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anna-banana
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05 Oct 2008, 10:58 am

yep, ignoring all that makes the discussion probably a bit more interesting but not very realistic I'm afraid...


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MissConstrue
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05 Oct 2008, 11:05 am

Today?

In theory there is always a possibility about anything so I don't put absolution to anything that is still in question. What I question is...will I ever get to meet those that have already passed away and sometimes I don't want to know the ABSOLUTE answere to that... :(


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Synth
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05 Oct 2008, 11:12 am

Well if America fails we can always rely on Russias surpreme technology and space programs, which will be equally unlikely cause we never give them any respect :x Damn why does my country have to be so ignorent, some of the lies I've heard even from my own president about our Slavic neighbors makes me sick.



anna-banana
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05 Oct 2008, 11:14 am

Synth wrote:
Well if America fails we can always rely on Russias surpreme technology and space programs, which will be equally unlikely cause we never give them any respect :x Damn why does my country have to be so ignorent, some of the lies I've heard even from my own president about our Slavic neighbors makes me sick.


as your Slavic neighbour I can attest that a lot of what you've heard is actually true.

offtopic, sorry, I hope I didn't kill this thread yet lol


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Synth
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05 Oct 2008, 11:19 am

We could be thinking about different things, from what I've heard, Russia attacked Georgia, thus making war with its allies ie, usa, acting as "bullies" which is totally twisted. Russia was trying to prevent a genocide of southern Georgians started by its own government! Many of the southerners fled to Russia, thanking them for their hospitality. I found this out from a Russian, and later from articles that are not American of course. Then I told my parents about it and they refused to believe me, and told me "Russia is just a bully".. FFS..! :x



Last edited by Synth on 05 Oct 2008, 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

lau
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05 Oct 2008, 11:26 am

Ishmael wrote:
Lau, homo sapiens are a pack species, most lack certain qualities found in few. Fact, however unpalatable, is not conceited. You cannot honestly expect every man and his dog to keep track of years beyond their natural capacities, to see the world change forever? People evolved with death. Expecting everybody to have the mental stability and capacity to be immortal is as impractical as expecting everybody to have complete, in depth knowledge of all things technical and scientific. Truth is, most everybody you'd meet ok the streets would own a mobile phone without understanding how it works.

Why is it that even those who seem to have some grasp of the future, still adhere to such closed-minded ideas?

... pack ... lack ... Fact ... natural ... stability ... capacity ... impractical ... and finally ... Truth.

You adopt an elitist stance, where you would have access to to mind and body enhancement, but for some reason, that would be denied to others.

Personally, when the singularity comes (for instance), I see it as being inclusive.


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carturo222
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05 Oct 2008, 11:42 am

Some time ago I wrote a piece on this subject. So that I don't repeat myself here, I'll just post the link:

http://eng.ohmynews.com/articleview/art ... 1&rel_no=1



anna-banana
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05 Oct 2008, 11:53 am

carturo222 wrote:
Some time ago I wrote a piece on this subject. So that I don't repeat myself here, I'll just post the link:

http://eng.ohmynews.com/articleview/art ... 1&rel_no=1


I couldn't agree more. pretty much sums up the discussion for me.


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nemaar
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05 Oct 2008, 12:07 pm

Yay, this is one of my favourite topics:)

I didn't read all the posts (yet), because I am so excited that there is a topic about immortality, I have to post my idea!
Since I know about death and actually understood the concept of life I wanted to find a way of not dying (I guess everyone thinks about it at least once in his/her life) and I found an alternative way of immortality. First of all I don't believe in god or in the existence of any other higher being, so I wanted a solution using pure science. Let's assume that physics is quite good enough to describe our world, the universe. The main concept in my immortality theory is that everything is built of smaller objects. The exact details are irrelevant, does not matter how the larger objects are built or what are they called or anything like that. Let's assume that the world is infinite large and the time is infinite as well. This means that there was something before the big bang and there will be something after an infinite long time as well. Now let's describe a person as a series of objects, in this case the objects will be the smallest objects in the universe. If there is no smallest object, i.e. everything is built of an even smaller object and this is true for every object (this is some kind of recursion) then take the smallest object that actually has an effect on a scale which can be detected by us. Assuming that the world is infinite large and the time is infinite as well the probability that there is an exact same series of object as me is not zero. This means that if I wait for an infinite long time (and after my death I have time:P) I'll exist again in the exact same state in the future, because the exact same series of object will be there somewhere. We simply look at the universe as a big random generator generating infinite amount of numbers and if it generates one specific number then that's a person. This also means that the probabiliy of you being 'resurrected' without that deadly disease (which killed you in the past) is not zero. Uhm, that's it, if you are patient you'll live forever:)

By the way there are a number of exciting side effects of this theory. This randomization is also valid of the world around you. You can be resurrected in an infinite number of different worlds, with an infinite number of special abilities, you can be rich, you can fly or anything which is physically possible:) In fact you can experience every possible thing in the world in infinite time.
The other side effect is that the past is infinite as well and probably you have done everything in the past.:)

Sorry if my english is confusing at times:)



lau
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05 Oct 2008, 12:12 pm

carturo222 wrote:
Some time ago I wrote a piece on this subject. So that I don't repeat myself here, I'll just post the link:

http://eng.ohmynews.com/articleview/art ... 1&rel_no=1


An excellent article.

I'd merely quibble that you were constraining yourself to speak only of singular, biological immortality.

I do tend to broaden the term to include the substitution of direct molecular manipulation to replace the biological constructs with less frail structures. Also, duplication and distribution of selves, to avoid the accidental deletion of one or more of them. Other possible strategies may come to mind, but these two are pretty straightforward.


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slowmutant
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05 Oct 2008, 12:12 pm

There's only one kind of eternal life I'm interested in.



lau
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05 Oct 2008, 12:24 pm

slowmutant wrote:
There's only one kind of eternal life I'm interested in.

Yes. We gathered that - the rather boring "dead" kind of eternal life. Somewhat contradictory, I think.

Oh, and nemaar... I hate to spoil the fun, but even if this universe were infinite, with infinite possibilities, it doesn't mean that anything repeats.

I guess the Mandelbrot set is a graphic example of that. Although parts are similar, they are never the same. Also, nowhere is there a straight line, or a circle, say. Actually, the set itself is bordered by a single line.


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anna-banana
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05 Oct 2008, 12:29 pm

lau wrote:
slowmutant wrote:
There's only one kind of eternal life I'm interested in.

Yes. We gathered that - the rather boring "dead" kind of eternal life.


:lol: :lol: :lol:


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slowmutant
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05 Oct 2008, 12:31 pm

You assume that life ends with the death of the body.



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05 Oct 2008, 12:33 pm

Lau, though you don't realize it, you've taken an elitist stance, too.
You dissected what I wrote and picked out your choice words; and your logic denies the social order. Explain, if you're stance is accurate, clans, nations, governments, etc.
Would you give an assault rifle to a chimpanzee? After all, we are all primates - just because they can't build them themselves, doesn't mean the shouldn't have them!

What's this archaic idea nonsense? If pack mentality no longer applies - explain social groups. High schools are a good example.

You might think it noble to hold those ideas, but not everyone can be enlightened. What is advantageous to species survival about that? You seem to have this idea that sentience itself is a free ticket. It's not.
Entire species never evolve as one; they branch off. The ones that cannot adapt, die. If I were succesful, and if I were to just give the technology to anybody - you realize how cruel that would actually be? They would be but dependent pets!
This idea that all people have equal capabilities is mathematically absurd, and despite an appearance of nobility, the concept is cruel and short sighted.


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Ishmael
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05 Oct 2008, 12:38 pm

slowmutant wrote:
You assume that life ends with the death of the body.


Yet you assume it doesn't. [further personal comment removed by lau].


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