No wonder there's an AS epidemic!! !! !! !

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When I was laid off a couple months ago, I was given the package that all the laid off employees got that week. Inside the package was, among other things, an invitation and a brochure, all pre-paid by the company, to attend workshops and personal meetings with Social Psychologists specialized in looking for a job. At first I ignored it, thinking it must be some gimmick worth nothing. About a month later, I took an interest, just out of curiosity, and called - if only to have a good laugh. I was impressed by their courtesy and warmth, so I decided to give it a try.

The place turned out to be wonderful, the meetings and the workshops give you lots of insight into what you may be doing wrong that may be hindering your finding a job soon, and lots of verbalized non-verbal employer and interviewer stuff. Lots of practice and personality tests and feedback and theoretical knowledge, all geared to finding the most suitable job asap. I've been having a good time. Even though I don't have problems finding jobs, only keeping them. But it's fun to hear the side of the employer, and they also give you lots of positive feedback that works wonders quickly for your self-esteem.

Now hear this: in the "How to interview successfully" workshop last week, the trainer said (and I quote textually): "Fortunately, at last employers have started to realize that job skills can be learned but personality can't be changed, and so now they're putting all the focus on the candidate's personality and not on work skills." She was talking about the importance of fitting in as the first and foremost value.

No wonder suddenly so many people, like a plague, are being diagnosed with AS and applying for social benefits.

Finally, the answer to my confounding unemployability!
Employers aren't ignoring the fact that I am comprehensively qualified...
They recoil in disgust from my unsettling personality!



Unfortunately, there's basically no such thing as AS benefits where I live.
Even if there were, I think that I demonstrate just enough life skills to have my difficulties be perceived as laziness, incompetence, and self-absorption instead of some kind of disability.

The best way to get back at these people is to
1) Get past the interview- Do not disclose the AS
2) Find someone who will act as an advocate in your case
3) Be a hard worker and always do what you are explicitly told, as it may work in your favor.
4) Disclose your Asperger's to your employer if and when increasing difficulties arise
5) If you are fired, especially after an irrational conflict, find an attorney with an excellent track record and sue for discrimination.
6) Have your friend in the workplace act as a witness in the trial. Provide a monetary incentive to be given if you are to collect.

Last edited by timeisdead on 27 Jun 2009, 2:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Are you sure you heard them correctly? Surely there should be an 'un' in there, right at the beginning. It's discriminatory to choose a less qualified person over a more qualified one, just because of their personality.

I knew that about employers for years now. Unfortunately, I'm not sure they know what to look for in a personality. You would think they'd be interested in someone uninterested in office politics who is task oriented and can independently work on their own who can also think out of the box. But I guess they'd rather have a flipping idiot who wastes the day involving him/herself in gossip starting unnecessary office drama who thinks they deserve a raise because they look so damn good or something. Oh yeah, and they take credit for doing other people's work. I'm sorry, but anyone who has the personality of "I'm a winner" is generally not a winner.

I don't think this causes that plague of people being diagnosed AS, but it is one of the biggest reasons why our economy is turning to s**t. No, the AS diagnosis is that psychologists have trends just like fashion. ADHD is so last season, autism is what's in. But, they will tell you it's just that professionals are now getting better informed on the subject. I kinda prefer it because there isn't a pill for it like ADHD. You can treat some depression and stuff, but there isn't an amphetamine cocktail being prescribed as a default for the syndrome. I don't care what grown ups do to their bodies, but I hate seeing the epidemic affect the kids the way it has. But anyway, now a 15 year old can save for his college by selling his meds at school now that Aderall is the new cocaine.

We must play hardball in order to get by. Society has disadvantaged us and thus we must do whatever we can in order to survive. We must not allow ourselves to be victimized by these tyrants.

Magneto, good question! In the language here, there's no "un" prefix. Fortunately and unfortunately are 2 very different expressions, so there's no way one can mis-hear them and confuse one with the other. The reason she was saying "Fortunately" is that she's a trainer for employers more than for employees, that's her profession, and she (and all other corporate organizers) have been trying to convince employers for years that they should check only personality and very little work skills and experience. She also said "Fortunately" because she thought she was talking only to NTs, and NTs are very good at fitting in, so she meant to encourage us that just by being one's (NT) self, one has 90% of the interview won. It's UNfortunate only for Aspies. And this is why Aspies, for the first time in history, can't make a living at all and need to run en masse to be diagnosed and get social benefits ASAP.

I already knew this, because of my own experience, but I'd never dreamed that they'd admit it openly.

Once upon a time, a shoe-repairer had to know how to repair shoes, period. Nowadays, he has to know self-marketing and shoe-politics mainly, and a little of how to repair shoes. Same for all kinds of work.

I agree, word by word. That's the conclusion I reached after I heard her say that. I'm done with integrity, consideration and approval seeking. I plan to work 6 months a year and collect unemployment insurance the other 6 months, and laugh in their faces each time they fire me, and not care one bit what employers think of me. Till I'm old enough to retire.

Congratulations for seeing the light! In refusing to submit to a system of perpetual injustice, you are slowly eroding it. They want victims to prey upon and love to take advantage of any real or perceived vulnerabilities. The only way to get through to them is by negative reinforcement. If possible, you can take it to court.

But what if they worked for a shoe repairing firm? That means the firm does the marketing for them.

I plan on being a Zoologist. Then I can go to a foriegn country, spend massive stretches of time alone just studying animals, and communicating via a satellite linkup. At least, that's what I hope. While I'm not doing that, I'll be a tour guide on something I'm passionate about. That way, I can lecture all I want and they won't be able to fire me, because that's my job!

It's part of the emotional intelligence fixation by business. While a qualified employee looks better on paper, the disruption they can cause in a team environment due to personality and social skills is ultimately more costly than decreased production due to skillset. This isn't entirely aimed at those with social problems due to disabilities, as leaders who like to compulsively yell and and have their ego stroked attest (particularly the douchebags you see settling in middle management like some kind of foul sediment).

I'm not sure where I sit on the issue. Obviously it's detrimental to those with AS, but the reasoning behind it is more than just instilling conformity. The potential for discrimination needs to be addressed though, maybe through some sort of sensitivity training. I'm not a fan of workshops, as people resent the preachiness and just end up secretly (or not so secretly) reinforcing the prejudice they are being instructed on. Another option, although it's largely unpopular, is affirmative action. I don't think any minority can match our employment statistics (10-12% employed full time, inferior jobs, etc.). We are perhaps the most openly discriminated against group right now, and what's more, we have no voice pleading our cause (the few that do are questionable. I don't like Grandin, she seems to be cashing in on her pseudo advocacy with little benefits for the group she pretends to champion).

Or maybe it is a bad idea and merely serves to foster groupthink

I knew this from experience as well. However, it was shocking to hear something similar said explicitly a few months ago. I was told that conferences are not about the science, but about the coffee break. Apparently, the only way to get jobs is to get your face well known and chat to people during coffee breaks, no matter how good a researcher you are.

My family members, all of whom have social difficulties to some degree, also have difficulty with employment.

I know. I have that problem myself. I think maybe once I get closer to graduation, or when I start searching for more internship type jobs, I will try to find a trustworthy NT to do mock interviews and see if I can come across as a quiet, focused sort of person. That is the easiest assumption people might make when they see me working on something; and I would rather have them see me as a bit of a hermit, but good at what I do, than assume I am "crazy". I just need to keep my meltdowns out of the public eye, and I may even be able to mention Asperger's and have them see it as a "geek syndrome" that makes me fit in just fine in their engineering department, instead of a barrier to employment.

since when?

I suggest learning how to game the personality tests and evaluations. By learning what each question on one of these tests or evaluation is looking for, you can supply the optimum answer. Just figure out the type of personality you want to project and then answer the questions accordingly. Learning how to game these test takes much time to research but doing so may pay big rewards.

Yeah, but a lot of them don't use personality tests or inventories. They just base it from "the feel" during the interview. In the old school process even, and this has gone on for many years now, decades I'd say, the resume is to see if you can do the job while the interview is to see if you can do the job with the people you'll be working with. Ideally, they are also looking for people who set off the vibe that they are on top of their game, meaning they will show up to work on time and meet deadlines type thing. That's why many also do credit checks and drug testing and things like that. I've heard of a place that will send someone to look into your car while you are being interviewed just to see how clean it is.