Extra, extra! Greentea going for diagnosis! (of all people!)

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I know this may be a silly question, but why don't you ask for a PDD-NOS diagnosis. NLD actually does meet the criteria for this, and if he sees anything missing for AS but does see an ASD, giving the pervasive developmental disorder not otherwise specified makes sense.

I mean I will be honest, this is my diagnosis right now and I was diagnosed by a neurologist when I was seven with semantic pragmatic disorder and nonverbal learning disorder. For me this diagnosis was nearly automatic, since I am kind of atypical.

I would say PDD-NOS may be your best bet to get assistance.

starygrrl, that's a brilliant idea! I'll be sure to ask him to write that. I'm noting it down in my to do list now. Thanks!

Given your detail above, Greentea, you may do better with a second opinion and a return to the original psychiatrist with further detail and information.

I am not very normal looking. I stim and in the waiting room of my psychologist i do stretches, get up and pace, sit down, no eye contact (or face contact sometimes but looking at teeth,). and then there are the forearm tattoos - two matching nautical stars..... and the sunglasses and ipod. I can look like an aging female, ex ratbag grunge reject.

BUT there are plenty of normal looking people with ASD's in the waiting room too!

Well, sorry if I offend you with this, millie, but in your photo you look normal And lovely.

CanyonWind, I was pondering now while I study my Photography lessons, and realized how right you were before when you said that they care a whole lot who told you that you may have AS. I mentioned in passing it was a woman a few years ago, and he started inquiring who this person was to see what kind of professional background she had. When I said "just a woman who'd heard about AS", he lost interest.

Well that is understandable, I would believe a person who had gone to University and studied autism more than I would the lady in the tea shop. Having said that, the person who first knew that I had it was someone else with Aspergers, but his IQ was in excess of 150 or some other really high number.

oh that is not offensive - that is really nice to hear. I am glad to hear that, greentea. i scrub up fine on photos and still images.

it is when you get the moving images of me that the stimming and pacing and rubbery face shows up.

Greentea, I was going to read the whole thread but I don't have time, so I'll start from here and get everything said.

First - the psychiatrist only asked you the sort of questions you mentioned? He didn't administer any questionnaires or anything even?

When I was diagnosed they actually gave me a test of shape puzzle type things to do (because people with AS tend to be unusually good to those or something), as well as other stuff, but I was also tested as a child which would be very different to an adult as I was still developing.

The big problem here is that there is currently no effective AS diagnostic technique for AS in adults. It's much easier to pinpoint AS in children (as they are still developing). I think the most important thing is that the doctor should have listened to what you had to say, and followed your trains of thought with you - rather than cutting you off and applying their own reasons to your problems. The doctor should have asked you more in depth why *you* felt you constantly offended other people, and also should have asked you questions about your childhood experiences; whether you were bullied or not, etc.

A second option is maybe you ARE AS, but the AS doesn't effect your daily life severely enough for you to merit diagnosis (from the doctors opinion, everyone here would beg to differ). If you see another doctor, make sure you discuss being laid off your jobs, etc, and you didn't know why.

Pretty much, to be diagnosed with AS you need to fit the diagnostic criteria, and the AS has to severely affect your ability to function in daily life (if the effect isn't severe, then they can't diagnose you; which is why I believe a lot of AS adults can't get diagnosed; simply because they have developed enough coping skills to deal with basic life (albeit still have many problems)).

Do YOU feel you fit the diagnostic criteria for AS? (this is what they use to diagnose/not diagnose you)

DSM-IV DIAGNOSTIC CRITERIA FOR ASPERGER'S DISORDER

A.Qualitative impairment in social interaction, as manifested by at least two of the following:

(1) marked impairment in the use of multiple nonverbal behaviors such as eye-to-eye gaze, facial expression, body postures, and gestures to regulate social interaction
(2) failure to develop peer relationships appropriate to developmental level
(3) a lack of spontaneous seeking to share enjoyment, interests, or achievements with other people (e.g., by a lack of showing, bringing, or pointing out objects of interest to other people)
(4) lack of social or emotional reciprocity

B.Restricted repetitive and stereotyped patterns of behavior, interests, and activities, as manifested by at least one of the following:

(1) encompassing preoccupation with one or more stereotyped and restricted patterns of interest that is abnormal either in intensity or focus
(2) apparently inflexible adherence to specific, nonfunctional routines or rituals
(3) stereotyped and repetitive motor mannerisms (e.g., hand or finger flapping or twisting, or complex whole-body movements)
(4) persistent preoccupation with parts of objects

C.The disturbance causes clinically significant impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.

D.There is no clinically significant general delay in language (e.g., single words used by age 2 years, communicative phrases used by age 3 years).

E.There is no clinically significant delay in cognitive development or in the development of age-appropriate self-help skills, adaptive behavior (other than in social interaction), and curiosity about the environment in childhood.

F.Criteria are not met for another specific Pervasive Developmental Disorder or Schizophrenia.

If not - don't feel completely alienated. The truth is, while as a child I fit under most of the diagnostic criteria, I no longer fit under all of it as an adult. As an adult, I wouldn't be *diagnosed* with AS, but I still *am* AS if that makes any sense to you.

I went to see a psychiatrist yesterday about the increasing problems I've been having in my life, and he diagnosed me with depression and said that I definitely had a real problem with the obsessiveness characteristic of the ASD spectrum and Aspergers trait. In my psychology textbook it admits that the current diagnostic tools are not completely appropriate because they catagorize disorders along straight lines (either you have it, or you don't), which is not how the ASD spectrum is. Anyone on the ASD spectrum is going to have a unique combination of different ASD traits in varying strengths, and then they try to pigeonhole people into the diagnosis which is the closest description to their combination of traits.

The psychologist didn't de-diagnose me, or say I wasn't AS - but I do personally feel that the traits having the biggest impact in my life are less well fitted to the AS diagnosis than when I was a kid, and more generalized to the ASD spectrum. He did say that I had some kind of block (which causes some of the problems ADHD causes, but he couldn't figure out what it would be) but I don't have ADHD (I was diagnosed with ADHD at 17). After doing more research, I agree with him; the ADHD diagnosis never quite fit right to me.

Anyway, I think the most important thing is to find a psychiatrist who will *listen to you* and discuss possibilities with you (like this new one did with me). You are clearly on the ASD spectrum. Maybe your traits don't perfectly fit the AS diagnosis anymore (maybe you even fall between the cracks of different ASD disorders, without enough traits on any one disorder to diagnose you - which would suck), and maybe you do fall perfectly under the AS diagnosis and the psychiatrist is a complete idiot. Read it and let me know.

I think the psychiatrist is an idiot anyway if he didn't even discuss, or explain, the ASD spectrum to you.

Greentea, I wish you well on your diagnosis as, I hope all of your anxiety and fears are removed or atleast lessened to a great degree..


ProfessorX

Thank you, ProfessorX!

sunshower, no questionnaires. He seemed to discard the possibility of AS from the moment I sat down and started talking, maybe because I didn't look too alien to him. From then on it was questions and dismissing each of my answers with a rationalization from a different source (depression, weak motivation to bond, angry personality, clumsy personality, etc.)

An interesting point you mention is about when "the AS doesn't effect your daily life severely enough". This is such a subjective criterion!! !! Is the fact that I can't escape highly political jobs (where I'm fired for my lack of political skills) into manual labor due to my motor clumsiness an indication of severe daily effects of autism? Is the fact that I have not a soul to turn to for help or support because everyone (family and other) wants rid of me, enough of an effect on my daily life? Or the fact that my forte is languages, yet I'm fired from all jobs because languages are used to communicate with people and that's my weakest skill? I'd say yes, there are life-threatening effects of autism on my daily life. Total isolation and inability to stay off the streets by having a job. But if you just give me a questionnaire to answer, it won't show there.

In any case, Social Security here won't help unless you are ALREADY living on the streets. They won't help PREVENT the fall.

Maybe you need a 2nd opinion.

mines where telling me the same and since my aspieness doesn't allowed me to be more determined (or show more determination by answering as fast and exact as they expect from a determined NT) they where always forcedly applying their theories in me.

So I trained myself to shut them up (for like a month repeating a text in my mind). It worked!! ! I was as well a little pissed from the frustration in that appointment (started kinda like raising my voice to my psycologist-coach) so finally she listened to me.

But I have to recognize, they are ADHD especialists that have never had anything to do with aspies more than a hand shake. I talked to another schrink who worked with aspies before working with ADHDers, he listened and advised me and his advice was very valuable, he was an "aspie friendly" schrink.

Most doctors I've come along my way (no matter wich specialization) are that kinda people I call "sinics", trying to take advantage of my "social disadvantages", they are trained to be self-assured and that's another way to get it.

AS specialist are prepared for this kinds of situations and this kind of people we are, they are supposed to be trained to not take social advantage on us but rather let us comunicate. I believe you have nothing to worry about everything it's going to come out well... IF not you can still do like I did and start yelling at them that you are not traumatized, that they are the ones traumatized with your life story. it worked for me

good luck!

Not all of them are like this, you just have to find the right people... I have a lovely group of friends and all of them are NT's sure they do stupid things for girls and sometimes they would bet for one. But they are very cool and truth and they just find it cool that when I'm around they don't have to force a chat, and that they can learn irrelevant facts abut irrelevant topics. Yet, when they make parties I'm the one sitting after the laptop or making the food -giving me an excuse to avoid social interaction, but they still find me cool and interesting.

When I was diagnosed, the childhood was also looked at and this is very important because if you are AS as a child, then you still have AS as an adult but it may be harder to spot.

I think also that what we have here is Greentea's snapshots of how it went, there will also be the tester's remembered snapshots of what was said and his memories of it and there will be what actually was said and occurred. What I am saying is that its quite difficult on here for any of us to fully know and understand what was said and why and what was left out and why that might have been, so there could have been glaring omissions which another psychiatrist would have taken into account or the psychiatrist could have been excellent but having a bad day or any other combination of things.

I am still supporting the idea of you getting a second opinion and maybe getting a written report of the proceedings giving reasons why you either do or do not get the diagnosis you are expecting. I have a full and complete report of just about everything that was said and how it did or did not fit the criteria. It left me in no doubt whatsoever about the things I do well socially and my limitations.

Did you or will you be getting such a report from this man Greentea? If not, maybe you could ask for a FULL report from the next man/woman - its something I still refer to and is very useful indeed.

Yes, I agree with you - the current system doesn't work for adults with ASD disorders and it needs to be changed. I'm going in to the field of psychology - maybe one day I'll be the one who makes the changes.

The fact that he didn't discuss your childhood, didn't use any questionnaires or anything, doesn't sound objective enough to me. I agree with everyone else that you should get a second opinion.



Kaleido is right, I personally have full documentation of each meeting I've had with different psychologists dating back to the meeting when I was first diagnosed (and that meeting has several full pages of paragraphed detailed information). It really helps me to get a grasp on exactly what has gone on at different meetings over my life, and has helped me to get a clearer picture of myself .

If it helps, because I like you and trust you, I am happy to share some of the information from my original diagnosis with you through a PM (to see if you had similar problems at age 12).

Get a 2nd opinion.

If this 2nd opinion tells you that you're not aspie then you're simply not aspie.