Why was autism formerly only a wealthy disease?

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Tyri0n
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02 Feb 2013, 2:33 am

From Eduard Seguin in 1869:

"Among the wealthier classes, idiocy is not only oftener aggravated by accessory diseases, but also complicated with abnormal semi-capacities or disordered instincts, which produce heterogeneous types to an almost unlimited extent. It is from this class, almost exclusively, that we have musical, mathematical, architectural, and other varieties of the idiot savant; the useless protrusion of a single faculty, accompanied by a woful general impotence."

http://autismcrisis.blogspot.com/2012/0 ... story.html

Assuming this is talking about autism/Aspergers, why would it be primarily a disease found among the wealthy? Could this support either the Vitamin D or the toxicity hypothesis (wealthy people in the 19th century were either more likely to use chemicals or less likely to be in the sun than poor people while technology and suburban living later spread these factors to the poor as well)?

EDIT: Link fixed.

Not making this stuff up. The link contains descriptions of modern scholarship which basically agrees that the term "idiot savant" as used in the late 19th century likely referred frequently but not exclusively to individuals on the autism spectrum. I've read this other places, too, which makes me think it's a widely-held view among modern academics.



Last edited by Tyri0n on 02 Feb 2013, 3:22 am, edited 3 times in total.

Zodai
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02 Feb 2013, 2:39 am

Non-royal autistics would probably have meltdowns more frequently, and get admitted as crazies/witches/etc.


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eric76
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02 Feb 2013, 2:40 am

That's a quite interesting conjecture.

I suspect that servant women working in wealthy homes in the old days probably didn't get much sun, either, but then my impression is that they were usually single. Is that right?



Tsproggy
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02 Feb 2013, 2:41 am

Quote:
Assuming this is talking about autism/Aspergers


Summing up this entire thread and what it will ever be.



Verdandi
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02 Feb 2013, 2:45 am

Poorer families were significantly less likely to get their children evaluated in this way, and they'd have fewer opportunities for any talented children to show off their abilities. It's not that autism was primarily an upper class condition, it's that upper class autistic individuals were more likely to be identified, and that talented autistic people were more likely to have their talents nurtured.



eric76
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02 Feb 2013, 2:46 am

The link doesn't want to work, at least on my computer. It sees the period after the html as part of the url. Here is a fix with url tags enclosing the link and the period after so it should work much better.

Tyri0n wrote:



Raziel
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02 Feb 2013, 2:48 am

Tsproggy wrote:
Quote:
Assuming this is talking about autism/Aspergers


Summing up this entire thread and what it will ever be.


*agree*


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Verdandi
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02 Feb 2013, 2:57 am

Raziel wrote:
Tsproggy wrote:
Quote:
Assuming this is talking about autism/Aspergers


Summing up this entire thread and what it will ever be.


*agree*


Somewhere I have a link to descriptions of conditions described as "idiocy"or "imbecilism" and so on, and it's pretty clear from the descriptions which ones describe autistic people.

I'd have to find it again to see if "idiocy" was the primarily autistic description, but it's not like Tyri0n is pulling this stuff out of nowhere.



Raziel
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02 Feb 2013, 2:58 am

eric76 wrote:
The link doesn't want to work, at least on my computer. It sees the period after the html as part of the url. Here is a fix with url tags enclosing the link and the period after so it should work much better.

Tyri0n wrote:


Try it without the "dot":

http://autismcrisis.blogspot.de/2012/04 ... story.html


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eric76
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02 Feb 2013, 4:33 am

Raziel wrote:
eric76 wrote:
The link doesn't want to work, at least on my computer. It sees the period after the html as part of the url. Here is a fix with url tags enclosing the link and the period after so it should work much better.

Tyri0n wrote:


Try it without the "dot":

http://autismcrisis.blogspot.de/2012/04 ... story.html


I'm not sure what you are getting at. Did you even try the link first?

There is NO dot after the ".html" in the link the way I did it.



Raziel
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02 Feb 2013, 5:46 am

eric76 wrote:
Raziel wrote:
eric76 wrote:
The link doesn't want to work, at least on my computer. It sees the period after the html as part of the url. Here is a fix with url tags enclosing the link and the period after so it should work much better.

Tyri0n wrote:


Try it without the "dot":

http://autismcrisis.blogspot.de/2012/04 ... story.html


I'm not sure what you are getting at. Did you even try the link first?

There is NO dot after the ".html" in the link the way I did it.


I can see one! 8O
Doesn't matter...!


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Verdandi
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02 Feb 2013, 6:02 am

Raziel wrote:
eric76 wrote:
Raziel wrote:
eric76 wrote:
The link doesn't want to work, at least on my computer. It sees the period after the html as part of the url. Here is a fix with url tags enclosing the link and the period after so it should work much better.

Tyri0n wrote:


Try it without the "dot":

http://autismcrisis.blogspot.de/2012/04 ... story.html


I'm not sure what you are getting at. Did you even try the link first?

There is NO dot after the ".html" in the link the way I did it.


I can see one! 8O
Doesn't matter...!


It's excluded from the link, because he used url tags around the actual link.

It would have been easier, but much less interesting to just delete the period. :D



Rascal77s
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02 Feb 2013, 7:01 am

Tyri0n wrote:
From Eduard Seguin in 1869:

"Among the wealthier classes, idiocy is not only oftener aggravated by accessory diseases, but also complicated with abnormal semi-capacities or disordered instincts, which produce heterogeneous types to an almost unlimited extent. It is from this class, almost exclusively, that we have musical, mathematical, architectural, and other varieties of the idiot savant; the useless protrusion of a single faculty, accompanied by a woful general impotence."

http://autismcrisis.blogspot.com/2012/0 ... story.html

Assuming this is talking about autism/Aspergers, why would it be primarily a disease found among the wealthy? Could this support either the Vitamin D or the toxicity hypothesis (wealthy people in the 19th century were either more likely to use chemicals or less likely to be in the sun than poor people while technology and suburban living later spread these factors to the poor as well)?

EDIT: Link fixed.

Not making this stuff up. The link contains descriptions of modern scholarship which basically agrees that the term "idiot savant" as used in the late 19th century likely referred frequently but not exclusively to individuals on the autism spectrum. I've read this other places, too, which makes me think it's a widely-held view among modern academics.


He's not talking about autistic people but the same thing would apply for autistic people. You you can't read this quote from the perspective of someone in 2013. This was 1869 and cities were concentrations of wealth, education and people. The wealthy minority were the only ones who were visible. Most of the population at that time lived in rural areas and travel was very limited. Much of the population consisted of poor farmers who were tied to the land they depended on for food. These were people who often never saw a doctor in their lives and most certainly never came in contact with anyone who had a college degree. When husband, wife and kids all worked on the farm to barely keep themselves fed they couldn't afford to take care of severely disabled kids so I'm sure quite a few got a premature burial too.



Ekor
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02 Feb 2013, 8:50 pm

Cause only the wealthy could afford the lab and genetic tests to determine whether they are autistic or not--it is a very subtle disorder.



Matt62
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02 Feb 2013, 9:04 pm

Actually, there were no tests in that time frame. The usual fate of/for someone with an ASD was the insane asylum or prison. Earlier in time, there was always the stake & a nice bon fire waiting..
The reasons it *SEEMS* like there were more is because the wealthy could buy silence or take care of ( very discretely of course!) family members who were TOO different for their own good...


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Verdandi
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02 Feb 2013, 10:28 pm

Matt62 wrote:
Actually, there were no tests in that time frame. The usual fate of/for someone with an ASD was the insane asylum or prison. Earlier in time, there was always the stake & a nice bon fire waiting..
The reasons it *SEEMS* like there were more is because the wealthy could buy silence or take care of ( very discretely of course!) family members who were TOO different for their own good...


^^^^^

That's it right there.