Unfair targeting by a Mod
They should not come off as someone on a power trip. Or as heavy-handed or intimidating or unapproachable to many.
If they are moderating in areas where politics or religion is being discussed/debated they should not come off as heavily biased. If there are two sides going at it, one side should not feel like the moderator is an enforcer for the other side.
If there are two sides, call them Orange team and Green team, a moderator should not come off as being like the captain of the Green team. He/she should not be using the same type of jargon the Green team uses against the Orange team.
That makes things unfair and unbalanced and discourages posting.
You are right but take it into account that people with radical political views tend to interpret any disagreement with them as supporting the opposite option. The mods need to deal a lot with such people.
When a moderator talks about clamping down on vailed rule breaking by cryptofascists, I see a tyrant to be painfully blunt and honest. And I see a specific group being targeted who are not actually "cryptofascists" but are viewed as such by that moderator.
Indeed, a moderator who can't separate the rules from their own views is not doing the best job...
I guess I spend too little time in PPR to know who you mean. Probably healthy for me
It is in the last post (at this time) of a short locked thread called "Conservative Snowflake Invasion"
viewtopic.php?f=20&t=380899&p=8350097#p8350097
The mod's post contains two paragraphs.
In the first, he expresses his opinion quite in line with the OP.
In the second paragraph, he explains that despite this, the thread breaks the rules so he locks it.
It is actually an example of personal views separated from actions as mod.
_________________
Let's not confuse being normal with being mentally healthy.
<not moderating PPR stuff concerning East Europe>
The mod's post contains two paragraphs.
In the first, he expresses his opinion quite in line with the OP.
In the second paragraph, he explains that despite this, the thread breaks the rules so he locks it.
It is actually an example of personal views separated from actions as mod.
In my opinion what qualifies as a "cryptofascist" can be quite subjective and tempered with bias. And it sounds like the plan is to add a new layer to the rules as interpreted by an individual.
There are times when I am accused by certain members of implementing some tactic. And I wish in a way my mind operated that way. But the truth is that I am usually just trying to put a thought into words which can be difficult and time consuming enough, without also trying to conger up some sort of tactic.
I agree that the "cryptofascist" talk was crossing the line and coming dangerously close to witch hunt.
I just interpreted it as his personal opinion, maybe even exaggerated by the fact that he had to lock a thread he agreed with.
_________________
Let's not confuse being normal with being mentally healthy.
<not moderating PPR stuff concerning East Europe>
I just interpreted it as his personal opinion, maybe even exaggerated by the fact that he had to lock a thread he agreed with.
Well it helps to be familiar with the person who wrote it.
I just interpreted it as his personal opinion, maybe even exaggerated by the fact that he had to lock a thread he agreed with.
Well it helps to be familiar with the person who wrote it.
Probably. But I refuse to carefully read PPR threads for this purpose.
_________________
Let's not confuse being normal with being mentally healthy.
<not moderating PPR stuff concerning East Europe>
And from someone who praised the destruction of Libya calling it a success. When that involved us supporting Al Qaeda and turning one of the most prosperous nations in Africa into a Jihad central hell hole where people are sold as slaves in the capital city.
_________________
"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
They should not come off as someone on a power trip. Or as heavy-handed or intimidating or unapproachable to many.
If they are moderating in areas where politics or religion is being discussed/debated they should not come off as heavily biased. If there are two sides going at it, one side should not feel like the moderator is an enforcer for the other side.
If there are two sides, call them Orange team and Green team, a moderator should not come off as being like the captain of the Green team. He/she should not be using the same type of jargon the Green team uses against the Orange team.
That makes things unfair and unbalanced and discourages posting.
You are right but take it into account that people with radical political views tend to interpret any disagreement with them as supporting the opposite option. The mods need to deal a lot with such people.
When a moderator talks about clamping down on vailed rule breaking by cryptofascists, I see a tyrant to be painfully blunt and honest. And I see a specific group being targeted who are not actually "cryptofascists" but are viewed as such by that moderator.
Indeed, a moderator who can't separate the rules from their own views is not doing the best job...
I guess I spend too little time in PPR to know who you mean. Probably healthy for me
I mainly go there to look at the memes thread. But I see that someone went on a thread locking spree there. gee I wonder who that could have been?
I do not throw around terms like "cryptofascist" lightly.
To my knowledge, there are two somewhat active users on this forum who hold fascist views. One of them is not especially active and is scrupulously good at posting within the forum rules; they very rarely need any form of moderator action, and I think they are genuinely more interested in using the forum than in spreading fascist propaganda. They used to push the boundaries a bit, but now will only mention their views sideways ("I'd love to tell you more about what I think but it would probably get me banned...").
So I'm literally talking about one person, and it isn't anyone I've had to take action against in recent weeks. This user contributes a lot of good to the forum and would genuinely be missed but does, to use the crypto term, "let their power level show" on occasion. I won't say any more because I think it's somewhat unfair. I do realise that my somewhat vague description might make people worry that it is them, so if you're concerned that it might be you then it isn't you, but you can drop me a PM if you want certainty.
I think we have a lot of:
- contrarian conservatives who don't mind welfare spending
- traditional social conservatives who might occasionally find themselves agreeing with fascist talking points, but are genuinely horrified by fascism
- people who find progressive views, or a subset of them, exasperating or infuriating or just plain stupid
and they're absolutely welcome. And actually, both the cryptos are absolutely welcome - they both have a lot of positive qualities. But we've been somewhat naive about the effect of people constantly "pushing the boundaries" and it has made so many discussions utterly toxic.
To my knowledge, there are two somewhat active users on this forum who hold fascist views. One of them is not especially active and is scrupulously good at posting within the forum rules; they very rarely need any form of moderator action, and I think they are genuinely more interested in using the forum than in spreading fascist propaganda. They used to push the boundaries a bit, but now will only mention their views sideways ("I'd love to tell you more about what I think but it would probably get me banned...").
So I'm literally talking about one person, and it isn't anyone I've had to take action against in recent weeks. This user contributes a lot of good to the forum and would genuinely be missed but does, to use the crypto term, "let their power level show" on occasion. I won't say any more because I think it's somewhat unfair. I do realise that my somewhat vague description might make people worry that it is them, so if you're concerned that it might be you then it isn't you, but you can drop me a PM if you want certainty.
I think we have a lot of:
- contrarian conservatives who don't mind welfare spending
- traditional social conservatives who might occasionally find themselves agreeing with fascist talking points, but are genuinely horrified by fascism
- people who find progressive views, or a subset of them, exasperating or infuriating or just plain stupid
and they're absolutely welcome. And actually, both the cryptos are absolutely welcome - they both have a lot of positive qualities. But we've been somewhat naive about the effect of people constantly "pushing the boundaries" and it has made so many discussions utterly toxic.
I do not think it is me, but quite frankly I am uncomfortable sending you a PM. I do not dislike you and do not want to be a trouble maker or give you a hard time. But you are making people feel uncomfortable and are upsetting them. People should not feel threatened or intimidated or targeted. I am sure in your mind there is no reason for them to feel that way, but they do nonetheless.
Forums can be very quickly destroyed when the moderation system becomes corrupt. And it only takes one moderator — immature, or inexperienced, or bigoted, or sociopathic, or ignorant — to corrupt such a system.
When that happens, users in general no longer trust even the decent moderators because they don't know if their private messages are getting through, they don't know if their posts are being stealth-edited to misrepresent their views, they don't know if false statements are being made about them in private corners for manipulative purposes, etc.
Within the circle of moderators on any forum, even small-time abusers (to say nothing of full abusers) should be removed, because they destroy trust in the whole system.
_________________
There Are Four Lights!
To follow the logic of a previous post as it applies to the general membership...
Forums can be very quickly destroyed when trolls find them. And it only takes one troll -- immature, inexperienced, bigoted, sociopathic, ignorant, et cetera -- to to ruin it for everyone.
When that happens, users in general tend to no longer post in even the most decent threads because they don't know if their posts will get pounced on, criticized, and torn apart every which-way, they don't know if their posts will be twisted and distorted to misrepresent their views, and they don't know when the next false statements will be made about them for no reason at all.
Within the circle of members on any forum, even small-time abusers (to say nothing of full-on trolls) should be removed, because they destroy trust in the whole system.
What exactly is a "small-time abuser"? Someone whose own opinions are in conflict with another's? Someone who posts on the same topic over and over again, and even in threads unrelated to their favorite topic? Someone whose posts are only walls of text or word salads that do not parse and make no sense at all? Someone whose posts consist solely of single-word replies and "smilies"? Someone who seems to have little or no understanding of proper grammar, punctuation, or spelling? Someone who habitually uses (or does not use) the Oxford Comma?
Being unpopular is insufficient cause for banishment. It's the reason(s) why someone is unpopular that provide(s) just cause.
_________________
The mere fact that science may not yet adequately explain an object, event, or experience does not mean the immediate explanation should automatically default to a conspiratorial, extraterrestrial, paranormal, or supernatural cause.
When that happens, users in general no longer trust even the decent moderators because they don't know if their private messages are getting through, they don't know if their posts are being stealth-edited to misrepresent their views, they don't know if false statements are being made about them in private corners for manipulative purposes, etc.
Within the circle of moderators on any forum, even small-time abusers (to say nothing of full abusers) should be removed, because they destroy trust in the whole system.
I've had that experience and one of the former mods couldn't understand why I didn't just go to another moderator when I got a strange PM from one of them saying I was helping trolls break rules here and stuff. This was back in 2009.
I think it's pretty normal to feel uncomfortable with the whole staff team when one or few of them are bad. Like if you were to walk into a store and the cashier was grumpy and unfriendly and seemed annoyed with you as a customer, you wouldn't want to go back because your mind will automatically think all the store employees there are like that. Same with forums too when one of the mods is bad or the admin. And of course I am sure the manager will wonder "Why didn't you talk to the manager" when you had a problem with one of their employers. Maybe they didn't want to sound like a Karen or they thought the manager would also be as bad.
_________________
Son: Diagnosed w/anxiety and ADHD. Also academic delayed and ASD lv 1.
Daughter: NT, no diagnoses. Possibly OCD. Is very private about herself.
^ Wish I had a dime for every time I was called a c_nt, accused of being a misandrist, or otherwise been the target of someone's desire to have me de-modded.
Being unpopular isn't a valid measuring stick for a mod's effectiveness.
_________________
"If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced."
-XFG (no longer a moderator)
We're not NTs here, let's not act like them (at least in this respect). You don't have to be popular to be a good person.
_________________
The mere fact that science may not yet adequately explain an object, event, or experience does not mean the immediate explanation should automatically default to a conspiratorial, extraterrestrial, paranormal, or supernatural cause.
