ToM: Hiding Items & Being Socially "Engaging"

Post Reply New Topic

PART ONE

Can I have people's opinions please, as to whether a child hiding something in itself indicates sound theory of mind?

Did you ever hide things as a child? The age of the child in question was 7.

Do you consider, that a child of that age, having seen another child regularly get hold of the item they wanted first, would in the end start hiding it so that they could always be sure to get it, as categorically possessing sound ToM (theory of mind)? The item in question was an item that the child was fixated on, only wanted that one, and wanted it every day (so was quite an obsessional thing).

Now, anyone that did hide anything, (that has AS of course) please explain your motivation for hiding the item.

PART TWO

Have you ever been told that you appear confident, socially engaging etc., but underneath you are struggling so much and whoever you are talking to just doesn't know how difficult the social situation is for you? In other words are you good at masking it?

as for part one, i'm not sure if that would indicate theory of mind, but it is indeed something i did myself: hiding my favourite toy out of a set (like my favourite hotwheel) so i was certain i could play with that specific one.

part two is also something i hear often, when i tell people about my AS; coincidentally, i talked about that just the other day, that i usually appear to be the most 'normal' person in my house, when there isn't something going on that takes a lot of my attention/energy

Thanks a lot for your reply.

How long ago were you diagnosed and what type of professional diagnosed you?

I can give info for Part One:

I used to hide things alot from a young age, as my father was generally very aggressive and scared me. Im not sure on TOM - it seemed neccesary to hide these things, or i would be punished or shouted at.
I didnt like shouting, as he would stare right at me and as direct eye contact has always been terrifying for me, this was akin to being violently threatened.

I consider myself fairly intelligent now however?

Part 1: I used to hide a little teapot of raisins in my closet so I would have something to eat when I refused to eat dinner (usually due to texture aversions). My mom eventually discovered them by following a trail of ants.

Part 2: All the time. Everyone thinks I can get along fine, but it's only as long as I don't have to maintain the ruse for an extended time. It's very difficult, and I will eventually break down and need time alone. You can usually tell this time is coming when my eye contact deteriorates.

theory of mind doesn't exist. the classic test for it is plain stupid. the correct answer is that the child thinks it has been moved because the child KNOWS it has been moved and doesn't understand the world MERELY by it's few human senses but rather has an intutiive systematic advanced thinking.

Part One: Not really.

Part Two: I have had soooo many people tell me I'm great socially. It is always after only a brief interaction. After the person has been with me a few times, all my quirks come out no matter what I do.

The reason I'm told I'm good socially is that I have made a literal study of "how to be social" since I was approximately 11 years old and tired of getting bullied constantly by the other kids and being alone all the time. So I know how to do it, yes. It's exhausting though and my holes always show through eventually. It's been 30+ years of study and I still screw it up eventually.

I can get by, though, and even seem like a "great person" (from an NT POV) for a little while at a time.

I hid things as a kid and I thought they would find it rather than looking for it. I did it to tease people. I would think it would indicate TOM if their intent was to hide it so you can't find it. Sometimes it's unintentional because they move something and put it somewhere and it can seem like they hid it. Toddlers hide their things all the time but they don't have a TOM and they just like to have special spots for their toys. My son did this a lot when he was an infant and a year old. I saw his toys were disappearing and I didn't know where they went until I was cleaning and I saw he put them behind the lazy boy in his bumpo. I thought he actually lost them. I haven't seen him do it in a while now. I don't know if he was trying to hide them or if he just put them there.


As for part two, I have had it happen to me. People don't know what is going on inside my head so they think I am fine. I don't tell them about AS. I think when people first meet me, they cannot tell but after a while it starts to show.

I hope this doesn't sound dumb, but what does ToM stand for?

not at all, Theory of Mind. It's the ability to understand what others are thinking or put yourself in their place etc. I believe.

1 -- Would a disengaged person know how to do this. IMHO, the kid's not totally clueless, if he knows what's going to happen in advance and is planning ahead.
2 -- In my experience, calling someone too proud is meant as discouragement. I see myself, later on, in pictures, or glance at mirror. I am visibly uncomfortable, which is to say not good at hiding it.

Other times, I am not even paying attention, and hear a remark like this.

The observer may be imagining things about you, whether good or bad.