The Ackman art thread.

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Lene
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18 Jul 2010, 6:04 am

Sand wrote:

That I find merit in Ackman's work where others seem mortally offended that he experiments with various intriguing techniques does not mean I am his knight in shining armor. I didn't "jump" on any comment, merely pointed out that there are alternate and valid points of view. You are the jumpy one to become offended that someone might feel differently from you. There is nothing wrong with declaring sources or refusing to use photos as a starting point but sources may be interesting but not vital and using photos to base ones experiments on in no way invalidates final results. If Ackman plays around with various techniques that other established and recognized artistic creators have used with great success, why demand special requirements from him? Schwitters, Braque, Picasso, Duchamps, Oppenheim, Tinguely and many others have worked with all sorts of weird materials and people delight in the results. It merely strikes me as very odd that people should hammer Ackman for doing much the same thing and obtaining interesting results.

I never took issue with your point of view. You're welcome to think what you like when it comes to art.

My problem was that you took a constructive comment that I had made and warped it into some idea that I was 'demanding' Ackman change his art and claiming that I was 'insisting' he do anything. I'm not. Ackman can draw in fingerpaint for all I care. I just think that if he is looking for better reception (and from some of his comments, it seems an issue to him), stating clearly when he used others' work as templates will come across as more open.

It was a PR suggestion and has nothing to do with the art itself, and Ackman is free to choose to ignore it if he chooses to.

If you wish to debate the pros and cons of declaring sources, perhaps you should make another thread. I'm not interested in arguing here. This is Ackman's thread.

(@ bewarethebob, thanks }

Meow101
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18 Jul 2010, 10:05 am

Sand wrote:

I have followed the thread from the beginning and all my comments were basically that Ackman had real ability and was worth watching. He never asked for direction in his work and the comments were so basically ignorant of the way an individual explores his capabilities and what the potentials of art might be and so vituperative that they were totally inexcusable. Of course most creative people who understand the insecurities of exploring experiments in art have skins tough enough to ignore unwarranted comments and thoughts of suicide are totally extreme. But Van Gogh was emotionally unstable enough to slice off an ear and he never sold anything during his entire career but his work today is extraordinarily high priced. I am not trying to put Ackman in Van Gogh's class, merely noting that creative people need room to explore and discover their capabilities without being crushed by ignorant observers.

I agree with you, Sand. I don't have training or education in art, but plenty in critical thinking, and you are 100% right. There is plenty of place for constructive criticism (which is okay to ignore and not an excuse for personal attacks) and none for the kind of insults I saw flying.

~Kate

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bewarethebob
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18 Jul 2010, 11:07 am

Meow101 wrote:

Sand wrote:

thats what he got. after a bit of retaliation he started getting insults.

@sand, it is up to him, but we are free to point out the rampant abrupt emotional issue taken at helpful critisism, then at the insults he got from portraying that anger.

and yes, as far as the art thin goes, anything can be done with practice, and anyone should keep going

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18 Jul 2010, 12:41 pm

Delirium wrote:

Meow101 wrote:

Criticism is one thing. Bullying is another. Criticism is something like what Sand has been doing, pointing out what could be changed to improve things. It's constructive, saying "do X instead of Y, and this would look better". Saying things like "it's not even art" and calling it "crap" is not in any way constructive. Personal attacks are not constructive. If you don't like his work, OKAY. Nobody says you have to. If you don't like Ackman, OKAY. There's no law saying you have to. BUT, the way you've been treating him, IMO, is no better than the schoolyard bullies that we've all run across at some point. If you can't at least be constructive about your criticism, grow the hell up and say NOTHING and cut out the personal crap. I don't blame anyone external to the depressed person for a suicide attempt, but I sure as hell DO blame people for bullying.

~Kate

In previous threads, I have given him suggestions. However, he just gets butthurt and accuses me of being mean. the reason why I'm being an a**hole is because I feel that's the only way I can get across to him. And I have told him that he's fairly decent at perspective. It's the rest of the drawings that need work.

And Sand isn't giving Ackman any sort of criticism or tips to improve his art. He's just stroking his gargantuan ego.

Everything else going on aside, why do you *need* to get through to him? If you find someone's needs repetitive and non-responsive, just tune them out. What does anyone gain by turning it into bashing? Is there really any chance you will *help* that person in any way? Ah, you may believe they *need* to know but reality is, no, they don't. It is, instead, about some need the persistent critic has; some distorted concept of what *truth* needs to be shared. I realize you are acting in a common AS fashion trying hard to *get through* your opinion (which is, just, your opinion, and some *truth* that must be known), but the other person is also acting in a common AS fashion by not accepting it. So ... move on. Get over it. Keep quiet.

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Meow101
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18 Jul 2010, 2:08 pm

DW_a_mom wrote:

See, this is what I don't get. Why does anyone care if someone doesn't accept their suggestions, especially in an internet forum? They may not agree, and when it comes to aesthetics, there is a lot of opinion but not "objective truth" that can be measured and must be aspired to. If I make a suggestion to someone as to what I think could be better and someone doesn't agree with me, SO WHAT? I made a YouTube video and I showed it to someone and I didn't agree with what they said so I disregarded their advice. Does that mean they now have license to say it's crap and awful and attack me? I don't think so.

~Kate

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Ackman
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18 Jul 2010, 3:10 pm

Ok, enough of the trench warfare. Like Rodney King hath said "Can't we all just get along?" Cut Delirium a break. To tell you the truth, some of her criticism has made my non computer drawings better. She doesn't deserve the bloody stalemate.

Anyways:

It's the 1887 chart.

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18 Jul 2010, 5:40 pm

Very wise response to this situation Ackman. I'm glad your back to normal doing your own thing.

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bewarethebob
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18 Jul 2010, 10:10 pm

Ackman wrote:

It's the 1887 chart.

and resolved.
good lad

Ackman
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19 Jul 2010, 9:56 am

From a verryyyyy long time ago.

Here is the story:

Body detail, two days after 12 PM, 4/27/1874

Here we see a woman from the Women's Death Battalion and a Man from the 501st, also known as the Creedonian Expedition Force. This was at the end of the fictitious New England War, in which a renegade group of men, called "The New South" took over cities, towns and hamlets; trying to recreate the confederacy. They jumped on a good opportunity, as the Americans were weak after their civil war.

Ackman
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19 Jul 2010, 10:25 pm

The deck of the CRS Bayberry.

Ackman
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19 Jul 2010, 10:32 pm

Counties of Peter State.

Sand
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20 Jul 2010, 12:43 am

Ackman wrote:

Counties of Peter State.

An interesting re-arrangement of the geography somehow related to the area around New York. Manhattan, which has somehow become Peter, has shrunk a bit but seems to be the capital of the complex.

Ackman
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20 Jul 2010, 2:20 am

Sand wrote:

Ackman wrote:

Counties of Peter State.

An interesting re-arrangement of the geography somehow related to the area around New York. Manhattan, which has somehow become Peter, has shrunk a bit but seems to be the capital of the complex.

Peter State is one of 60 states in the Creedon Republic. The capital is Bradford. Peter City, the area that is made up of Peter,Bronx,Staten Island,Kings, and Queens counties is considered the cultural capital of the Creedon republic. It is a cosmopolitan city, where people from all over the world live. The admiral and his family move there in 1896 from Philadelphia,Pittsylvania because it's downright safer in Peter City.

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20 Jul 2010, 10:01 am

You're just doing it wrong Emily, you need more emotion.

Ackman
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20 Jul 2010, 10:06 am

Major cities in Peter State. I forgot to add Newburyport.

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20 Jul 2010, 10:11 am

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