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jjstar
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24 Nov 2007, 3:20 pm

Do you believe in miracles?
Have you ever experienced a miracle?


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riverotter
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24 Nov 2007, 3:30 pm

Yes.
Yes.
One example- I was standing at the top of my basement steps, facing away from them (which would have been a long and hard way down backwards) and I felt myself losing my balance and start to fall backward. Then I felt pressure on my back between my scapulae, exactly like a hand catching me and pushing me upright. I was out of breath after this occurred.
I never told anyone.



Fatal-Noogie
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24 Nov 2007, 3:45 pm

I think it depends on your definition of "miracle". One definition from dictionary.com says

"an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause."

I don't believe in superstition, and I don't believe in the supernatural. I believe that there's a lot that we don't know, and that events may take place that contradict scientific theories we use to describe our observations. This doesn't make them supernatural: It just means our understanding of what is natural is in error.

Philosophically speaking, one could say that existence itself is a miracle, since it would be perfectly logical for nothing to exist at all, but evidently that is not the case. There's still no scientific explanation to account for that. For example, we don't know why the big bang occurred; what caused it. (I'm not even going to go into religious dogma, because their evidence rests entirely on the testimony of people and books, which I don't think is evidence at all.)

As for really good events that happened to me: I would say that finding this house (that I live in now) with an affordable room for rent is a miracle (in this town it is).


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SilverProteus
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24 Nov 2007, 3:55 pm

That would depend on your definition of a 'miracle'.

As for mine, no. I don't think I've ever had to pleasure to witness one.


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vandire
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24 Nov 2007, 4:01 pm

Not really, and not really.

I don't presume there is or isn't a god, but the vast majority of situations people have described as miracles always strike me as either A) In incredibly unlikely, but still possible set of situations culminating in an unusual result, B) Them being stupid or it being something that could probably be logically explained with a minutes thought, or C) Something thats obviously a lie.

It would be neat if there was a benevolent god, though.



poopylungstuffing
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24 Nov 2007, 4:03 pm

Sometimes a positive sequence of events will happen at a good time for them to happen...
But I don't really believe in miracles.



sinsboldly
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24 Nov 2007, 4:11 pm

poopylungstuffing wrote:
Sometimes a positive sequence of events will happen at a good time for them to happen...
.


yep! that's a miracle to me!

Merle


PS I love your new Avi, Poopy dear!



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24 Nov 2007, 4:25 pm

No.

And if I started to, I might start relying on them to happen, but the probability of a miracle occurring is much to low to be relied upon.


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sinsboldly
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24 Nov 2007, 4:38 pm

Angelus-Mortis wrote:
No.

And if I started to, I might start relying on them to happen, but the probability of a miracle occurring is much to low to be relied upon.


hummm. . I don't think miracles are to be relied on.



KristaMeth
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24 Nov 2007, 4:49 pm

Fatal-Noogie wrote:
I don't believe in superstition, and I don't believe in the supernatural. I believe that there's a lot that we don't know, and that events may take place that contradict scientific theories we use to describe our observations. This doesn't make them supernatural: It just means our understanding of what is natural is in error.


Beautifully said. Thank you.

When I think of the word "miracle" I tend to think of Jesusy things. I don't like Jesusy things. Any "miracles" I've ever experienced, I can explain with my own beliefs of some ambiguous higher power, or the power of my own mind. I think we're capable of affecting so much more in life than we really know.


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lau
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24 Nov 2007, 4:51 pm

riverotter wrote:
Yes.
Yes.
One example- I was standing at the top of my basement steps, facing away from them (which would have been a long and hard way down backwards) and I felt myself losing my balance and start to fall backward. Then I felt pressure on my back between my scapulae, exactly like a hand catching me and pushing me upright. I was out of breath after this occurred.
I never told anyone.

An interesting one.

Assuming that what was happening transpired exactly as you describe, the first of the pair of miracles must have been when, from a stationary standing position, with no external forces detected, you found yourself travelling backwards. This violated the conservation of momentum. I would find it hard to think of any explanation for it.

The second, much more minor, miracle, was when you experienced a tangible, but unexplained, force that negated your backward motion. This seems more amenable to explanation. E.g. maybe someone poked you with a mop to steady you, then left before you saw them.

===========

OK. So I'm being a little facetious. I certainly have experienced "miracles". However, in most cases I can give feasible, if unlikely, explanations. Times where I have not come up with any explanation mean nothing but that.


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bassackward
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24 Nov 2007, 4:53 pm

I'm on the fence with this one. I'm prepared to accept one if it happens, but since miracles are so unlikely, I behave as if they don't. So, in the event that something unexpected and miraculous occurs, I'll try to come up with a rational explanation for it. If I can't, well I'll let someone else try to figure it out.



samtoo
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24 Nov 2007, 4:54 pm

I can't say I do tbf lol.


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beautifuloblivion
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24 Nov 2007, 5:16 pm

no



nicky
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24 Nov 2007, 6:02 pm

YES!! well, maybe.. but my parents have experienced FAR more!! i have a story to tell. back before i was born, when my parents were newlyweds, they were driving home from a day in the city in a car they had only purchased a couple months previously. with them, they had my half sister, from my dad's first marriage, who was around 18 months old. anyways, it was raining and they saw a hitchhiker wearing a business suit standing by a broken-down car. feeling sorry for him, they stopped and picked him up. a couple minutes later, he pulled out a gun and put it to my mom's head. he told my dad that he would drive him to a certain location. my dad, scared for the safety of his family, asked if he could drop them off somewhere, but the man refused, saying they would go to the police. he then told my dad to take out all his money and put it on the dashboard. well, my dad only had $11 on him, but it was dark, and he pulled it out one bill at a time to make it seem like more. he was hoping to distract the guy. after a long while of driving, while out in the middle of nowhere, the man told my dad to pull over. he ordered them to get out of the car and walk into the desert. my dad was sure the man intended to kill them. my mom, however, was so dazed at this point, she wasn't thinking much at all. when ordered out of the car, she immediately reached behind her to get the diaper bag that sitting next to the man. as soon as she realised how dangerous that was, she explained to him quickly what she was doing. he said he hadn't realized they had a baby with them. he said that he had had a little girl once.. but she got "blown away" and it was his fault. after taking my parents and sister into the desert a short distance, the man told them to get down on the ground and cover their heads. they did as told. then he turned and ran back to the car, got in, and drove away. so, my parents walked back to the road and hitchhiked into town, where they called the cops. appearantly, the man had been involved in some drug deal gone wrong and was on the run. the car that had broken down when my parents picked him up belonged to someone else, and he had stolen it. also, just before my parents picked him up, he had opened fire on a van that hadn't stopped. when the police found him, still in my parents' car, they couldn't tell if he had taken a hostage from anywhere, because the backs of the seats were too high. so, they wouldn't open fire on the car. but.. they didn't have to. the car slowed down.. slower and slower, until it came to a stop and the man was caught. the car wouldn't start, so, assuming there was a problem with it, it was towed to a lot. my dad was contacted and went to get it. when they asked if he had a tow truck, he said he didn't. they asked how he planned on moving the car, since it dying randomly was the only reason they caught the guy. my dad told them "there's nothing wrong with this car" and then he got in, started it up, and drove away. they had that car for another 5 years without having a single mechanical problem. now, i call that a miracle. :D


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nicky
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24 Nov 2007, 6:10 pm

lau wrote:

Assuming that what was happening transpired exactly as you describe, the first of the pair of miracles must have been when, from a stationary standing position, with no external forces detected, you found yourself travelling backwards. This violated the conservation of momentum. I would find it hard to think of any explanation for it.



ever hear of this thing called gravity?? :roll: yeah.. fyi, it makes people fall over (and, quite possibly, backwards) if they lose their balance. :P


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