The UCSB shooter--an Aspie with a rant against women

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kraftiekortie
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02 Jun 2014, 8:04 am

Not driving, and not taking the bus, does isolate one, does prevent one from doing most things in this modern age. One can't go to Costco and carry stuff out with a bike!

Your husband must have some really muscular legs, since he has to walk or bike miles.

I agree: what's fair is fair. I wouldn't want to be prevented from travelling, attending "evening things, etc." by someone who makes excuses. He'd be a horrible father in this instance as well.

I would hate it if your "Disney-eyed" visions were dissipated by this sort of reality.



starvingartist
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02 Jun 2014, 12:18 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Not driving, and not taking the bus, does isolate one, does prevent one from doing most things in this modern age. One can't go to Costco and carry stuff out with a bike!

Your husband must have some really muscular legs, since he has to walk or bike miles.

I agree: what's fair is fair. I wouldn't want to be prevented from travelling, attending "evening things, etc." by someone who makes excuses. He'd be a horrible father in this instance as well.

I would hate it if your "Disney-eyed" visions were dissipated by this sort of reality.


i don't shop at costco--but i have no trouble getting all my groceries home by bike. :wink:



tarantella64
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02 Jun 2014, 1:08 pm

kraftiekortie wrote:
Not driving, and not taking the bus, does isolate one, does prevent one from doing most things in this modern age. One can't go to Costco and carry stuff out with a bike!

Your husband must have some really muscular legs, since he has to walk or bike miles.

I agree: what's fair is fair. I wouldn't want to be prevented from travelling, attending "evening things, etc." by someone who makes excuses. He'd be a horrible father in this instance as well.

I would hate it if your "Disney-eyed" visions were dissipated by this sort of reality.


? I didn't have a car for years, and bus service is terrible outside major cities in the US. Still used to do all the shopping. Much easier after I got a great big backpacking pack. Otherwise I'd walk to the store (miles, yes) and take a cab back, which added marginally to the cost of the groceries, but it wasn't nearly as expensive as keeping a car. Besides, she was talking about picking up the children from school, which doesn't normally involve carrying them.

Travelling and attending evening things are often necessities for people in professional jobs. I'd be in real trouble if I had to rely exclusively on my ex to look after our daughter while I was working outside normal business hours.



kraftiekortie
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02 Jun 2014, 1:19 pm

Going to Costco involves buying things in bulk. Of course, there are rare instances when one could buy a few items, and be able to carry it via bicycle. But one when buys a 40-can case of soda.....(or pop). Or meat for a month...

Of course, I'm aware that people shop, amble, live etc. without driving or without reliable transportation. I didn't get my license until age 37. I used to use the ole shopping cart and go up three (or more) flights of stairs in my apartment building when my elevator did not work. I'm aware that one must not be stymied when beset by a lack of public transportation.

But, in truth, it's easier to have a car when a car is available. To withhold that availability is really not a nice thing. It took me many, MANY years to learn to drive (see above). I'm must not a natural driver. I drive well now, since I've been doing it for 16 years.

I concur with the rest.



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02 Jun 2014, 1:42 pm

It should be obvious that I'm not advocating being dependent on men. My father was pretty undependable--rather like that guy in "A Tree Grows in Brooklyn" without the drunkardness. He's one of those amiable, irresponsible sorts.

Basically, from the age of 11, my mother had to raise me alone. My brother was a rebellious teenager who did lots of crap--but he did okay in the end after he was thrown out of the house. There was no car; she really couldn't drive. I wasn't that bad of a kid--but I was difficult. We all came out pretty decently because of her ability to be a good mother, and a good advocate.

This is coming from someone who really has a rather strong dislike for his mother, by the way.



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03 Jun 2014, 3:01 pm

I live in London. He will take the underground. It's a long walk to my son's school and afterschool care. But it's not undoable. Mainly he just uses it as an excuse. He's never learned to drive.



tarantella64
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03 Jun 2014, 9:48 pm

elkclan wrote:
I live in London. He will take the underground. It's a long walk to my son's school and afterschool care. But it's not undoable. Mainly he just uses it as an excuse. He's never learned to drive.


Oh dear god. Living in London and you're getting non-driving excuses? Wow.

I probably wouldn't have learned to drive either, if that's where I lived. Act of masochism more than transportation. Or maybe parity, not sure.



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04 Jun 2014, 2:57 pm

tarantella64 wrote:
If that's what your mom told you, NK, so it goes, but I couldn't recommend any woman giving up her career after marriage. Not safe for her or the kids.

I know a doc who stayed home after having her three. Know her pretty well. The guy turned out to be not so marvelous...


It sounds as though we've seen gender-reversed examples of the same problems. What's the best way to deal with that? Right now I can't recommend to any of my male friends that they share a mortgage with a spouse. If she wants money as part of the relationship, I would rather give her a negotiated amount each month and not be exposed beyond that. I've seen that end very badly for guys who were 100% faithful and kind.

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Perhaps the leverage your mom was talking about was simply insurance against things like this. Dunno. I don't see how this equates to "fine, then the guy's entitled to an open marriage." He has a job, she has a job, they both do home-type work, this is a rough equality. If you're then going to talk about open marriages, then that equality would suggest that it's open for both -- assuming they agree this is how they want the marriage to be.


I think that a lot of guys would be just fine with that.

As for equality, the legal precedent in the US is that it has to be more than treating acts equally. It's not equal to have different punishments for possession of crack and powdered cocaine, for example. It wouldn't be equal for my mom to suggest that we both give up olives for Lent, since she hates them and I love them.

(By the way, I will reply to you on your earlier post. I wanted to think about what you wrote.)



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04 Jun 2014, 7:42 pm

tarantella64 wrote:

I know a doc who stayed home after having her three. Know her pretty well. The guy turned out to be not so marvelous, sleeps with everything with a pulse, full of excuses about why he's not coming home. Who knows what else he lies about She's pretty well trapped. Nobody around here needs a rusty doc, he's still paying her loans, keeps her on a short leash otherwise, and she's not trained for any other work that'd do much more than cover childcare.

Other fora are full of crying, terrified ladies who went into marriage all Disney-eyed and stopped working, have kids. Guy turned out to be a horror and not only went and found fresh companionship but dumped their asses cold. So now what? No job, big resume gap, kids. Not so dandy for the kids, poverty and life with a freaked-out mom who has no useful resume. Especially if the guy's vindictive and lawyers up effectively. Legal Aid, not quite the same thing.


Yeah, I was raised the same way.

I was brought-up to be independent and to think that, "A Man is Not a Financial Plan." It wasn't supposed to be sexist against men or anything, just that I should earn my own keep and not expect men to take care of me.

If someone is content with an "open relationship," I'm cool with that, but I just wanted to state that women who want their financial independence aren't necessarily trying to be difficult.


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04 Jun 2014, 8:01 pm

starvingartist wrote:
kraftiekortie wrote:
Not driving, and not taking the bus, does isolate one, does prevent one from doing most things in this modern age. One can't go to Costco and carry stuff out with a bike!

Your husband must have some really muscular legs, since he has to walk or bike miles.

I agree: what's fair is fair. I wouldn't want to be prevented from travelling, attending "evening things, etc." by someone who makes excuses. He'd be a horrible father in this instance as well.

I would hate it if your "Disney-eyed" visions were dissipated by this sort of reality.


i don't shop at costco--but i have no trouble getting all my groceries home by bike. :wink:


Same here. It's amazing what you can carry in a good backpack and a handlebar basket.
And biking around with a heavy backpack does nice things for your upper body strength.


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kraftiekortie
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04 Jun 2014, 8:18 pm

To be honest, I wouldn't be able to ride a bike in Central London, unless it was in Hyde Park or something.

I suppose, if I had a motorcycle-style storage area on my bike, that I'd be fine as well. I'd have to adjust if I had to rely on handlebars. I have slight troubles with balance, for whatever reason--Aspergian, who knows?

I refuse to ride a bike within the streets of Manhattan.



AspergianMutantt
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04 Jun 2014, 10:02 pm

I am starting to get oh so sick of this subject.


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tarantella64
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04 Jun 2014, 10:38 pm

So am I! My god, it'll be lovely when people have the sense not to write sexist crap and hit submit, and/or Alex gives the go-ahead for moderation of sexism, and I can go back to spending my evenings watching Yes, Minister or whatever.



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04 Jun 2014, 11:20 pm

tarantella64 wrote:
So am I! My god, it'll be lovely when people have the sense not to write sexist crap and hit submit, and/or Alex gives the go-ahead for moderation of sexism, and I can go back to spending my evenings watching Yes, Minister or whatever.



So you're here just for being a free time vigilante? I'm just glad we can move on from random bickering and most of the simple whiners will find something else to keep busy on and let real change happen.



kraftiekortie
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04 Jun 2014, 11:35 pm

If I were home in the evenings, I would probably watch C-Span.



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05 Jun 2014, 2:29 am

elkclan wrote:
I've read every post in this thread (I think)

When I heard about this guy and his sense of entitlement and his engagement with the PUA community and his diagnosis, I thought about this sub-forum immediately. I've seen so many similar comments in this sub-forum like:

American/Western women are no good, you need to get a foreign woman...


Why would you be threatened by that? If you're good enough to compete on a global scale (something that I have to do every day), then it's the guy's loss if he has to settle for a foreign bride. If not, then yes, you have something to worry about.

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...The whole 'rating' system of men and women and how all women rate men solely on certain criteria (looks, wealth, cars, other status markers)...


From a guy's perspective: Two of the most common first questions asked at singles-oriented parties are "Where did you go to school" (meaning college) and "What do you do" (meaning work). Those are very poor measures of how intelligent a guy is, but a good gauge of how much money he'll make. They also rarely ask anything further. How would you interpret that if you were me?

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...That it's men and only men who suffer rejection


Where have you heard that? I haven't. If the claim is that it's more frequent for men, the current demographic data would back it up. Women tend to date men who are a little older, so a declining population means more men competing for the same women. A baby boom leads to the opposite. (Considering the latter, I'm actually sympathetic to second wave feminists being a little frustrated.)

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An unrealistic assessment of their own attractiveness as a mate or sexual partner - either positively or negatively - leading to negative assumptions about other people's motivations.


I've heard quite a few women say that men should date "smart girls," by which they seem to mean bookish ones. Would they date a "tinkering engineer?" He may be very, very smart. A master wordsmith who sits in a corner writing self-edifying fiction doesn't help me much. Lots of people have inflated ideas of how valuable their assets are to the opposite sex.

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...True enough superficial sexual encounters are often based on superficial criteria. Partners for longer lasting relationships are chosen on less superficial criteria (as a general rule, not saying some people don't choose based on superficial criteria, but I don't think they'll be happy in the long run).


This is the bargain that you seem to be offering: When you're young and cute and have lots of free time, you'll play with superficial guys. Then when you're 30 and want kids, you'll look for a guy who's willing to do all of the hard work now that you have less to give back. Why would anybody sign up for that?

To be fair, a lot of young men pass over women who would make excellent friends/mothers/soulmates/etc. Birth control may even make it harder for younger women who want kids if it means that men have an easier time finding 'just sex' relationships. I try to be helpful about that when I can be.

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Guys who fool themselves with this PUA nonsense are handicapping themselves in finding a partner.


It's not just guys. A gay friend of mine has many stories of straight women unloading to him about their frustrated singledom. A lot of them are upset that men don't respond in the way that they want, but often they're trying to get it through elaborate schemes and passive aggressive herding. My friend put it simply: "Guys don't like being manipulated."