Do you have Asperger's + Avoidant PD?

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I have an idea that a lot of people with a relatively mild case of Asperger's also have what they call Avoidant Personality Disorder, but people with more than mild ASD usually don't. I doubt that both are diagnosed very often, because the means of dealing with the NT world mostly overlap for both. So I want people who respond to this poll to answer based on what they think they have, not what an official diagnosis says. "Mild" is a term you have to define for yourself because I don't know quite what criteria would be useful for everybody.

My reasoning behind this is that people with mild Asperger's have strong enough social instincts to crave a social life, but not strong enough to make it as easy to learn what to do as it is for NTs. Frustration with repeated rejection would contribute to developing AvPD. So would the responses of parents to the absence of some emotional interactions.

People with moderate or more ASD are more comfortable being alone. Even with the same frustrations, they don't hurt deeply enough to contribute to AvPD.

I'm a mild aspie with serious AvPD. I know I should be out there enjoying life, going to meetup groups, etc but I just don't. Still, it's sunny today so maybe I'll cut my hair, shave and go out this afternoon.

Mild HFA but not Avoidant
So I picked the first choice, hopeing this was okay

I have moderate asperger symptoms but no avoidant symptoms at all.
I play in rock bands and go to shows, partys, and bars several times a week.
I couldn't give half a s**t whether or not people approve of me.
Most people are usually fine with my eccentricities because they know they aren't perfect either.

I think another theory (hypothesis) is that if you appear very obviously different at a glance then people put you into "pity category" right away -- as opposed to thinking that you're capable of interacting normally and are thus just being an a-hole on purpose. If a person thinks that you can't interact normally at the get-go, I suspect it's less negative/punative in certain ways, though it's probably also worse in other ways (i.e. being talked down to, only having superficially positive interactions, being more of a target of abuse because predators know you're less likely to be taken seriously by authorities).

Avoidant Personality Disorder doesn't mean just having some avoidant symptoms and avoiding certain social situations or certain people out of social fear and/or discomfort.

The term "avoidant" is slightly misleading. Many people with AvPD are not afraid of social settings that people with social anxiety may fear.

It has more to do with having an intense inferiority complex that you couldn't believe that any person could find you appealing or enjoyable to be around. Even those who may excessively show that person this isn't the case will often end up being avoided. It is more about the fear of being close to some person because in their mind the closer they are to someone the more odds of them being rejected by that someone. So they need to make sure that person really really likes them before they can accept him/her into their daily lives.

Hence, the criterion:

Is unwilling to get involved with people unless certain of being liked

People with autism do not most of the time have AvPD by the way. People who disagree misunderstand what AvPD is exactly.

Yes, I have this thought also, and this fits me exactly. Mild ASD, diagnosed with severe AVPD. With more awareness comes more fear. I can read most social cues, but I can't process them fast enough, and I'm aware of probably 90% of my social mistakes (including ones that may not exist), so this leads to a cascade of self-reinforcing social anxiety. I think, in mild ASD cases, AVPD makes perfect sense. We see ourselves exactly as others see us and respond to our autistic behaviors just like they do.

I hate being alone, and the thought of social situations isn't so bad; it's how I think about them afterwards that makes me sick. I think this is one difference between AVPD and classic social anxiety.



Definitely. And this thought probably reinforces behaviors like shyness and awkwardness which make it a self-fulfilling prophesy.



I'm too normal to be a target most of the time. Mostly just viewed as either a nice guy who is excessively shy or a standoffish a**hole depending on whom you ask. I'm probably better at reading some social cues than some NT's but worse at forming relationships with people than just about everyone.



I've been in 6 romantic relationships lasting a month or more, and I was always the one who ended them.



Yes, it's not quite a logical thing.

I think people this are caught between neurotypical and carefree autistic, and it's people like us who are more likely to want a cure.

I think that's a good theory. I'm going to add it to what I already thought.

I agree about the term being misleading. I am assuming people who don't already know what Avoidant is will look it up or ignore the poll. I think the single most important feature of Avoidant is that the person who has it has really, really bad self-esteem.

I would like to rename a whole host of conditions. Here are my ideas for "Personality Disorders" (I hate those words too):
All all personality disorders become ASE, standing for Abysmal Self Esteem.
The subtypes are
ASE - YHK (You'd Hate me if you really Knew me), formerly called AvPD
ASE - CSFB (Crazy Selfish with False Bravado), formerly Narcissistic Personality Disorder
ASE - RHC (Runs Hot and Cold), formerly Borderline Personality Disorder
ASE - DFL (Desperate for Love), formerly Dependent Personality Disorder.
I'd submit them for the next DSM, but humor doesn't go well there.

Avoidant being misnamed made it take longer for me to accept my diagnosis. I thought it just meant the sufferer avoids trying to do anything at all difficult.

What social settings a person with Avoidant fears depends a lot on how deeply one has it. Generally, the more intimate the interactions, the greater the fear. I didn't use to fear parties, but my AvPD has gotten worse and I do now.

That statement about being unwilling to get involved with people unless certain of being liked as the prime criterion for AvPD sticks in my craw. I just figured out why. If one is never certain of being liked, how do you apply it? How about flipping it over?:

For fear of being disliked, avoids letting others really know them.

Much better, except that "really" sounds vague although it really isn't here.

I don't want people with social anxieties to just assume they have AvPD either. But I do think AvPD is a lot more common in people with Asperger's than in people with no autism.

Um, nearly everyone I know are desperate for love. People split up from their partners and jump straight into another relationship without even thinking. I admire people that aren't like this.

Depends on how you define mild versus moderate.

My guess is, if you look at social subtypes, those who as children were 'active-but-odd' probably have more Avoidant PD than those who were aloof, for precisely the reasons you mention. (Though Avoidant PD, once it develops, would tend to make you appear aloof.)

However, some people refer to severity along other criteria. For example, both me and the AS kid my Dad worked with are active-but-odd, and probably about equally sociable. Both of us spontaneously chat people up, even relative strangers, and go into long monologues at them. But my Dad considers him more severe because he makes more frequent and serious social mistakes than I do. For example, when he first met me, he said 'you dress like a guy, but at least you've got boobs' whereas I would never openly comment on the secondary sexual characteristics of a stranger.

I suspect each respondant will have their own idea of what is 'mild' versus 'moderate/severe' AS, and many of them will not be basing it on traits relevant to risk of Avoidant PD.