THE MAKES AND MODELS OF BICYCLES GAME.

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Thorn Raven.

Hmm, I'll have to measure the frame. From the middle of the crank to the middle of the top tube is it?

Roberts Cumbria

Not on the old Dawes bikes. They were measured from the middle of the bottom bracket to the top of the seat tube if I recall correctly.
However, If I remember, they were later measured from the centre of the BB to the centre of the seat clamp bolt? I am trying to remember. But certainly the older ones were centre of the BB to the top of the seat tube.

It's 23"

Kona Sutra

Is the seat bolt to the rear of the seat tube or the front? All the older Dawes frames put them at the back with their mountain bikes. They were at the front with the later bikes from about 1990 onwards.

Kona... Uhmmm. Trying to remember. At one time nearly all the well known "Foreign" mountain bike manufacturers had their frames manufactured by Giant. Companies like Muddy Fox, Alpine Stars... Many like that and I believe Kona if I am not mistaken... They were all made by Giant. The manufacturers sent off their designs and Giant made them. Dawes were one of the last sizeable manufacturer to build their bikes in the UK. Pashley are about the largest these days. But many frames were measured to the centre of the top tube like you mentioned... The most common approach was centre of BB to centre of the seat bolt.
Some of todays bikes like Boardman (Now owned by the Halfords group and made by the same far east manufacturer as their Carreras etc are) decided to take the top tube length as their frame size instead of the usual methods. I don't know if this was continued after Halfords took over the brand. (They were exclusively sold through Halfords stores and to be honest, I have noticed some improvements since they became glorified Carreras as some of the worst bits about the Boartman frame design were ironed out... Though I still hate internal cable routing!)


Sorry. I am editing this as I may not be helping much...

It's at the back, it could be as early as 1984.
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Orbit Harrier

I was told Dawes first introduced their mountain bikes in 1986 with the Dawes Cougar. I maybe wrong in this.

In my area, the first bike similar to a mountainbike was a Raleigh Bomber which ran on 26"MTB snakeskin tyres (Remember those tyres?) and used a Sturmey Archer 3 speed hub gear. This was in 1983.
In about 1985 I came accross the first mountain bike I had seen. A young lad living opposite my grandparents house had bought it. It was a 15 speed Peugeot MTB. I was impressed. The bike was built either in 1985 or 1984. I rather think 1985.
It wasny really until about 1989 onwards that in the UK most of the major manufacturers turned to making mountain bikes. By this time the few manufacturers who converted earlier were well established and had several models in their range. Raleigh made one of their largest mistakes foe many years when they came out with the Activator around 1990 to 91 onwards. The rear suspension was a rubber block. It was ok. A tried and tested simple method of suspension. But their forks? We saw new bikes come into te shop after the owners had just bought them from Halfords and one could hole the front wheel, and due to the excessive sideways play, one could push it and the tyre would hit the fork arms either side. And the bikes weighed more then most tandems, and even heavier then some trikes. Heavy things! Raleigh did made some really decent mountain bikes as well. One was made from 531, and this was made around 1986 to 1988 If I recall. I don't have the model name, but I did have one that I rebuilt from a frame. I gave it to my cousins boy and he has neglected it, so it maybe coming back to me in the future.

It may have been marketed as an All terrain bike.

I do remember the Bomber, something like the a cross between a BMX and a MTB. My first bike was a tiny little

Raleigh Burner

I remember the Burners. Never had one. They were far too expensive. Raleigh didn't half hype up the prices back then. For the same price one could buy a Reynolds 501 framed racing bike with a double chainset and aluminium wheels. Mine you. My bikes were all secondhand until my parents bought me a 12 speed Falcon racing bike (Actually touring geometry) and I believe it took them either 3 or 5 years to pay for it. It was the first new bike I had and I was about 13. I went miles and miles on it.

Yeah, the burners were around £300 I think, I had a BMX that was £60 and rather heavy. The Bomber was a kids bike.

Trek Madone

Around 1983 or 1984 I believe they were £149.99. It was the blue and yellow one with the cheap plasticky wheels. A pair of those wheels on their own cost £49.99 in those days if I remember. Very expensive and inferior to a traditional wire spoked wheel. It was more of a fashion statement. They are still made today. The only good thing about them was that to true them up one put them in the freezer.

Remember the game too!
Litespeed T1SL

Pashley PDQ.

Moulton APB

Gitane (French bicycles. Can't recall any models).

Flying Pidgeon. (The worlds largest bicycle manufacturer who are in China and who produce bicycles for the Chinese market).