Rant. Ugh.

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it really doesn't matter what label you attach to the behaviour. it is just as unacceptable.

the amount of information we require to satisfy us in making a judgement is individual. if you need more information about the girl's overall character, then ask Jonsi directly. we think that the behaviour in and of itself is enough to judge. if you don't, then the onus is on you to seek more information before making a judgement.

we are partly basing our impressions on Jonsi's reaction. we do not have the full story of her character, but he has a much more complete picture. so we are not operating in a vacuum. he had a strong reaction based on his own package of information, and only gave us some details. we are encouraging him to listen to that response and think about what it means about that girls character. you are telling him to deny that gut reaction, which is really not a good idea.

I'm glad people challenged the sentence. It was poorly chosen in a haste, and then I left the boards for the night. Not what I should have been doing; I much prefer being able to correct it.

All I've really said in this thread is that the woman deserves one opportunity to correct herself, after some time for her to think things through. I fail to see how there can be any harm in that; it is the manner in which she'll attempt to do that that will tell the most about who she is.

I think there is a world of difference between acknowledging that someone is unhealthy for you, and saying "it's all their fault because they are a horrible person." It's the later I've been seeing here, and it bothers me.

Read my first post and you'll see that I addressed another factor that gave me pause, that he had too easily slipped into her influence to leave instead of help. Easy to do, in early dating, when you are trying to make a positive impression, but I separately spoke to avoiding that, to being careful to stay who you are. Heading that advice should be enough to keep him from any potential harm in one more contact.

Many people were educated incorrectly about AS. You know the history; she was a product of her time. But I won't argue that you don't have a right to be angry about it: you do.

I've got to run. Shower, go to work. take my daughter to camp .. and be fast about it.

Also, FYI, I disagree with the rampant assumption the girl should have known the person was disabled or special needs. People don't get it, that ASD is a spectrum, that meltdowns are a part of it, etc. Spend time on the parenting board and you'll see how much misinformation we confront every day. What she expressed is what 90 percent (or more) of people seem to believe. They only learn otherwise when they've had good reason to.

Last edited by DW_a_mom on 24 Jun 2011, 12:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.

One cannot bear responsibility for what they are taught but bear full responsibilty for what they have learned. :/

The behaviour itself is unacceptable. What hangs in the balance now is whether redemption is possible. The thread has split into two camps: those who say redemption is impossible after doing such a thing and those who say it is possible, based on how willing she is to see why this hurt jonsi. Jonsi himself seems precisely poised between these two paths. It now all depends on whether they talk to each other again and what she says during that conversation.



He had a very strong negative emotion which is completely understandable. In advising the path that allows for redemption, I'm not advising him to ignore that gut reaction. I'm advising him to not use it as a reason to see her as irredeamable but instead to educate her about why this hurt him. That path, if the both of them are up to it, helps both of them grow as people. She grows to greater acceptance of everybody's humanity instead of continuing on this "normal us" and "comically alien them" path. He grows by opening his heart to the possibility of redemption and forgiveness instead of cutting off, which closes in a heart. Will the two of them be able to make that journey together? I sure hope so.

we based our assumptions on the OP's actual words. not sure what you were reading instead:

Last edited by hyperlexian on 24 Jun 2011, 11:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

the fact she hurt Jonsi is actually not the point to me, though it is sad. what matters is that she demonstrated a cruel reaction to a person with a disability.


he has no responsilibility to help her become a better human being, and if he tried, then i think he will open himself up to the possibility of a worse situation. not every person is redeemable. seriously, with 1 out of every 30 people being a sociopath, i think it is a very good idea to decide which people are worth working on. trusting our instincts is a good first step.

there is an undercurrent of judgement going on, that those of us who think he should move on from this girl are somehow closed to forgiveness. it is not the case. i do think that it is important to be careful about who we give a second chance to.

if you read the articles on dating websites, they give advice to watch a person's behaviour on a date to get an idea of what they could be like in a future relationship. one example is to observe how a person talks to the servers at a restaurant, and another one is to see how the person speaks to their opposite sex parent. i would add a third idea to that list: how the person treats someone with a difference or disability.

You are right, I should have re-read before posting.

But. "Autistic" has become the modern equivalent of "ret*d" and, sorry, despite all the PC it is too common to assume that someone expressing themsleves that way has any understanding of whatharm they are causing. My son is now hiding his diagnosis from kids at school because he is tired of explaining, and that is his choice to make, but having known most of these kids their whole lives I am not about to believe they will all grow up into mean, horrible adults. Their parents are too much to the opposite. They're just stupid kids being stupid kids and someone will have to be the one close enough to ASD to finally teach them about it and leave a lasting impression. And it will have to be a peer. So if jonsi is up to it, why shouldn't it be him? I'd he,s not up to it, fine, that is for him to decide, but for people to actively encourage him to stay inside his rightful anger and not try to teach someone hhe cares about at least enough to ask on a date ... Cannot and will never agree. He doesn't have a duty to do it, but he has an opportunity, and life is best iived without slamming doors on opportunities. Sure, all opportunities carry risks, but most of us live to regret more the risks not taken, than the ones realized. Which is especially true when it comes to dating.

Last edited by DW_a_mom on 24 Jun 2011, 12:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sorry for all the typos and posting errors - the last few were from my phone, which is a pain to type on, proof, or fix.

i don't advocate randomly slamming doors on opportunities, and it could definitely be a good idea to explain to the girl why her behaviour was unacceptable. i just don't think it is a good idea to continue to have contact with her from that point forward.

If she tends to contact you by phone, next time she calls/texts you could shoot her a text explaining why you were disgusted with her behavior and flat out tell her that if that is the kind of attitude she insists on having when it comes to people with disabilities (or however you wish to word it) that you are going to block her from your phone/fb/etc./life.

We don't know yet if she insists that there was nothing wrong in ridiculing the kid. I think it would be mistaken for him to communicate by text like that, since it carries a sort of finality; an unwillingness to consider her apology. If she doesn't actually regret the ridicule, he would be more sure about that fact after having discussed it with her.