Autism and Sterilization

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http://autism.about.com/od/transitionco ... /sexed.htm

The question from the article completely floored me:

Is it legal for parents to sterilize their children? You would think this would be a gross violation of human rights...

It is illegal.

That parent is an ignorant probably ultra-conservative racist bigotted moron.

That said, if we apply logic here, there are two reasons why that which they are proposing won't work and is thus pointless. A lot of us Aspies won't have kids anyway. Show me a woman willing to put up with Dr. House??? And second, the AS genes run in the families. NTs can be carriers. My siblings are NT but their kids may be AS. And similarly, kids of an AS parent could just as easily be NT.

Am dont think parents or appointees/guardians are allowed to do it unless there is a need seen by the persons medical team....am remember hearing of some cases of it:
http://www.wired.com/medtech/health/new ... hley_legal
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/ ... moved.html
Not really a big point but Katie has severe CP though it doesnt say it in the story about her.
-After reading through those,it looks like a 'court order' would get it.

Apologies about the subject line of the thread. It sounds a bit troll-ish, and that wasn't my intention. If I had my druthers I'd rename it "Autism and Sterilization??"

I agree that forced sterilization is wrong.

However, I wouldn't want to pass on my own genes. I'd consider THAT cruel. Not only that I'm so prone to social problems, depression, etc, but I can't really even take care of myself. I can't imagine being able to take care of a child.

And while your point about poor social skills operating as a form of birth control.. people with disabilities are also more likely to fall victim to violent crime. What about rape? It's horrible, but it happens, and what about when someone who is low functioning, getting pregnant in that way, having to go through not only the attack, but the pregnancy in the aftermath?
True, it's the perpetrators that should be sterilized..

But from a parent's point of view, if they have a child that can't take care of herself, let alone a baby, and is unlikely to be involved in consensual relationships.. I don't know. I obviously can't say I think it's right. But at the same time, neither is the alternative. I mean.. how do you deal with that?

This may sound bad, but I am not against temporary forced sterilization.

If I were the supreme commander of the world, I would require that everybody undergo temporary and reversible sterilization at the start of puberty. I dont mean removing ovaries or testes, more so just putting a clog in the plumbing, like a intrauterine device or something.

The only (legal) way to get the blockage removed would be to prove to the government that:
1. You have been in a stable relationship with somebody else for at least 2 years.
2. You are financial capable of supporting children.
3. You are mentally capable of taking care of yourself and supporting children.

I wouldnt discriminate based on age, religion, ethnicity, or neurological wiring as long as these 3 conditions can be met.

Number 1 is fairly simple. It isnt reasonable to expect 1 parent to provide everything that a child needs both financially and emotionally. While I can definitely applaud the actions of single parents, I do think it would be easier for both the parent and the children if there was another adult in the house to help out.

Number 2 is a bit more subjective. I wouldnt require the parents to be rich in order to have children, but living in massive debt and both parents working 2 jobs just to make ends meet isnt the time when you want to start having children. That's not a good situation for either the parents or the children. Perhaps an equation including current wages, debt, assets, potential increases in income, etc, would be used to determine this.

Number 3 is where it gets tricky. No offense to people who are mentally ret*d, but I dont think it would be wise to put them in charge of raising children. If a person cannot be trusted to take care of themselves for at least a few days (feed themselves, cloth themselves, use bathroom, etc.), then I dont think they should be in charge of taking care of children who require much more then they are capable of giving. The trick here is where to draw the line. Preferably, there would be some sort of unbiased test in situations where it is unclear. Perhaps housing the person in an apartment stocked with everything they need for a week to see how well they can handle living without assistance.

While this may come across as socialistic, I cant help but think that a lot of today's problems would be solved if people had grown up in better conditions. Now if you want to spend time with children, but can't meet these criteria (such as you can't find an acceptable mate), then I have no problem with you taking a job working with kids. Become a teacher, or work at a day care. I have no problems with that.

I just think it is a bit ridiculous that people who want to adopt have to go through screening assessments and prove that they would be good parents, as apposed to some single woman who can barely support herself going, getting drunk, and winding up pregnant. At the vary least, there wouldnt be a need for abortions.

Sterilizing kids sound completely sick! Give kids altered version of sex ed (reading faces, gauging partners intent, USE OF CONTRACEPTIVES, etc.) If all autistic people should be sterilized EVERYONE should be temporarily & you get LICENSED to reproduce! I know it sounds very extreme... Violation of human rights alert! Everyone or know one is my policy (NT, Aspie/Autie & other alike), period.

Tracker has good points.. Granted they're not actually doable, given that he's not the supreme commander of the world, and that absolute power corrupts absolutely.. But good points, nonetheless.

no apologies, very valuable thread

what about severely autistic young adults who want to be sexually active with other severely autistics?

i am starting out with ''severe autistics" for this discussion...step at a time

The thing is, people grow up. We discover coping techniques. Maybe, if we're lucky, we find partners who compliment our dis/abilities. For most of my life I've considered myself completely unfit to bear children. I'm in my mid thirties now and I'm starting to reconsider. My partner is forty. Neither one of us would make a great parent on our own, but together...well, together I think we would make a pretty strong parenting team. Our strengths and weaknesses compliment each other and sort of balance out in totem.

We're both high functioning, though. I somewhat ruefully have to admit to a certain amount of trepidation and prejudice against the mentally ret*d breeding. I think if you have to have a caretaker, you shouldn't become one. Of course, I also think a certain minimum level of intelligence is required to be considered human in the first place. And humans need to be raised by humans, not lower level animals. No matter how much we love the family dog, we don't make it the nanny, unless you're the parents in Peter Pan. I feel that it would be child abuse to subject a child of normal or above intelligence to the care of a severely mentally handicapped parent. Plus it leaves the parent open to manipulation and abuse by the child, presuming the child comes out NT or above. The child inevitably ends up becoming the caretaker of the parent, and often at an early age. That's totally unfair to the child.

The other thing is that always gets me about this sort of thing is that the distinction is never made between autism with retardation and autism without retardation. Autism with more or less normal mental functioning is an entirely different beast than autism with mental retardation. The high functioning autistic CAN eventually learn to self regulate and moderate many disruptive behaviors and get along moderately well in modern society - to "pass", as it were. The mentally ret*d autistic has no such luck. They're stuck in their sensory hell with no way out. Not only do I not think they should breed, but I can't help but think they probably shouldn't have been allowed to be born in the first place. It's just not fair to them or the people around them. And, again, what makes a being human but intelligence and self awareness?

The issue is not autism, but retardation. Autism exacerbates the problem, but it isn't the main issue. I happen to think autism is an evolutionary improvement, not a disorder. It's when it's paired with retardation or lack of societal support that it becomes a problem. The autistic is generally not a problem to themselves when left to their own devices without outside stimulation and interaction. I'm not really sure you can safely leave even a non autistic ret*d to their own devices, though.

All that totally non-PC stuff said, however, I still don't think permanent non consensual sterilization is the answer, unless the individual in question is an adult well past the age of consent and still requires significant caretaking in all their activities of daily life. For teens, temporary sterilization wouldn't be the worst idea in the world. Hell, I would have loved the option. I'd have preferred to have the choice taken from me until oh, say about the age of 35 (which I'm not quite at, btw...) Those 5 year shots would probably be a decent option for girls, but the birth control options pretty much suck for men in general. Luckily no one expects much out of fathers these days anyway...

the fact that there are people out there like that makes me as a black man having asperger's twice as hard. but I avoid those people if i can

Pardon my ignorance with regards to the severely autistic... but is this often a problem?

i think everybody needs to calm down. Whatever happens is what happens and no the children shouldnt be sterilized, they didnt ask to be autistic.

Yet.

just a starting point and working my way up, lol...................i like to start at the basics and i thought this would be a good one

what if 2 severe autistics were sexually active??

you know what, i am going to stop now.....maybe this should be in adults forum, imho.....but i love the topic for disdcussion...thanks

After reading that question I had a sudden urge to go pay a sperm bank a visit. I wonder why...