Judging peoples intentions. ?
I don't know other people's real intentions. Sometimes I don't even understand my own intentions.
I don't really trust people who jump to call me their friend early. The intent doesn't need to be malicious - I think I more often got into an idealisation-demonisation cycle with such people than into intentional abuse. It happened to me just recently, with a woman who first flooded me with love and acceptance but then misinterpreted my Aspie behavior and started hating everything I did... then, months later, we talked under influence and reconciled but I guess I will have to keep my boundaries firm with her.
I suspect I attract people with disregulated emotionalities. Better than to attract outright abusers, I guess.
_________________
Let's not confuse being normal with being mentally healthy.
<not moderating PPR stuff concerning East Europe>
My rule of thumb is to risk a loan of $20 (local conditions may vary) on any new friend. It was worth that much to see if they thought my friendship was worth more. Apart from money, there's other basic helpfulness that should usually be reciprocated, if possible.
In general, if you don't care about people, they won't care about you. Find out what's interesting about them, and have follow-up questions on how their concerns are developing. If you find something of interest to them, share it. This won't always get you a friend, though. Keep fishing. If you catch one in a hundred, that's OK.
What a coincidence.
About 30 years ago, when I was clueless, I found a "friend" who kept trying to put me in situations where I would pay for him. Eventually, I decided to give him $20. He worked so hard for it, after all.
I never saw him again. lol
I have made huge strides in self-discovery and self-improvement as a result of this website.
It is good to talk to "our own kind".
Thank you, that's very nice of you to say. I seem to seldom have luck when it comes to being open about my feelings though being on the forum here gives me some solace in knowing other people are like me too. I have a bad tendency to think I'm told things in terms of compliments just to pacify me. Thanks.
This is an autistic website.
Aspies are usually truthful, and sometimes compulsively so like I am.
In my case, I literally view "white lies" to pacify me as an insult, so you won't get any from me.
Thank you, that's very nice of you to say. I seem to seldom have luck when it comes to being open about my feelings though being on the forum here gives me some solace in knowing other people are like me too. I have a bad tendency to think I'm told things in terms of compliments just to pacify me. Thanks.
This is an autistic website.
Aspies are usually truthful, and sometimes compulsively so like I am.
In my case, I literally view "white lies" to pacify me as an insult, so you won't get any from me.
Yeah it's unfortunate that I now default to everyone just being dishonest to me, it's good to know I can speak what's on my mind without the fear of being judged.. As someone on the spectrum, I find that being honest is very hard when it seems like everyone else requires some kind of dishonesty to get their way.. I too share your view on white lies, it's very insulting as I can't seem to understand why people need to treat me like I can't accept truth in things when I'm only truthful back, cept I did say to my ex wife once.. ask me if I'm being dishonest, well that ended 10yrs .. not cause I was dishonest, I just tried to find the lying balance and failed miserably and should have just remained honest to myself from the start. So point in case is I find honesty doesn't seem to get me very far .. maybe it's me or the society we live in.. I don't have the answers.
I did say to my ex wife once.. ask me if I'm being dishonest, well that ended 10yrs .. not cause I was dishonest, I just tried to find the lying balance and failed miserably and should have just remained honest to myself from the start. So point in case is I find honesty doesn't seem to get me very far .. maybe it's me or the society we live in.. I don't have the answers.
That part being where I was dishonest.. it was very severe the lies i told. .. regret it to this day. I still regret the lies far more than my honesty upon being asked about my truthfulness .. even though it cost me my marriage and seeing my kids. Teach me for stepping into lies when I only lied to myself to begin with.
I feel like sometimes I’m pretty good at judging other’s intentions, and other times not so much. I’ll bring up a couple of stories from middle school:
-near the beginning of 7th grade, I remember one week a group of popular girls started acting weird whenever I walked by their table in the cafeteria. They would act like they worshiped me, making the gestures and saying stuff like “all hail King Simon!” I deduced they were behaving this way because they felt sorry for me, and they probably figured I would just go along with it because being “special needs” and all I wouldn’t question it. Anyways, because of this inference I actually had the counselor come pull the plug on the girls.
-there was this gang of boys in middle school that totally manipulated me into saying and doing stupid stuff. They had me do the Nazi salute every time I saw them and I went by the nickname “semen” (I was familiar with the word but didn’t know how it was pronounced). I thought that they thought I was cool, which was why they gave me a cool nickname and had me raise my hand in a cool way, but in actuality they simply saw me as an entertainment device, someone “ret*d” they could use for their own enjoyment. By 8th grade, I had pretty much caught onto this, and was far more wary of this group but I never really stood up to them beyond telling them to not call me [semen].
-In general, by the end of middle school I got the impression that most of my peers either pitied me, as they believed that I wasn’t “all there” or whatever or again, saw me as a “ret*d” that was an easy source of entertainment. For an example of the former, I remember it was the end-of-year trip to Chicago, we were at a White Sox game, and one of the more popular guys randomly came up to me and asked what my favorite animal was. I’m guessing the context was, because of my reputation as a socially disabled person, his friend group decided to send him up to me to ask me a question that was seemingly totally random and irrelevant to the situation because they knew I liked animals, and I wouldn’t question it because blah blah. I guess his intentions were good at heart, but behavior like that is always undermined for me by the fact that it was only done out of pity.
I would like to give you a ray of hope here, if I may. That is, in spite of your self-destructive tendencies, you have taken one of the first steps to making your left better. You are questioning how to live your life, and who you and your friends are.
A lot of us have been at that place. Some of us still are. You are in good company. My ray of hope is this: if you can make some changes, you can move forward and away from this darkness. Many of us have, in one way or another, made our lives better in spite of autism.
Yeah just as I read that, in which 2 things come to mind in particular. 1 being that I struggle with accepting compliments and though i constantly see the best in everyone else, I only see the bad in myself. I'm sure once upon a time I never acknowledged my own good things which is seldom at best but I am sure there's a couple.. But thanks for pointing out the above.. I have such a disdain for myself but nobody to talk to.. I've some counselling stuff coming up but I think i mentioned at some point even in that type of environment I'd be reluctant to openly discuss my situation / feelings as i'm sure i'd just be another consult and hardly worth investing time into = therefor i'd just get BS feedback. On a positive, thanks for noting that I identified something, that's pretty huge for me.
You're right about counseling: if you don't open up, it won't do you much good. PLEASE give yourself the credit you deserve and make the best of the opportunity! Some counselors are better than others, true, and the kind of work you have to do may be hard, but it's got to be better than where you are right now and where you are headed. If you were in a hospital suffering deathly pain, would you allow them to ignore you, or not tell them what the problem was? I really hope not. As you said, your attitude toward yourself isn't fair. I dare to add that it's not accurate, either. You deserve more care than you've given to the others who have come into your life. Time to focus your compassion on YOU. It's not selfish; it's self-rescue.
Isn't Danusaurus opening up here on WP?
Let the healing begin here and now.
I have grown a lot, as a result of talking with and observing my aspie peers.
I can't be the only one, now can I?
Thank you, that's very nice of you to say. I seem to seldom have luck when it comes to being open about my feelings though being on the forum here gives me some solace in knowing other people are like me too. I have a bad tendency to think I'm told things in terms of compliments just to pacify me. Thanks.
This is an autistic website.
Aspies are usually truthful, and sometimes compulsively so like I am.
In my case, I literally view "white lies" to pacify me as an insult, so you won't get any from me.
Yeah it's unfortunate that I now default to everyone just being dishonest to me, it's good to know I can speak what's on my mind without the fear of being judged.. As someone on the spectrum, I find that being honest is very hard when it seems like everyone else requires some kind of dishonesty to get their way.. I too share your view on white lies, it's very insulting as I can't seem to understand why people need to treat me like I can't accept truth in things when I'm only truthful back, cept I did say to my ex wife once.. ask me if I'm being dishonest, well that ended 10yrs .. not cause I was dishonest, I just tried to find the lying balance and failed miserably and should have just remained honest to myself from the start. So point in case is I find honesty doesn't seem to get me very far .. maybe it's me or the society we live in.. I don't have the answers.
You can't be unthinkingly honest in the NT world,
But you don't have to be dishonest either, overwhelmingly.
Be selective in who you trust, and don't volunteer information unnecessarily.
I did say to my ex wife once.. ask me if I'm being dishonest, well that ended 10yrs .. not cause I was dishonest, I just tried to find the lying balance and failed miserably and should have just remained honest to myself from the start. So point in case is I find honesty doesn't seem to get me very far .. maybe it's me or the society we live in.. I don't have the answers.
That part being where I was dishonest.. it was very severe the lies i told. .. regret it to this day. I still regret the lies far more than my honesty upon being asked about my truthfulness .. even though it cost me my marriage and seeing my kids. Teach me for stepping into lies when I only lied to myself to begin with.
I don't get it.
What was the motivation in telling lies?
Especially when it is coming from an aspie?
The only thing that comes to mind is an extramarital affair.
Too personal?
Aspies are known for not appreciating personal boundaries.
Easily fixed. Say: Mind your Doggone business.
I did say to my ex wife once.. ask me if I'm being dishonest, well that ended 10yrs .. not cause I was dishonest, I just tried to find the lying balance and failed miserably and should have just remained honest to myself from the start. So point in case is I find honesty doesn't seem to get me very far .. maybe it's me or the society we live in.. I don't have the answers.
That part being where I was dishonest.. it was very severe the lies i told. .. regret it to this day. I still regret the lies far more than my honesty upon being asked about my truthfulness .. even though it cost me my marriage and seeing my kids. Teach me for stepping into lies when I only lied to myself to begin with.
I don't get it.
What was the motivation in telling lies?
Especially when it is coming from an aspie?
The only thing that comes to mind is an extramarital affair.
Too personal?
Aspies are known for not appreciating personal boundaries.
Easily fixed. Say: Mind your Doggone business.
Well I was discussing with my mom how I realized my nice brother lies out of habit now because he cannot do things or is covering for someone else and people like me and mt dad keep putting all the onus on him for things and my dad calls multiple times a day over 1thing etc. He wants everyone to get on but he knows nobody helps and just expects 100% independence from him and the others.
Which they cannot do.
My mom was like, 'you pestered him so much you drove him to lying!'
As he is v honest till this .
Although it's really my dad who nags without real help given . n expects everything..
while when I try to help directly it works ..
I told her when I explained this to him he began telling me the truth ... So then i did help them directly... n things did work out better.
My point to her was more that he DOES have ASD and other things and you can't just expect that to have no implications ...and tell them off for things they cant do on their own.
Ableism
He has begin lying to reassure essentially.. but it covers up the real issue because he is too afraid of saying he cant do things or needs help or he knows he wont get. The support he needs (direct help with someone there- not advice over the phone)
_________________
Take defeat as an urge to greater effort.
-Napoleon Hill
Well I was discussing with my mom how I realized my nice brother lies out of habit now because he cannot do things or is covering for someone else and people like me and mt dad keep putting all the onus on him for things and my dad calls multiple times a day over 1thing etc. He wants everyone to get on but he knows nobody helps and just expects 100% independence from him and the others.
Which they cannot do.
My mom was like, 'you pestered him so much you drove him to lying!'
As he is v honest till this .
Although it's really my dad who nags without real help given . n expects everything..
while when I try to help directly it works ..
I told her when I explained this to him he began telling me the truth ... So then i did help them directly... n things did work out better.
My point to her was more that he DOES have ASD and other things and you can't just expect that to have no implications ...and tell them off for things they cant do on their own.
Ableism
He has begin lying to reassure essentially.. but it covers up the real issue because he is too afraid of saying he cant do things or needs help or he knows he wont get. The support he needs (direct help with someone there- not advice over the phone)
This spoiler is only for blooiejagwa.
No one else is to look, or else.
I'm retired, financially secure, and pretty much a hermit, so there isn't any reason to.
I did say to my ex wife once.. ask me if I'm being dishonest, well that ended 10yrs .. not cause I was dishonest, I just tried to find the lying balance and failed miserably and should have just remained honest to myself from the start. So point in case is I find honesty doesn't seem to get me very far .. maybe it's me or the society we live in.. I don't have the answers.
That part being where I was dishonest.. it was very severe the lies i told. .. regret it to this day. I still regret the lies far more than my honesty upon being asked about my truthfulness .. even though it cost me my marriage and seeing my kids. Teach me for stepping into lies when I only lied to myself to begin with.
I don't get it.
What was the motivation in telling lies?
Especially when it is coming from an aspie?
The only thing that comes to mind is an extramarital affair.
Too personal?
Aspies are known for not appreciating personal boundaries.
Easily fixed. Say: Mind your Doggone business.
Nah I don't mind you asking, least I am fairly confident you are asking out of genuinely trying to correctly interp what I meant, Motivation was nothing more than trying to be more accepted. .. I was always second anyway but, ugh.. it gets complex, but in short - yeah it was kinda a boundary thing, seeing what was acceptable and stuff, social rules apply, even in your own household. .. So I learned the hardway.
Yeah, I found that rather being different knowingly I rather tried to fit in knowing BS without shaming others by calling them on it as I can relate to feeling shamed and it's not a good feeling. Everybody has the ability to lie, I just very much dislike it. People shouldn't need to be dishonest to each other if it isn't required with that said - it has to be something VERY serious to require needing to, but I guess that's just me getting older and learning to not feel the need to be accepted by others like I used to.
Dear_one
Veteran
Joined: 2 Feb 2008
Age: 77
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,721
Location: Where the Great Plains meet the Northern Pines
My rule of thumb is to risk a loan of $20 (local conditions may vary) on any new friend. It was worth that much to see if they thought my friendship was worth more. Apart from money, there's other basic helpfulness that should usually be reciprocated, if possible.
In general, if you don't care about people, they won't care about you. Find out what's interesting about them, and have follow-up questions on how their concerns are developing. If you find something of interest to them, share it. This won't always get you a friend, though. Keep fishing. If you catch one in a hundred, that's OK.
What a coincidence.
About 30 years ago, when I was clueless, I found a "friend" who kept trying to put me in situations where I would pay for him. Eventually, I decided to give him $20. He worked so hard for it, after all.
I never saw him again. lol
Ha ha. One time, my friends were getting a visitor about 2/7 of every week, enjoying their hospitality while entertaining us with stories and predictions. Then, I thought that if he could know what we would be doing in ten years, he should be able to know what he was doing next week, so I loaned him $20 for a week. My friends were all pissed at me, because they thought we'd never see him again, and they were right.
