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natesmom
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15 May 2009, 5:51 pm

Don't criticize me please.

My husband seems like an undx aspergers. He has been talking a lot about a girl he works with who has a computer science masters degree - she is a computer programmer. That's fine. I don't care. She sounds pretty nice. He gives her compliments about how good she is. Fine, I am sure she is good at her job. He doesn't ever give me compliments, which wouldn't be that big of deal if he was the same with everyone. He tells me all about her on a daily basis. He works with other guys and girls who seem better than her yet never talks about them. I wonder if he just doesn't see a reason to compliment me because it's not related to computers. He is so into computers so he knows how to compliment her. I guess I can understand that or at least try to understand

Went out to lunch today with two girls w he works with. One of the girls was the girl he always talks about. It was a good lunch. I noticed she was a lot like him. She had really no facial expressions when she talked and was really all mouth when she spoke. There wasn't a lot to read on her face because she provided no feedback. I noticed that he made a lot more eye contact with her than he has ever done with me. I have a lot of facial expressions when I talk. Much more than the average person.


QUESTION: Do you think that is just more difficult for him to process my facial expressions, my intonations combined with the words I say - so it's hard to make eye contact with me as opposed to this other girl with hardly any expression??

She did ask some questions such as "How did you two meet, anyways." There was a lot more that went on so I can't help if they have some sort of emotional connection. I won't read too much into it. She seems like a great person and they have computers in common.

We don't talk a lot. I think I am boring to him because I don't share in his interests. When we go out to dinner, he hardly looks at me and doesn't talk about much. I feel bad for him in that I am probably boring for him. Life is hard. I don't know if this girl is aspie but she certainly has some of the traits. I do think he would be happier with a girl who has aspergers and shares in his interest of computers. No matter how hard I try, I just can't get into it.

The other girl knows computers as well but he was different with her. He was the same with her as he is with me. She is a lot like me, though.



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15 May 2009, 6:02 pm

No idea. You probably should talk to him though if you are having these concerns.



natesmom
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15 May 2009, 6:09 pm

I did. He doesn't say a lot at all. I haven't been specific about the facial expressions, though. I wanted to ask people on here if they have found that to be true. I could completely be off base. I did ask him if he wishes he married someone who was into computers or in that field. I wasn't trapping him, I honestly just wanted to know. He took about a minute to respond and then answered "no". He then was quiet and looked at the ground for a while. He tends to do that sometimes. Am I being completely NT or what?? LOL? Obsessing and thinking too much about potentially stupid things is what I do.

I truly feel bad for him and wonder if he truly wishes he did. His obsession is computers and I don't share in that obsession. It's quite sad.

I may bring up the facial expressions, I may not. My whole "thinking about it" could end up being completely stupid and perhaps just an "NT" thing LOL. If I bring it up to him, he may perceive it as truly stupid. Perhaps it is



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15 May 2009, 6:25 pm

Very interesting post. And some of those of us who are on the spectrum have the same problems, but from the other side. I think it is very difficult for people who try to bridge the neurological gap between autie or aspie and neurotypical in terms of an intimate relationship. Our brains are different, so we are different, we think differently, and sometimes our focus on what each thinks is "important" is different. My first husband (and father of my adult daughter) had a mental disability. My current husband, a lawyer, has significant brain injuries and seems to have some musical savant abilities. Both of my husbands relate to me much more like you describe your husband relating to you. The deep intimate emotional connection I want and need just isn't there -- and I don't think it is because they don't want it to be there; I don't think either of them has that capacity. In the last year or so, I have met a neurotypical who is the most amazing person I have ever known. But, even with his enormously talented ability to handle my savant autism, there are time we just miss the same wavelength. I am not saying this is necessarily a bad thing, just that it is -- and it is something to be very aware of and must be worked at and remain attentive and vigilent to, especially if you care about the person. I can see how difficult it would be to have an intimate relationship as a savant autie with a prodigious neurotypical, and I have never had such a relationship. And I certainly did not go looking for this person; he just came into my life and caught me by surprise. But I can see the capacity is there for the deep emotional connection another autie or aspie or other acquired savant does not have the capacity to give me -- and such a relationship, believe it or not depsite my savant autism, is something I deeply crave and I find exciting beyond the highest high. I am not sure I have really offered any answer to your question, or one that is satisfying or comforting to you. I only know that the differences between those of us on the spectrum and neurotypicals are very real. But that does not mean the deep, hot, passionate, enduring relationship cannot be there between these differences. Perhaps it is the insight of these differences that is most important -- and maybe even the most invigorating aspect.



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15 May 2009, 6:40 pm

MKDP wrote:
. I can see how difficult it would be to have an intimate relationship as a savant autie with a prodigious neurotypical, and I have never had such a relationship. And I certainly did not go looking for this person; he just came into my life and caught me by surprise. But I can see the capacity is there for the deep emotional connection another autie or aspie or other acquired savant does not have the capacity to give me -- and such a relationship, believe it or not depsite my savant autism, is something I deeply crave and I find exciting beyond the highest high. I am not sure I have really offered any answer to your question, or one that is satisfying or comforting to you. I only know that the differences between those of us on the spectrum and neurotypicals are very real. But that does not mean the deep, hot, passionate, enduring relationship cannot be there between these differences. Perhaps it is the insight of these differences that is most important -- and maybe even the most invigorating aspect.


Thank you. This has truly helped me. My husband's IQ is above 155+. He topped out on the WAIS (IQ for adults) so he would need another intelligence test to get an accurate assessment. He almost scored perfect on the mensa test. I was assessed to be in the high average range in with a few areas of very superior and a few others as being pretty low. I function as completely average. I am pretty much NT although I have doubted it at times (have adhd and sensory issues). I am not a genius like your husband so I wonder if it even more difficult for my husband because the IQ difference between us is pretty significant. We do like to talk about some of the same things such as astronomy and politics. He is twice exceptional: genius and aspergers. I know that my husband also deeply craves that emotional connection, I know he does. He has told me that he wants to feel close to people but something is blocking him. That aspect has often caused him to go into a deep depression combined with elevated anxiety. I don't understand the depression at all but try to be there for him.

I really need to figure out how to make that connection. I will talk with him tonight and ask him some questions. I think he feels I don't listen to him when he talks a lot about computers. He really wants to teach me computers and perhaps I should take an interest and learn some basic programming. I could end up being pretty good.

I see now it is possible. I really need to figure out how to bridge the gaps that we have. I honestly think that him being a genius is blocking us more than the aspergers. Perhaps I am wrong.



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15 May 2009, 7:03 pm

My husband is not a genius; it is the neurotypical person I mentioned who is, and I am a savant genius with autism. I know that sort of mixes everything up. I don't how many of us with spectrum conditions have the capacity for a truly deep emotional connection on the same terms as a neurotypical; some of us do. I don't fatigue so much when I use these parts of my brain in the context of an intimate emotional relationship that I find exciting, but I do when when I push myself to use higher cognitive levels to spar with some of the other neurotypical linear thinker lawyers I encounter in their linear arena; I can do it, but difficult to keep up using these parts of my brain intensely and I get fatigue and have to take down time to recharge. I don't usuallly let people know this about me, because people like to attack the vulnerabilities. But this is another part of the differences in brain wiring, if the spectrum person can even use this higher cognition at all. Sometimes people want to do something they can't do, but if you love the person, you have to accept who and what they are and what capabilities they do/do not have. I do happen to have this cognition, though it is highly energy depleting for me when I engage it, and I constantly push myself in this regard because .. I enjoy it ! But for me, in my own heart and soul, I need this deep intimate emotional connection my husband does not have the capacity to give me. Does that mean I don't love him or he doesn't love me ? Or I don't care about or appreciate him ? No, not at all. But it does mean, I have this very deep need that is as significant to me as my craving and need for air or water -- essential ingredients that nurture life. How do I resolve this -- I don't know. I am very conflicted, but I know in my heart what I need and where I have found it and my hope it will grow. I also should say, my husband does not have a problem with this, because he is often very aloof and wants significant alone time. I wouldn't worry so much about the eye contact thing -- I have trouble with this also, although I try very hard; but again it is an energy depleter when I make efforts to be very attentive to eye gaze. I am off to ride my horse. Will check back later.



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15 May 2009, 7:27 pm

If you are NT you are probably much more valuable as a partner than a Aspie would be,you are strong in the areas where we are weak.Maybe you should confront him about his frequent talk about this woman if it is causing you unease.He should be made aware that it is wrong to make your partner uncomfortable like this.As for computers,I see no need for you to take up his hobbies-everyone needs to have their own interests.



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15 May 2009, 8:32 pm

natesmom wrote:
Don't criticize me please.

My husband seems like an undx aspergers. He has been talking a lot about a girl he works with who has a computer science masters degree - she is a computer programmer. That's fine. I don't care. She sounds pretty nice. He gives her compliments about how good she is. Fine, I am sure she is good at her job. He doesn't ever give me compliments, which wouldn't be that big of deal if he was the same with everyone. He tells me all about her on a daily basis. He works with other guys and girls who seem better than her yet never talks about them. I wonder if he just doesn't see a reason to compliment me because it's not related to computers. He is so into computers so he knows how to compliment her. I guess I can understand that or at least try to understand

First of all, I could be way off base. Being on the spectrum myself, I am no expert. But I can be (mentally) all over a person or a topic, but not have any desire to have a relationship with it. Notice I say "it." It' the topic that I am usually attracted to. If your husband is Aspie-like, he could just be all over this person with whom he can talk computer so well, (mentally) but have no desire for intimacy. I am thinking that this is what you fear. Speaking from my own experience, as an Aspie female, I have had jealous NT women confront me about certain guys that I had seemed to be enjoying talking to. What I had been enjoying was the conversation, especially the topic, if it happened to be a current obsession. The NT women mistakenly thought that it was the guy I was interested in. Not at all. Because the Nt mind works differently. No offense, but I have seen NT women "appear" to be interested in a topic, when it was really the guy they were interested in. This back door approach has always puzzled me. This interest in topic but not necessarily the person, might be going on with your husband and his co-worker.
natesmom wrote:
Went out to lunch today with two girls he works with. One of the girls was the girl he always talks about. It was a good lunch. I noticed she was a lot like him. She had really no facial expressions when she talked and was really all mouth when she spoke. There wasn't a lot to read on her face because she provided no feedback. I noticed that he made a lot more eye contact with her than he has ever done with me. I have a lot of facial expressions when I talk. Much more than the average person.

Here, you seem to be comparing yourself to your perceived rival. This is a female thing. Fearing that she is a rival, you are tallying up points for you both. An exercise in futility. What the man in this situation is thinking, is what is relevant. You might just casually ask your husband if he feels physically attracted to this woman. Casually, not in an accusing way.

natesmom wrote:
QUESTION: Do you think that is just more difficult for him to process my facial expressions, my intonations combined with the words I say - so it's hard to make eye contact with me as opposed to this other girl with hardly any expression??

This is irrelevant. Comparing yourself to another person is futile and hurtful as well. Again, just ask him.
natesmom wrote:
She did ask some questions such as "How did you two meet, anyways." There was a lot more that went on so I can't help if they have some sort of emotional connection. I won't read too much into it. She seems like a great person and they have computers in common.

Again, it might be the topic that is connecting them.


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15 May 2009, 9:18 pm

If it’s not too personal, why did you two get married? What ever that was there should still be there, use it.



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15 May 2009, 9:29 pm

Sorry..I have only just skimmed the responses thus far, but have you ever considered making your relationship more flexible or fluid....as in opening the relationship a bit? It might make things weird at first but easier in the long run....I don't have a lot of time time to explain why....but it might ease tension for both of you.



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15 May 2009, 9:43 pm

print out your post and give it to him to read
u need to tell him what you are thinking


u can tell him

"i luv u. i want to be near u. i want to treat u like a man." that will make him feel very good and i bet that other woman won't be that smart to say something like this to him.


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15 May 2009, 10:26 pm

I can understand why you would feel uncomfortable about this.

NTs are accustomed to situations like this as being thinly-veiled mind games. If a husband has been distant lately, and begins talking on and on about a female co-worker, then in NT society, he is trying to make his wife feel jealous and trying to spite her.
You probably understand that your husband isn't trying to make you feel unwanted, but you are uneasy just the same.

People with AS don't really "do" mind games. At least not well. The most likely situation is that he just likes going on and on about computers, and this woman is who he does that with. You might be mistaking the talk about computers as talk about this woman. In his head, the computers may be more important than the person he spoke to about the computers.

Sometimes, people with AS can miss subtle social rules that state that talking about other women to your wife is taboo.

But, I would have to agree with other people that talking to your husband would be best. When you make it clear that you have intentions to sit down and talk for a long time about serious topics, then most people with AS will understand, and give you the common courtesy of explaining yourself.

Does your husband know that he is possibly AS? If he knows and accepts, then he might try harder to work on communication and social barriers.



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16 May 2009, 7:27 am

My IQ is not nearly so great as that of your husbands, mine is a mere 139, and knowing this and being married to and "averaged IQ" NT has is advantages and disadvantages for both of us. This has not kept us from being married for 13 years, or together for 15. I can understand, from your husbands point of view, why this girl might be so, (as you might put it), attractive. It may not be a physical attraction, (just because you think she is pretty, doesnt mean that he does), but it might be. The problem with most of us on the spectrum, is we lack the ability to connect emotionally with a person in a "normal fashion". It is just my opinion, that yopur husband has probably found someone with whom he can converse with, at his level, or pretty close to it, and not feel like he is talking to a tree stump.having been there on at least a couple of occasions myself, I can tell you that this can be a very exciting thing for me, but it doesnt make me want to cheat on my wife, or leave her, or anything along those lines. I married my wife on pupose, and I know why i married her. the reasons that i did so, are the very reasons I wish to remain with her, as a previous poster said, she offers lots of strenghts in my weakest areas, and the reverse is also true. To quote the movie, "Jerry MacGuire", she, "completes me." I do feel like I am as close to a "whole person" with her in my life, as i think is possible for me.
In your position, I can understand your, "misgivings". You are attemting to see the world thru they eyes of someone with aspergers, and while I applaud your attempt, I must tell you, that that is a bit like trying to see the world like a man who has never had vision. You can never know what that is really like, because even if u go blind, you have seen things, you have mental images to fall back on, memories and whatnot. I am not saying this to insult or put u down, but rather to try to let you know that, like ym own wife, there are some things she just doesnt get, and she can only "try" to imagine what it must be like.
I love to cuddle, but my sensitivity to touch, only allows for approximately 10-15 mins max, before I have to shy away from her, even if i want to keep on cuddling.
In her eyes, I can see how she could infer that I must not really want to touch her all that much, or that I must not be attracted to her. I have learned to try to compesate in other ways, (more compliments, extra kisses, spending more time in the same room together...doing more of the things that she likes, etc.). it doesnt totally make up for what she is lacking from me, and I know this, but I cant change my brains wiring, not matter how much I long too.
To sum things up, I think your husband has found someone with whom he can connect to on a mental level, and speak with them verbally, and not feel like he's lost em by the third sentence. There might be a pysical attraction there, but I doubt it is anything that would threaten your relationship, if there is. ( I know most of us who have AS experience so little in the way of romance and love, while we might long for it, most of us wont trade a 1 night stand, or even a 1 week fling, for the stableness of and already existing relationship). And finally, I think your husband, like most with AS, simply cannot explain to you, (although I am sure he wishes he could), the emotions that he feels for you. He probably assumes that you just know these things. I did that for years, I just assumed my wife knew how much I loved her. I would still say I loved her, but never with any great detail. Why, part of the problem many with AS have, is handling information that is abstract, or intangable, and love is both.
I suggest that you pick up the book, "The Complete Guide to Asperger's Syndrome", by Tony Atwood. Both of you should read it, you first, then him.
I believe that it will help you learn more about your husband, and how his mind works, and after he reads it, he will understand himself and his limitations better. And because of how the book is written, I know it helped me understand NT's just a little bit better.
I wish you all the best of luck, and hope that eventually you can find the peace that you are looking for in your relationship.


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16 May 2009, 7:53 am

natesmom wrote:
Went out to lunch today with two girls that he works with.


Did you eat lunch alone with these two girls? Or was your husband there also? I´m guessing that you and your husband ate lunch with these two computer-programers, right?

Maybe he´s interested in "computers" and this girl. But he just likes her because she knows computers and stuff, and he looks at her as a role-model of some sort, perhaps.

Surley, he still likes you, he just likes to talk about the industry, or whatever you wanna call it, I dont even know what he works with.



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16 May 2009, 11:14 am

If you think he's aspie, you know he's honest to a fault. Sometimes, I think I'm too honest with my husband about guys I think might be hot and guys I just think are interesting. I compare men to Jaguars. I will check out the vehicle, but that doesn't mean I'm going to run out and buy one.

As far as, "Is there an attraction?" Obviously something is there, whether it be her lack of facial expressions make him more comfortable or if it's just plain chemistry. Fortunately, it sounds like the same type of attraction hererosexual people may feel with the same sex (like why two girls can become BFFs). Think about it. You can meet two girls who are exactly alike, yet you can easily become friends with only one of them and enemies with the other.

As far as being concerned as your relationship with him (which right now sounds a lot more important to the both of you than his relationship with co-workers)... If you don't like computers, yes try to get to know it better-who knows it might be your new thing, but if not, don't force yourself into pretending to like something you don't. If your man is really aspie, he's going to want something real and sincere out of it. My husband is an electrician and has a special interest in his job, weapons, and guitars. All three topics are pretty boring to me. But, I like math, and that's something shared between his electrical interest as well as mine. The guitars, I don't know much about them. He likes Rock and I like rap. But, I also play piano, and I know more about music theory whereas he knows more about playing by ear. So we find many common interests within our unique interests to share with each other, so maybe you won't like computer programming, but maybe you'd like to come up with computer program ideas and concepts (like I wish I had a program that did this and that), or maybe you'll like graphic design or recording music. Or maybe you are really into facebook and have some application ideas for it. Either way, you don't have to be a computer nerd to have a long mutually enjoyable discussion with people who like computers. I should also add, my husband and I do have many little interests that we do share like movies.

The main thing though, even if you have no interest in the topic, you should have interest in your man's accomplishments. Have you ever cleaned the house and just wanted someone to come see it? You paint the walls, and you can't wait to show someone. Same thing.

As far as him being a genius, that does make it harder. I would say if you are going to learn anything, instead of focusing on learning what he knows (i.e. computers), maybe you should first focus on his process to things (and you can easily learn that by watching him teach what he knows with computers but also teach him something you know that he doesn't know that much about..even if it's how to cook your best dish). Geniuses weren't born with the ability to do math and a wide vocabulary (things the IQ meaures). They had to learn those things from the same sources your average intelligence people do. Imagine it like gardening. Two kids in school can be given seeds from the same package and be assigned to plant them into little pots of the same type of dirt. Both kids could use the same water source and sunlight to help their little seeds grow. What would be the difference if one plant grew better than the other? The process. Geniuses just tend to approach things differently than the norm, and they tend to do that with all aspects (from learning mathematical functions to absorbing the info the spouse has to say). It's not the only thing that seperates the gifted from the average, but it's one factor that is in your control to learn. Learning that would seriously make things easier on your end.

On this one, I should follow my own advice. My hubby is really smart, but not quite the genius your man is. Either way, I complain all the time that he doesn't listen to me when I talk and he has absolutely no consideration for me or my needs (like giving me a break from the children / momtime, or letting me sleep on occasion, or helping out around the house a little, maybe at least picking up after himself). I've tried wording it in ten million different ways to get him to understand, and I'm starting to think maybe he just doesn't care. But now, maybe my hit or miss approach isn't working because I have yet to really try to learn how he learns. Basically, I'm trying to get him to learn that he needs to pick up after himself, and I'm failing as the teacher.

Anyway, the best idea I think I have right now...give me advice on my problems I listed here thinking about your marriage in the process. You may do what I just did and give yourself better advice than anyone else could.

Also, one advice given to me in the past...I used to worry about my husband cheating, especially right after I had my first child with him. I had quite a lot of circumstantial evidence. Finally, I found a possible way to find out, and my friend asked me, "Do you really want to know?" Good question. Ignorance is bliss sometimes, and sometimes we are best off not knowing these things. But I will say the jealousy and rivalry sparked some more sexual interest in my husband on my part. Like I had to mark my territory or something. Thank God for instinct right? Either way, this is just for worse case scenarios. But let's look at it lighter. What if he is just slightly attracted to this woman? Do you really want to know that? It's not something you really want to be thinking about, so why think about it? What if he has no attraction to her whatsoever and all you've said is more perceived than real? What if it's just office politics? If you want the marriage to succeed, sometimes you are best off just having faith in your man that he's being true. Now, if you want the marriage to fail...then investigate. I say that because if you find out your man is cheating on you, what are you going to do about it? Is that an outcome you really want right now? Otherwise, what if you find out he isn't cheating on you? All that's going to do is make you feel stupid for thinking he was and guilty for not trusting him when you should have. Not to mention all the things you risk losing in the process of finding out. Either way, both cases in the investigation cause more harm to a marriage than any good.

Like I said earlier, your relationship to your husband is more important than his relationship to anyone else. He fell in love and married you for a reason, and I doubt your interest in computers had anything to do with that. In all jest (which sometimes there's truth in jest), maybe he'd rather see you do a little dance in some sexy lingerie than talk to you for hours about computers. When my husband comes home from work, I would much rather get a backrub in front of the tv than talk about my day. Of course, it wouldn't be awesome if we did that everyday, well maybe it would ;)



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16 May 2009, 5:29 pm

Thank you everyone.
I did talk with him about it in a casual way. When I told him that I thought she was a lot like him in her facial expressions he said, "OK, I guess I see that" or said something along those lines. I then told him that it seems like he has a little crush on her. He said "Not at all, we just have computers in common." I completely believe him. Just the way he said it makes me believe him.

I have felt aspie at times which could be related to being related to him. I have adhd, sensory issues, and serious spatial reasoning problems, so I can somewhat relate to some posts on here. I am pretty strong in social skills although people really drive me crazy at times. He was attracted to that as he later told me. I was his very social residential advisor in college. I was attracted to him because he didn't feel the need to be around people. What really attracted me to him was when he went to a basketball game alone. I thought, "this is a pretty cool guy who doesn't feel the need to be around people to feel good." His high intelligence attracted me as well. I was sick of having dumb conversations with people. He made me laugh. He would be around a lot of people but hardly socialize. Out of the blue, he would make a hilarious comment but it was so quick no one else seemed to even notice and didn't respond. I often ended up laughing so hard, I would cry. During these times, he had a slight smile. He can actually stand to be in large crowds more than me. Large crowds stress me out even though I am good at faking it.

Definitely on a different wave length most of the time but the longer I am married to him, the more I understand his way of thinking at least somewhat.