DSM5 Final Recommendations

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Tuttle
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25 Jul 2012, 10:40 pm

Verdandi wrote:

There won't be any diagnostic code for Asperger's or PDD-NOS, only ASD.

That's good to know.

Where are you getting this information?

btbnnyr
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25 Jul 2012, 10:43 pm

Even bester than Asperger's poo-poo-poofing will be the same for PDD-NOS.

nominalist
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25 Jul 2012, 10:48 pm

The DSM codes come from the ICD-10. So far, the ICD has not eliminated the Asperger's code. The ICD-11 isn't due out for a few years.

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Verdandi
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25 Jul 2012, 10:49 pm

Tuttle wrote:

Verdandi wrote:

There won't be any diagnostic code for Asperger's or PDD-NOS, only ASD.

That's good to know.

Where are you getting this information?

That bit? From the DSM-5 website which only lists an entry for ASD. The bit I linked from JER's facebook says the terms will remain as descriptors, but not that they are diagnoses.

Tuttle
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25 Jul 2012, 10:53 pm

btbnnyr wrote:

Even bester than Asperger's poo-poo-poofing will be the same for PDD-NOS.

Yes.

(Though in some ways I'm wishing I got that diagnosis :p)

EstherJ
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25 Jul 2012, 11:25 pm

As long as I keep my diagnosis and when I go to a psychologist they will understand and believe me and my doctor's report, then I'm fine.
And, as long as a EMT or policeman will believe my medical id, which says "Asperger's," then I'm fine.

anomy
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26 Jul 2012, 10:13 am

Personally, I find the DMS in general and the DMS-5 very incomplete.

It seems like there are so many aspie traits that are not even touched on in the official diagnostic tool. Traits that are not shared by every aspie but do seem to be found in higher proportions than the general population:

1. Awkward gait
2. Unusually fast speech
3. Fluid intelligence

just to name a few.

Then there are common traits such as aversion to scratchy clothes/tags that can fall under the sensory category but seems like some therapists would miss these.

Is there an extended list in the DMS? I don't even see anything in the DMS-5 that could count toward literal thinking and related issues.

It seems to me that the "academic" study of aspergers is far more accurate than the DMS. It is certainly more complete.

CyclopsSummers
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26 Jul 2012, 10:45 am

Verdandi wrote:

Quote:

She also confirmed that Asperger's and PDD NOS will remain as descriptors within the Autism Spectrum diagnosis. So a person who says he has Asperger's today will not lose that descriptor.

I'm confused, Verdandi. If everything is folded into one Autism Spectrum disorder with the DSM-V, what is the relevance of maintaining PDD-NOS and Asperger syndrome as 'descriptors'? Especially PDD-NOS has always kind of been a 'garbage can' category (pardon the phrasing, no offence intended). I can get that someone (though not everyone) who was diagnosed with Asperger's or PDD-NOS years ago, would like to continue with that designation, but I also thought the whole point of one single 'autistic spectrum disorder' was to provide clarity, and to acknowledge that all ASD's are essentially the same neurological disorder, though occurring differently per person, and in different levels of severity. This is also why it surprises me that the word 'spectrum' is maintained in the name, as the DSM-V no longer recognises the separate autistic disorders like the DSM-IV did.

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OJani
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27 Jul 2012, 4:12 am

Tuttle wrote:

btbnnyr wrote:

Even bester than Asperger's poo-poo-poofing will be the same for PDD-NOS.

Yes.

(Though in some ways I'm wishing I got that diagnosis :p)

I'm the opposite, you know.

Away with PDD-NOS.

OJani
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27 Jul 2012, 4:32 am

nominalist wrote:

The DSM codes come from the ICD-10. So far, the ICD has not eliminated the Asperger's code. The ICD-11 isn't due out for a few years.

AFAIK, the ICD-11 will maintain the separate diagnoses.

ICD-11 Beta:
http://apps.who.int/classifications/icd ... ficd%23F84

I don't see PDD-NOS listed there, so I don't know what will happen with it. Maybe I will lose my dx anyway because I was diagnosed according to ICD with one...

Social reciprocity disorder = Asperger syndrome? Interesting.

Verdandi
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27 Jul 2012, 4:45 am

CyclopsSummers wrote:

Verdandi wrote:

Quote:

She also confirmed that Asperger's and PDD NOS will remain as descriptors within the Autism Spectrum diagnosis. So a person who says he has Asperger's today will not lose that descriptor.

I don't know what the usefulness is, I just linked the information I had available.

Ettina
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27 Jul 2012, 8:22 am

Quote:

For her I think the biggest defining characteristic is the inability to learn anything incidentally, even though she has superior intelligence. She has had to learn everything from pointing, to waving, to speaking, to approaching other kids, to having reciprocal communications, etc. in a very systematic manner. This is a common trait of many people on the spectrum that I have crossed paths with, but it is nowhere in the diagnostic criteria.

You only listed social things as examples. Most autistic kids learn many things incidentally, but these are all non-social things (eg things about their area of interest). Difficulty with social skills is already part of the criteria.

Did you have to teach your kid to walk? To grasp objects? To understand folk physics (eg dropped things fall)? All those are things most kids learn incidentally, including most autistic kids. A kid who can't learn anything incidentally would be a lot more impaired than even most LFA kids I've met.

InThisTogether
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27 Jul 2012, 6:09 pm

Ettina wrote:

Quote:

You are absolutely right. It is all social things. (And no, I don't recall any "non-social" things that I have had to teach her.)

But what I don't think many people understand is that although she acts and behaves like many of her typical peers, all of this had to be broken down into small steps and taught to her in very explicit ways. And when she is faced with a novel situation, she cannot be expected to handle it appropriately. In a familiar environment, she looks only very mildly impaired, if at all. But put her in an unfamiliar environment and she looks like a different kid.

I guess my underlying point is that she is good at learning compensatory strategies, but it makes people doubt her diagnosis. Yet I think that there is a fundamental difference between a person who learns social skills incidentally and one who doesn't. And I personally believe it is one of the core issues with autism, yet it is not part of the diagnostic criteria at all.

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nominalist
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27 Jul 2012, 6:56 pm

The new name for "Asperger's Disorder" in the DSM-5 will be (as things stand right now) Autism Spectrum Disorder Level 1 (ASD 1).

Callista
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27 Jul 2012, 6:59 pm

Some Aspies will be level 2 or 3, actually.

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nominalist
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27 Jul 2012, 7:04 pm

Callista wrote:

Some Aspies will be level 2 or 3, actually.

I guess they could be. However, level 3 looks more like "classic Autism" to me.

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