Want to learn to compose my own music!

Page 2 of 3 [ 42 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

Who_Am_I
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Aug 2005
Age: 42
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,632
Location: Australia

21 Apr 2013, 7:13 pm

If you need to study theory to know where to start, you have a problem.


_________________
Music Theory 101: Cadences.
Authentic cadence: V-I
Plagal cadence: IV-I
Deceptive cadence: V- ANYTHING BUT I ! !! !
Beethoven cadence: V-I-V-I-V-V-V-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I
-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I! I! I! I I I


starkid
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 9 Feb 2012
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,812
Location: California Bay Area

21 Apr 2013, 7:22 pm

Who_Am_I wrote:
starkid wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:

Nope, you also need to learn what combinations of sounds go together, and how to structure music across various time scales,


That's all encompassed in hearing music in your head. It isn't possible to have an idea for a piece of music that isn't already structured into some type of time signature;


Do you really, honestly think that once you've got a time signature, that's all the structuring you need?

Go listen to a symphony sometime. Do you think the composer sat down and said "I'll put it in 4/4 time", and then didn't need any more planning?


Depends on whether or not the piece changes time signature. Then again, the meaning of the phrase "structure music across time scales" wasn't entirely clear.



Who_Am_I
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Aug 2005
Age: 42
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,632
Location: Australia

21 Apr 2013, 7:26 pm

starkid wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:
starkid wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:

Nope, you also need to learn what combinations of sounds go together, and how to structure music across various time scales,


That's all encompassed in hearing music in your head. It isn't possible to have an idea for a piece of music that isn't already structured into some type of time signature;


Do you really, honestly think that once you've got a time signature, that's all the structuring you need?

Go listen to a symphony sometime. Do you think the composer sat down and said "I'll put it in 4/4 time", and then didn't need any more planning?


Depends on whether or not the piece changes time signature. Then again, the meaning of the phrase "structure music across time scales" wasn't entirely clear.


What I meant by structure was more the large-scale form of the piece: what ideas will go where, how you'll progress from one thing to another, how long each section will be, how many movements, and so forth.

The time signature is what I'd consider very, very small-scale structural planning at the most. If all you plan is what time signatures go where, your music is likely to be incoherent, particularly for large-scale classical works. You might be able to get away with it for 2-minute songs that use 3 chords and the same drum beat throughout.


_________________
Music Theory 101: Cadences.
Authentic cadence: V-I
Plagal cadence: IV-I
Deceptive cadence: V- ANYTHING BUT I ! !! !
Beethoven cadence: V-I-V-I-V-V-V-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I
-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I! I! I! I I I


starkid
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 9 Feb 2012
Gender: Female
Posts: 5,812
Location: California Bay Area

21 Apr 2013, 7:40 pm

Who_Am_I wrote:

What I meant by structure was more the large-scale form of the piece: what ideas will go where, how you'll progress from one thing to another, how long each section will be, how many movements, and so forth.

The time signature is what I'd consider very, very small-scale structural planning at the most. If all you plan is what time signatures go where, your music is likely to be incoherent, particularly for large-scale classical works. You might be able to get away with it for 2-minute songs that use 3 chords and the same drum beat throughout.


I understand now, although I still don't see the sense in which those things can be learned. There aren't any rules for how long a piece ought to be (beyond commonsense notions of audience attention span and musician endurance). There are traditional forms with specific numbers of movements, but there is little compulsion to follow them. All these things you mention are part of the composer's creative license.



Ganondox
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Oct 2011
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,791
Location: USA

21 Apr 2013, 8:38 pm

The first step to composing music is to bang around on the keys until they start sounding like how you want them to sound. Once that starts happening, think about what you want, and bang around on the keys until you start hearing that. With practice it becomes easier. You can also look at other compositions that sound similar to what you want and see how they do it. You can also study classical music theory, that will teach you some stuff.


_________________
Cinnamon and sugary
Softly Spoken lies
You never know just how you look
Through other people's eyes

Autism FAQs http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt186115.html


J-P
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 487
Location: Montréal,Québec,Canada

21 Apr 2013, 8:42 pm

Ganondox wrote:
The first step to composing music is to bang around on the keys until they start sounding like how you want them to sound. Once that starts happening, think about what you want, and bang around on the keys until you start hearing that. With practice it becomes easier. You can also look at other compositions that sound similar to what you want and see how they do it. You can also study classical music theory, that will teach you some stuff.


any link for classical music theory?



Who_Am_I
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Aug 2005
Age: 42
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,632
Location: Australia

21 Apr 2013, 9:13 pm

starkid wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:

What I meant by structure was more the large-scale form of the piece: what ideas will go where, how you'll progress from one thing to another, how long each section will be, how many movements, and so forth.

The time signature is what I'd consider very, very small-scale structural planning at the most. If all you plan is what time signatures go where, your music is likely to be incoherent, particularly for large-scale classical works. You might be able to get away with it for 2-minute songs that use 3 chords and the same drum beat throughout.


I understand now, although I still don't see the sense in which those things can be learned. There aren't any rules for how long a piece ought to be (beyond commonsense notions of audience attention span and musician endurance). There are traditional forms with specific numbers of movements, but there is little compulsion to follow them. All these things you mention are part of the composer's creative license.


The only way you can learn is through practice: compose and compose until you see what works. My teachers would just give advice based on their own experience: things like "this doesn't quite fit" "this passage transitions awkwardly to the next" "listen to so-and-so, he did something similar that you might benefit from hearing" and so forth.

Yes, creative license comes into it, but you still need your music to hold together properly, otherwise it will sound amateurish at best.


_________________
Music Theory 101: Cadences.
Authentic cadence: V-I
Plagal cadence: IV-I
Deceptive cadence: V- ANYTHING BUT I ! !! !
Beethoven cadence: V-I-V-I-V-V-V-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I
-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I! I! I! I I I


J-P
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 487
Location: Montréal,Québec,Canada

21 Apr 2013, 9:39 pm

Who_Am_I wrote:
starkid wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:

What I meant by structure was more the large-scale form of the piece: what ideas will go where, how you'll progress from one thing to another, how long each section will be, how many movements, and so forth.

The time signature is what I'd consider very, very small-scale structural planning at the most. If all you plan is what time signatures go where, your music is likely to be incoherent, particularly for large-scale classical works. You might be able to get away with it for 2-minute songs that use 3 chords and the same drum beat throughout.


I understand now, although I still don't see the sense in which those things can be learned. There aren't any rules for how long a piece ought to be (beyond commonsense notions of audience attention span and musician endurance). There are traditional forms with specific numbers of movements, but there is little compulsion to follow them. All these things you mention are part of the composer's creative license.


The only way you can learn is through practice: compose and compose until you see what works. My teachers would just give advice based on their own experience: things like "this doesn't quite fit" "this passage transitions awkwardly to the next" "listen to so-and-so, he did something similar that you might benefit from hearing" and so forth.

Yes, creative license comes into it, but you still need your music to hold together properly, otherwise it will sound amateurish at best.


You haved nice teachers aren't you



Who_Am_I
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 27 Aug 2005
Age: 42
Gender: Female
Posts: 12,632
Location: Australia

21 Apr 2013, 10:05 pm

J-P wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:
starkid wrote:
Who_Am_I wrote:

What I meant by structure was more the large-scale form of the piece: what ideas will go where, how you'll progress from one thing to another, how long each section will be, how many movements, and so forth.

The time signature is what I'd consider very, very small-scale structural planning at the most. If all you plan is what time signatures go where, your music is likely to be incoherent, particularly for large-scale classical works. You might be able to get away with it for 2-minute songs that use 3 chords and the same drum beat throughout.


I understand now, although I still don't see the sense in which those things can be learned. There aren't any rules for how long a piece ought to be (beyond commonsense notions of audience attention span and musician endurance). There are traditional forms with specific numbers of movements, but there is little compulsion to follow them. All these things you mention are part of the composer's creative license.


The only way you can learn is through practice: compose and compose until you see what works. My teachers would just give advice based on their own experience: things like "this doesn't quite fit" "this passage transitions awkwardly to the next" "listen to so-and-so, he did something similar that you might benefit from hearing" and so forth.

Yes, creative license comes into it, but you still need your music to hold together properly, otherwise it will sound amateurish at best.


You haved nice teachers aren't you


I had awesome teachers.


_________________
Music Theory 101: Cadences.
Authentic cadence: V-I
Plagal cadence: IV-I
Deceptive cadence: V- ANYTHING BUT I ! !! !
Beethoven cadence: V-I-V-I-V-V-V-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I
-I-I-I-I-I-I-I-I! I! I! I I I


J-P
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 487
Location: Montréal,Québec,Canada

21 Apr 2013, 11:08 pm

pose until you see what works. My teachers would just give advice based on their own experience: things like "this doesn't quite fit" "this passage transitions awkwardly to the next" "listen to so-and-so, he did something similar that you might benefit from hearing" and so forth.

Yes, creative license comes into it, but you still need your music to hold together properly, otherwise it will sound amateurish at best.[/quote]

You haved nice teachers aren't you[/quote]

I had awesome teachers.[/quote]

Same in my musical school where i learn how to play pianos. Thoses i haved as teachers was good. RToo bad i forget pieces i learn :(



Ganondox
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 7 Oct 2011
Age: 30
Gender: Male
Posts: 5,791
Location: USA

22 Apr 2013, 6:46 am

J-P wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
The first step to composing music is to bang around on the keys until they start sounding like how you want them to sound. Once that starts happening, think about what you want, and bang around on the keys until you start hearing that. With practice it becomes easier. You can also look at other compositions that sound similar to what you want and see how they do it. You can also study classical music theory, that will teach you some stuff.


any link for classical music theory?


I haven't actually checked it out, but I'm just going to dump this here.

http://library.thinkquest.org/15413/theory/theory.htm


_________________
Cinnamon and sugary
Softly Spoken lies
You never know just how you look
Through other people's eyes

Autism FAQs http://www.wrongplanet.net/postt186115.html


J-P
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 487
Location: Montréal,Québec,Canada

22 Apr 2013, 9:11 am

Ganondox wrote:
J-P wrote:
Ganondox wrote:
The first step to composing music is to bang around on the keys until they start sounding like how you want them to sound. Once that starts happening, think about what you want, and bang around on the keys until you start hearing that. With practice it becomes easier. You can also look at other compositions that sound similar to what you want and see how they do it. You can also study classical music theory, that will teach you some stuff.


any link for classical music theory?


I haven't actually checked it out, but I'm just going to dump this here.

http://library.thinkquest.org/15413/theory/theory.htm


k



redrobin62
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Apr 2012
Age: 64
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,009
Location: Seattle, WA

22 Apr 2013, 3:33 pm

Remember, I have some free music notation software if you want. Specifically, Capella 7 and MagicScore Note 7.



J-P
Velociraptor
Velociraptor

User avatar

Joined: 21 Oct 2008
Age: 37
Gender: Male
Posts: 487
Location: Montréal,Québec,Canada

22 Apr 2013, 4:38 pm

redrobin62 wrote:
Remember, I have some free music notation software if you want. Specifically, Capella 7 and MagicScore Note 7.


k, i use FInale Notepad 2012 for now but ill maybe try ours if you can tell me which is the better for free software




My first compo i ever try. Can be better troughs specially the ending:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26HF9wAU ... e=youtu.be



AScomposer13413
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 1 Feb 2012
Age: 34
Gender: Male
Posts: 2,157
Location: Canada

22 Apr 2013, 5:00 pm

J-P wrote:
My first compo i ever try. Can be better troughs specially the ending:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26HF9wAU ... e=youtu.be


Hmmm...for a first shot, I'd say there's definitely a melody in it! The ending does feel a bit different from the first material, but maybe that should be extended into a different set of material overall. Might be a good idea to try having more than one note sounding at the same time (not octaves, like you have). Still, for a first try, there's potential!!


_________________
I don't seek to be popular
I seek to be well-known
If we find a friendship that's forged without masks
Then I have done my job


redrobin62
Veteran
Veteran

User avatar

Joined: 2 Apr 2012
Age: 64
Gender: Male
Posts: 13,009
Location: Seattle, WA

22 Apr 2013, 5:25 pm

The reason I offered you Capella and MagicScore is because they're relatively small (23 mb and 12 mb) and can be emailed. I'm more familiar with Sibelius and Finale with my preference being for Finale. With Sibelius you have to jump through hoops to hear your music. With Finale it's a walk in the park. I use ARIA player in Finale. I didn't know you had Finale Notepad, BTW. That's a good program. Stick with it for a while.