get in trouble that much, but I was aware I was missing all sort of signals. I've lived in Sweden for two years and in time I've learned to "decode" some of the clues - better than my NT husband who's less used to pay attention to this kind of details.

no no...it was i who felt that i should bring it up.. no worries:)

its funny, ive never been to Sweden:P but from what ive seen and met of Swedes they are pretty similar to eastern Norwegians, while Western Norwegians i think are a bit different.... tend to be more open and loud... the Danish i think are quite social....overall nice people...