nice guys?

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I'm glad you posted this. It was very interesting. I had never realized that there are so many guys who act so sh***y.

I think it is probably difficult to tell the difference between weirdo jerks like the guys you described in the first view posts and guys who are trying to be genuinely nice but just don't have the social skills. I realize after reading this that I acted similar to those guys (but never yelled at or threatened any girl, just followed/talked to them when they didn't want just because I didn't know any better). The first time I asked out a girl she told me she was, "busy" and it took me 4 months to figure out that that was a rejection, so I kept asking her periodically. I felt really awful after I figured it out, and I'm afraid now that she may have been really creeped out.

When you meet creepy guys like that I think you might try rejecting them explicitly. Maybe if you are really nice you could explain why. They are probably really clueless and bitter at how they've been treated. They don't understand what they do wrong so from their perspective girls are just jerks. I have only been rejected explicitly once (and I've gotten rejections from dozens of girls) and it was such a pleasure for it to be that simple that I kept hanging out with the girl over and over again so that she could keep rejecting me. I don't think I creeped this particular girl out. She didn't seem to take me seriously in any way.

I personally think it is very insulting to be given a BS excuse in place of a rejection, and I think a lot of guys probably feel the same way. I would honestly rather get slapped in the face. I would get very mad if I thought that girls realized this. You really should try explicit, but not cruel, rejection. Probably the next thing he will ask is, "why," and if you don't want to or can't explain it thoroughly then tell him that. If it doesn't work then you can go back to your usual method.

I think the way the original poster handled the situation with being kept from getting in the car was really admirable. It would really take balls to say that to his face if you felt physically threatened. This is kind of weird for me to think about because I have never felt physically threatened by any person.

and btw, I get really happy and silly when I'm drunk. I get really affectionate if I'm around people I like and I laugh at everything. Does that make me a good person? I'm withdrawn and sometimes grumpy when sober.

I see. That's a subjective point between a "nice guy" and "decent man". The observer gets to determine whether the person acting nicely is doing it to their detriment or if they lack a back bone, whether the observer is correct or not. There are many times where it can appear that someone is acting as a door mat, but aren't because a) it's gaining them something in return (extra pay, sex, etc...) or b) the act doesn't affect them much. From the context of the observer, it would appear detrimental or lacking a back bone, but to the person doing the acts they are inconsequential.

An example would be someone who cannot (reality is that they won't) say no to their job. It may not be a problem if the person is trying to climb the corporate ladder or they get paid over time. I'm guilty of this because I do get paid over time, it doesn't impact my free time usually (nothing better to do), and has helped the perception others have of my working behavior (my boss doesn't want me to leave and upper management likes/respects me).

Which gets more response, a guy who respects women and doesn't go around hitting on everything with two legs, or the brash cocky guy who goes around every woman out? There's a reason why a**holes like Mystery can get girls. Guys like the OP described are actually the rule, not the exception, and they're the ones that end up getting the girls, even though the OP was smart enough to get away from that guy.

I'm not gonna sit here and only blame women for this though. These "nice" guys usually drive women into despair and cause them to not even wanna date down the line. I've seen it so many times, I've lost count. And by the time they want a decent guy, these a**holes have given them so much baggage that they didn't have before. It's a lose-lose in most cases for a decent guy unless he's either handsome or lucky, which I know for sure I am neither.

Believe me it's not just on THIS site - the above opinion is thrown around regularly everywhere and anywhere males may ask for dating advice. The NT's typically believe this to be true and it seems to work (at least for the ones chasing for one night stands... ugh.)

I have always been direct about rejection, and I expect the same from others. There is nothing nice about vaguely rejecting someone and leaving them confused about what happened. I'm sorry that happened to you, excuses are useless and can be so misleading.

I've had a handful of people demand to know WHY I've rejected their advances and nowadays I will blatantly state that I don't owe any explanation.

I think what I said was stupid though, I wasn't thinking, and he could've done any number of things.

The funniest(scariest?) thing happened the next day, I was walking my dog and it turns out this guy lives a couple blocks from me and when he saw me he glared at me.

It is kind of scary that he lives next to you.

And maybe what you said was stupid but I still like it because it took balls.

There were a couple months in my life where I was angry about all the confusing rejections and might have done something mean like what that guy did if I had less self restraint. The only way I avoided getting bitter at that point was to remind myself that no one has any obligation to like me. I once did say some terrible things in a message to a girl after she dumped me because I was really confused. Just a few days before she told me she loved me and gave me a good bye kiss and then she messaged me that she didn't want to see me again and wouldn't explain why and didn't want to continue to be friends either. It hurt a lot and I sent her mean messages that I regret. I thought maybe I was a monster who hurt people on accident, but then I had a really beautiful relationship with an intelligent girl who thought I was the best person she had ever met. I think it did me a lot of good to be loved so deeply just once.

At least there is a thread about it instead of that topic derailing other topics

isn't it lovely how healthy loving relationships can help us grow as people