Aspies are normal too!

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No I'm not - he's nowhere near paedophile. He's an innocent boy in a wheelchair - I was talking about a completely different thing there.
I'm just saying that some Aspies think ''NT'' means people who aren't on the Autistic spectrum, and this boy isn't Autistic. My nan isn't Autistic either - she has Alzheimer's, so is she NT or NL? Apparently I've read that Alzheimer's is common, so does that make them normal? My nan certainly isn't normal any more - she now needs 24 year hour care because she can't run a normal life any more.

Then you can see that he'd have to be cautious, too, if faced with someone who meant him harm, despite being abnormal?

"NT" is a fuzzily-defined term at best. I usually include under the term NT:
People who are actually "normal-brained" (at least as much as anyone)
People who are normal except for having ADHD
People who are normal except for having dyslexia
People who suffer from migraines but otherwise perceive and interact with the world and other people in ways very similar to the three categories above
People who are normal except for very mild sensory processing issues, and show no other autistic traits, and socialize normally

I sometimes include sociopaths with this definition when they use NT social skills, because to me a general (but vague) definition of NT is "one whose ability to process whatever senses they have is normal, and who interacts like an NT." (Note that that definition is recursive-- NTs interact like NTs. This makes it a bad definition.)

The reason why I resent having AS is because nobody else in the family have got it, only me. I have 12 cousins and 1 brother, and they are all NTs, so I just think I might aswell have just been NT like them. I'm not being horrible, but why didn't one of my other cousins have it? Why just me? Is it because I'm the only person who is in this body, and I don't really know how to deal with being alive? When I was first diagnosed, I thought, ''why have I got this for?''

Also I feel like I'm a curse, because my mum is NT but she's always been the ''unlucky one''. Lots of things in her past have happened to her what was unlucky, and I just feel I've added to her unlucky shenanigans. Her sisters have always faired off better than she has. I won't go into detail because it's not fair to tell her life on the web, but if you knew what unfortunate things have happened to her then you will know how I mean. And my mum is the nicest person you can come across, yet she's not had much good happen to her. And it sounds a little ironic for the ''unlucky'' one to have a daughter with the ''difficult syndrome'', whilst her sisters and brother and sister-in-laws and brother-in-laws have all had NT children, who are all doing fine now. I just don't see the fairness in it all. It's surprising I wasn't born with a severe illness - but I suppose fate wanted me to live a long full life and come across as normal, yet not be normal, and fate wanted me to have a disability where I was self-aware, and aware of the NT world, but too socially thick to live upto anything. So fate chose AS, because that's the only disability to make you all over the place.

My mum even said she hates Autism. She wouldn't mind if someone else in the family had a son or daughter with it too, but because they're all NTs..............

Last edited by Joe90 on 28 Dec 2010, 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Normal is subjective. Nuff said.

What does subjective mean?

Subjective is something that changes meaning based on the topic of discussion (or subject)

That's exactly what normal means then.

Once my mum was telling her sister that she saw a woman walking out with only a thin top on, on a really freezing cold day, and my aunt said, ''she ain't normal!'' But she didn't mean the woman ain't normal herself.

I mean, at the moment I'm normal - I'm sitting here on my computer. 2 hours ago I was chatting normally to my neighbour. 6 days ago I had a meltdown (which isn't normal. Well, it's normal for me, but it's generally not normal). My mum even said angrily, ''you ain't normal!! !'' Then just yesterday I was talking to my mum about the girls who once bullied me and I said, ''I wouldn't ever go back and be friends with them again,'' and my mum said, ''yer, well you're too normal to be friends with them.''

And anyway, I may have AS, but it doesn't make my personality abnormal. The way I express my anger (having a meltdown) isn't normal. The things I get anxious and irritable about isn't normal. The way I walk is normal.

I'm normal for an Aspie, anyway.

I thought subjective meant something along the lines of "changes meaning based on which individual is actually acquiring the perceptive information according to that individual's previous experiences, perceptions and conclusions". Guess I'll never stop learning.

"Subjective" can best be understood if put in opposition to "objective."

If something is definitely one way, like the fact that I am not wearing a hat, that's objective. The fact that there is a hairbrush sitting on my desk is an objective fact.

"Subjective" is about opinions, where every opinion is as valid as every other. "Letters to Juliet is the best movie ever" is subjective, because everyone feels differently about movies and it's equally valid to consider it the worst movie ever, or simply a good movie, or a mildly boring movie.

Claiming that normality is subjective is interesting, because actually it has aspects of both. It is objectively true that, for instance, savants are not normal. It is somewhat subjective, though, because a lot of "normal" or "not normal" is about appearances rather than reality, and mostly that means appearance to specific people.

Value judgments are subjective; a lot of other stuff is objective.

Something that changes based on situation is not subjective but context-dependent.

I do know that ''normal'' doesn't always necessarily mean good or bad. On Good Friday last year, I wanted to get the bus to my volunteer job, but I wasn't sure if the bus services were running Sunday times or week-day times. When I phoned up the bus company, I asked, ''are the buses running Sunday times or normal times?'' Notice I wrote the word ''normal'' in bold. I used the word ''normal'' to describe the week-day times, but that doesn't make the Sunday services bad times. Sunday services are just different to the week-day services because the bus runs every 2 hours on a Sunday instead of every hour. I haven't heard anybody complain about the slightly different service what runs on Sundays.

Same type of explanation with being normal or abnormal.

The word ''normal'' is a useful word to ''take a short cut'' to explain things.

It's just that I found ''being abnormal'' rather offensive because, say for example, if my mum turned around to someone and said, ''my daughter isn't normal,'' the other person would probably say, ''oh dear. What's wrong with her then?'' Notice how the other person would be concerned.

That's a matter of connotation. "Not normal" doesn't have to mean that, but there are people who do use it that way (because they're prejudiced, and I refer here not to conscious prejudices but to unconscious ones soaked up without realizing it that would be discarded by anyone who considered them). However, she could convey that you aren't normal without such connotations by saying that you are exceptional, which means the same thing but with positive connotations (which make no more sense than the negative ones), or 2E (a popular term over here in certain circles; it's short for "twice exceptional," meaning, roughly, "disabled and gifted").

Just remember we are using it like bus routes over here when we say we're not normal.

Joe90: I can understand your anger or resentment in wanting to be like all your cousins. I'm assuming there were other reasons for you being assessed in the first place other than just social shyness. Your Mum also sounds like she is having a hard time and perhaps she is being put in a defensive position by her other brothers or sisters. Personally my mom took the brunt for years as I never fitted in with my family at all and it became really clear by the time I was 5. My relatives wanted to know when I was going to be 'normal' and my mom had no answers, but as time went on she started to accept that I was different and that it was an okay thing, she indulged me in some of my 'interests' despite further criticism from family members.

Your Mum sounds as though she is angry by saying she hates Autism and perhaps a good starting point for both of you would be to seek help for some counseling. It's in your best interest to get her to accept you for who you are if at all possible and I don't know whether you have tried talking to her about how upset or angry you are to open up some conversation? Your other family members will either accept you or not and I don't think you should worry about them. Focus on what issues you have and how you could benefit from some help and ask your Doctor to point you in the right direction. Also look for a social group in your area, I notice some meetings on this site for the UK, I think it would be a really helpful thing and you could work on social skills or whatever else...

The most important thing is that you accept yourself, you cannot change what has happened in your Mum's life either. I have never viewed this as a negative I just didn't understand the extent of who I was or were I fit in. I never felt that I would fit in until I realized I had AS and then all my questions were answered.

I came across this quote recently:

Not everything that steps out of line, and thus 'abnormal' must necessarily be 'inferior'. by Hans Asperger (1938)

Celebrate what makes you unique and different!

If it helps PM me.

The strange thing is, I was diagnosed with Dyspraxia and mild AS at the age of 8 but I never felt any different to anyone else until I was a teenager. Sometimes I felt left out, other times I felt lonely - but never different. When I was a toddler my parents say I never once showed any AS symptoms, and my mum had lots of friends who had toddlers aswell, and I never acted different to any of them and I always got along with them, and they are all NTs. I've watched videos of me aged 3 at a birthday party, and it was a noisy environment with lots of children, and I looked relaxed and was joining in. I didn't once put my hands over my ears or looked overwhelmed. But if I just have mild AS, maybe that's why it didn't show when I was a toddler.

Perhaps I was born NT 'til the September when I started school. Perhaps I banged my head so hard that it scrambled my brain and set it to AS. My mum did say I kept accidentally banging my head on things when I was a baby. But how would all that suddenly unscramble my brain?

Oh my god......imagine bumping my head several times as a baby really did scramble my brains! If I didn't keep bumping my head on things, I would be NT today! Right now I wouldn't be sitting here with earplugs in my ears blocking out all background noise. And the dent in my door from an outburst wouldn't be there.....
There are so many reasons why I'm angry with being the only one to suffer with this AS.

And I do have conversations with my mum a lot, but she doesn't always like me talking about AS. She hates it because it makes me lonely and unhappy. And every parent in the world hates their children being lonely and unhappy, even when they're adults.

Anything you got from head-banging is a TBI, not Asperger's.

Joe90: I hear everything you are saying and from what I have read and experienced girls with AS can adapt more than boys so that may be some of the reason it wasn't as noticable when you were younger. With adolescence the signs can become more noticable which seems to be your case.

I was way out there from an early age but by the time I was a teenager I had given up on trying to make friends and very rarely socialized at all, my Mum tried everything to help as well. Things did change for me in my twenties though as I pushed myself more to go out. I understand your Mum's pain too as I have a 13 year old son with AS who has no local friends, he has many online friends. I am going to be helping with starting a social group in this area as I know of other teenagers who would benefit from contact with others with similar interests and issues.

I would still say look for a social group in your area as I think it would make a big difference to you. Keep up the conversations with your Mum! Make a list of all the interests and positive benefits you have (there are some) and discuss them with your Mum to plan a way forward, this will also make her feel that she is able to help you. Let me know how you get on.

I've found the answer to what i've been trying to say here!
I don't think it fits the title of this thread, but it's still tells what I've been trying to explain, but due to my poor vocabulary and poor explanitory ideas, I couldn't word it as good as this, but this is what I've been trying to say and how I compared the similarities between Aspies and NTs:-

ASD traits are not traits unique to only ASD individuals. They are human traits, often taken to an extreme, that when grouped together in one individual usually indicates an ASD. NTs may stim, feel anxiety in social situations, have black and white thinking, be literal thinkers, have narrow focused interests, have language delays, etc. NTs may grow out of their traits, or may continue to exhibit them throughout their life. The main difference is that NTs dont exhibit all or most of the traits concurrently like autistics do, and often not to the same degree. And some of the signs that do stand out more in ASD people than NTs are just minor. Like me with my sensitive ears. I get really angry when I hear little household noises when in my room, and I know that NTs do not exhibit this behaviour, but it is a minor difference. (All of this in bold was explained
by someone else who is cleverer than me, so I thought I'd use his theory, which I thought was exactly how I felt about AS, to put on here to show what I was trying to say this whole time).
Like when somebody has IBS (irritable bowel syndrome), they get stomach-ache - so do we all at times. They get diarrhoea or constipation - so do we all at times. They feel bloated - so do we all at times. They produce gas - so do we all at times. But people with IBS get these symptoms more and it can become a problem what needs to be diagnosed and/or sorted, whereas I just get those symptoms occasionally or mildly, therefore I don't need a diagnosis or aren't considered having IBS. But just because I don't have IBS, still doesn't mean I don't experience any symptoms of it throughout my lifetime. That goes the same with ASDs. Everyone exhibits the given symptoms, but they.....ohh, I can't explain properly - you've read what it said in bold. Now do you get it, or, do I get it now?