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Interracial Dating and double standards

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Fnord
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05 Aug 2013, 6:43 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
IlovemyAspie wrote:
Fnord wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
Uprising wrote:
Fnord wrote:
They didn't want this white guy, yet they complained when this white guy started dating an Asian girl. What the fork? :wink:
I can actually understand why they said that, but that doesn't mean I support their opinion or them themselves personally.
Okay. Why did they say that?
Yes, WHY?
Yes, enlighten us!
At the risk of being convicted of sexism, I've mulled over my own theory this afternoon.

It isn't really racism at work: the ladies would have reacted the same way if Fnord had suddenly brought home a lovely and gorgeous Ukrainian wife, or even some Hollywood starlet.

Women in America (and possibly elsewhere to varying extents) tend to be ruthlessly competitive and excruciatingly status-conscious.

These particular ladies regarded (and still regard) Fnord as being below them socially. They felt that Fnord's solution should have been either to get himself a similarly-low status White woman, or to spend the rest of his life feeling sorry for himself for not being good enough.

Now, with a lovely Filipina, Fnord has sidestepped their social expectations, their hierarchy, and smashed their social superiority. Their expressed hatred of Asian girls, for "stealing" men that they didn't want in the first place, is merely a futile attempt to defend and reassert their social superiority.

"Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned" is as true today as it was when the phrase was coined and when people actually believed in the existence of a literal Hell.

Also, it really annoys these ladies that Fnord has rejected their social expectations for him, and that he truly has no reason to feel bothered by their looking down on him and considering him to be an inferior specimen.

Okay ... that makes some sense, AP ... although I'm still waiting to see what Uprising has to say about it.

What you said seem "High-school-ish", as if those white women were the gatekeepers and arbiters of social acceptability, and that I had somehow violated their assumed positions by bypassing them entirely - sort of like when the American automobile industry priced their products beyond the budgets of most Americans (and denied many of them easy credit), and then expressed indignation against the purchase of cheaper and more reliable Japanese cars.

Again, I'm still waiting for Uprising to explain herself.

(PS: Thanks for calling my Filipina wife 'Lovely'! She is indeed lovely ... she is indeed ...)



Kjas
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05 Aug 2013, 6:45 pm

^^^
For once I think AP's post is actually accurate. I have watched the exact same thing play out in front of me, about me, with pretty much the same situation and reasoning.

ArrantPariah wrote:
Tyri0n wrote:
It's the same concept that was behind southern white men lynching black men who were rumored to have had sexual relations with white women.

White people are f***ing stupid.


Well, except for the racists, I think that if the situation involved a White woman who had no chance of mating with a local White man (for whatever reason--perceived low social status, morbid obesity, mental retardation, or whatever), and if this White woman found love and happiness with a non-White man, then most White men would simply say "good for her!" They wouldn't feel at all threatened, wouldn't ask "why are these so-and-sos taking all of our women?", and really wouldn't want her either to hold out for a White man of similar status or to stay alone and feel bad about herself, just so that the White men could continue feeling superior. If they don't want her, they don't want her, and that's all there is to it.


Actually that's not true.

Most commonly, I get crap for the guys I dance with - from other latinos from the more conservative and traditional countries usually. Even when the guy I am dancing with is latino himself, but mulato or whatnot - and especially when I dance with Asians (one of them even made a facebook post about the treatment he received). And it's just dancing. Don't even get me started on dating.


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IlovemyAspie
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05 Aug 2013, 7:35 pm

Cafeaulait wrote:
IlovemyAspie wrote:
MR_BOGAN wrote:
Cafeaulait wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Cafeaulait wrote:
MR_BOGAN wrote:
Cafeaulait wrote:
Shau wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Shau wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
^ Yes, she's UN personified in a single individual.


You know, I've always had a thing for them Indian girls too. Mmm that caramel skin...


She doesn't look typically Indian.


Shame, that would have been her last hope. Oh well! Plenty of Asians and Indians out there (And do I mean plenty as f**k).


O well, ugly as I am I might as well hang myself on a tree. :cry:


I sure you look attractive. Usually mix race people look better I think, they have more diverse genetics.


Since I don't look typically Indian or East-Asian I will probably die a lone, quiet, unloved life where no man will be physically attracted to me. Especially since the Netherlands are a country that's overwhelmingly white, and all white men go for those incredibly perfect 100,0 % superkawaii Asian and Indian woman.

:cry: :cry: :cry:

Goodbye now *waves*



I should die too, I don't look African black. :( :(


Let´s all die together
If you´re not a black male or Asian female you might as well die right now :cry: :cry: :cry:
Especially if you are ugly and, appearantly, puffy, like me


Go find yourself a short handsome Dutchman. :wink:


my friend went to Holland to visit a friend who is married to a white man (she's black). My friend said it is not very common and that the Dutch can be intolerant. They went to a restaurant on a Sunday and the ladies stared them down. Kind of like what are YOU doing here.


Really? What city was that?
In the Netherlands is quite common to so black female white male couples. Nothing the average Dutchman would stare at or look twice.


Don't remember but it was the women who were staring.


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Fnord
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05 Aug 2013, 7:37 pm

Would you people please stop re-posting the entire history of you conversation?

You could also just PM each other.

Thank you.



IlovemyAspie
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05 Aug 2013, 7:52 pm

Fnord wrote:
Would you people please stop re-posting the entire history of you conversation?

You could also just PM each other.

Thank you.



Excuse the hell out of us!! Lol


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AspieOtaku
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05 Aug 2013, 7:54 pm

An interracial orgy sounds fun! :)


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ArrantPariah
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05 Aug 2013, 8:01 pm

Kjas wrote:
^^^
For once I think AP's post is actually accurate. I have watched the exact same thing play out in front of me, about me, with pretty much the same situation and reasoning.

ArrantPariah wrote:
Tyri0n wrote:
It's the same concept that was behind southern white men lynching black men who were rumored to have had sexual relations with white women.

White people are f***ing stupid.


Well, except for the racists, I think that if the situation involved a White woman who had no chance of mating with a local White man (for whatever reason--perceived low social status, morbid obesity, mental retardation, or whatever), and if this White woman found love and happiness with a non-White man, then most White men would simply say "good for her!" They wouldn't feel at all threatened, wouldn't ask "why are these so-and-sos taking all of our women?", and really wouldn't want her either to hold out for a White man of similar status or to stay alone and feel bad about herself, just so that the White men could continue feeling superior. If they don't want her, they don't want her, and that's all there is to it.


Actually that's not true.

Most commonly, I get crap for the guys I dance with - from other latinos from the more conservative and traditional countries usually. Even when the guy I am dancing with is latino himself, but mulato or whatnot - and especially when I dance with Asians (one of them even made a facebook post about the treatment he received). And it's just dancing. Don't even get me started on dating.


Well, these are racist specimens. It probably isn't the case that they wouldn't touch you with a 10-foot pole themselves, or that they belittle you in other ways, and don't want you getting above yourself. They're just racist.



MR_BOGAN
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05 Aug 2013, 8:04 pm

Cafeaulait wrote:
IlovemyAspie wrote:
MR_BOGAN wrote:
Cafeaulait wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Cafeaulait wrote:
MR_BOGAN wrote:
Cafeaulait wrote:
Shau wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
Shau wrote:
The_Face_of_Boo wrote:
^ Yes, she's UN personified in a single individual.


You know, I've always had a thing for them Indian girls too. Mmm that caramel skin...


She doesn't look typically Indian.


Shame, that would have been her last hope. Oh well! Plenty of Asians and Indians out there (And do I mean plenty as f**k).


O well, ugly as I am I might as well hang myself on a tree. :cry:


I sure you look attractive. Usually mix race people look better I think, they have more diverse genetics.


Since I don't look typically Indian or East-Asian I will probably die a lone, quiet, unloved life where no man will be physically attracted to me. Especially since the Netherlands are a country that's overwhelmingly white, and all white men go for those incredibly perfect 100,0 % superkawaii Asian and Indian woman.

:cry: :cry: :cry:

Goodbye now *waves*



I should die too, I don't look African black. :( :(


Let´s all die together
If you´re not a black male or Asian female you might as well die right now :cry: :cry: :cry:
Especially if you are ugly and, appearantly, puffy, like me


Go find yourself a short handsome Dutchman. :wink:


my friend went to Holland to visit a friend who is married to a white man (she's black). My friend said it is not very common and that the Dutch can be intolerant. They went to a restaurant on a Sunday and the ladies stared them down. Kind of like what are YOU doing here.


Really? What city was that?
In the Netherlands is quite common to so black female white male couples. Nothing the average Dutchman would stare at or look twice.


I really don't have anything to say or add to this conversation, I'm just posting to annoy Fnord. :P


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Kjas
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05 Aug 2013, 8:18 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
Well, these are racist specimens. It probably isn't the case that they wouldn't touch you with a 10-foot pole themselves, or that they belittle you in other ways, and don't want you getting above yourself. They're just racist.


In some cases they were, and in some they weren't - what I noticed about Fnord's post that rang true was this: "were the gatekeepers and arbiters of social acceptability, and that I had somehow violated their assumed positions by bypassing them entirely ".

I've found it to be true in such situations - often they are acting as some kind of gatekeepers, and many times it's not so much about race as it is about culture, or about what they perceive to be "theirs" and get territorial about it as a group. It's more a function of the in-group VS out-group mentality.


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05 Aug 2013, 8:28 pm

Fnord wrote:
What you said seem "High-school-ish", as if those white women were the gatekeepers and arbiters of social acceptability, and that I had somehow violated their assumed positions by bypassing them entirely


Yes, and some women never outgrow it. For some, it becomes even more intense as they age. From my professional experience: watch out for female supervisors. Most supervisors, whether male or female, are narcissistic and mean. But, women are much smarter socially than men, and can be much more clever and ruthless when they decide to bring you down. But, that's for the "work a losing a job" section.

Fnord wrote:
(PS: Thanks for calling my Filipina wife 'Lovely'! She is indeed lovely ... she is indeed ...)


Most Filipinas are quite lovely. Some can be brutal battle-axes, but they are comparatively few.



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05 Aug 2013, 9:40 pm

Kjas wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
Well, these are racist specimens. It probably isn't the case that they wouldn't touch you with a 10-foot pole themselves, or that they belittle you in other ways, and don't want you getting above yourself. They're just racist.


In some cases they were, and in some they weren't - what I noticed about Fnord's post that rang true was this: "were the gatekeepers and arbiters of social acceptability, and that I had somehow violated their assumed positions by bypassing them entirely ".

I've found it to be true in such situations - often they are acting as some kind of gatekeepers, and many times it's not so much about race as it is about culture, or about what they perceive to be "theirs" and get territorial about it as a group. It's more a function of the in-group VS out-group mentality.


Well, okay, "Culturist" then. Or the Spanish "raza", which is different from the Anglophone concept of "race."

With Fnord's situation, I think that it was more about the ladies wanting to keep Fnord in his lower status, for the sake of boosting their own egos.

Also, some women tend to be sensitive about aging, and are worried about getting married before their "use-by" date expires. Some of them may have been thinking "Oh my God. This low-ranking piece of dirt is getting married. Now, I'll be single forever. The Filipinas are even taking our rejects. He won't even be available, in the nearly-unthinkable worst-case scenario, to come running when I whistle."



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05 Aug 2013, 9:59 pm

Do you mean to say that they may have been keeping me in a state of "emergency reserve" against the possibility that no one else would find them attractive?

That.

Is.

CREEPY.



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05 Aug 2013, 10:05 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:
Kjas wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
Well, these are racist specimens. It probably isn't the case that they wouldn't touch you with a 10-foot pole themselves, or that they belittle you in other ways, and don't want you getting above yourself. They're just racist.


In some cases they were, and in some they weren't - what I noticed about Fnord's post that rang true was this: "were the gatekeepers and arbiters of social acceptability, and that I had somehow violated their assumed positions by bypassing them entirely ".

I've found it to be true in such situations - often they are acting as some kind of gatekeepers, and many times it's not so much about race as it is about culture, or about what they perceive to be "theirs" and get territorial about it as a group. It's more a function of the in-group VS out-group mentality.


Well, okay, "Culturist" then. Or the Spanish "raza", which is different from the Anglophone concept of "race."

With Fnord's situation, I think that it was more about the ladies wanting to keep Fnord in his lower status, for the sake of boosting their own egos.

Also, some women tend to be sensitive about aging, and are worried about getting married before their "use-by" date expires. Some of them may have been thinking "Oh my God. This low-ranking piece of dirt is getting married. Now, I'll be single forever. The Filipinas are even taking our rejects. He won't even be available, in the nearly-unthinkable worst-case scenario, to come running when I whistle."


Actually you will find the same phenomena even when you take out race, class or culture. (I have seen this with my own eyes, it's actually kind of funny in a strange way)

When you are a part of a group, and then you go outside that group, or outsiders try to hook up with you, it is never taken well. Simply due to being part of the group. Even when nobody in that group wants you, it is expected that if you choose to do something it will always be within the group. This can apply to small groups of people (say 7 of you) or it can apply to across broad demographics across a population, depending on how people who are members think of the said "group" in question - and usually they don't think too much about it until there is a threat of outsiders.


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05 Aug 2013, 10:44 pm

This seems similar to the "Lobster Pot Syndrome", which is where a pot of lobsters is peaceful, with all the lobsters sitting in the bottom of the pot, but as soon as one of them starts trying to climb out, they rest try to haul him back down to their level. A couple of other examples ...

... In some micro-cultures, people who decide to leave the community, go to college, and get a degree is considered "uppity" by those that were left behind; and instead of being praised and congratulated for their initiate and achievements, they're treated like a prodigal runaway who betrayed friends and family for their own self-gain.

... On some support websites, anyone who has overcome the need for support, and who tries to encourage others to never give up on trying to earn the privileges that others have earned for themselves, is viewed by the others as being "arrogant", "blunt", "brutal", "contentious", "disruptive", "egotistical", "hateful", "malicious", "uncaring", "unfeeling", or just a "troll".



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05 Aug 2013, 10:47 pm

Actually I did use the correct term for it, but that's essentially correct - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingroups_and_outgroups


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05 Aug 2013, 10:55 pm

So, being part of the "Ingroup" seems to have it's drawbacks - You don't dare express your individuality outside the approval of the ingroup, or risk some sort of punishment by that ingroup. In my case, it was to be labelled as some kind of traitor for not submitting to the ingroup's rules of courtship, or perhaps as a "dim-wit" because I fell for a pretty girl who was not part of the ingroup, and who treated me like someone special. Maybe both.

Now ... if only Uprising would come back and elaborate on her POV, we could all gain a broader understanding of the situation.

........

Curiously, I'd have never reached this current understanding on my own, having never really considered myself as part of any ingroup, even if only as the ingroup's token kicking puppy.