Acutely asocial, really need to find others to work with

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Ok, here's my convoluted mess :

I live in Copenhagen Denmark, but I'm from South Africa. I'm an english speaker - I'm fluent in Danish at the "office" level (I'm a computer programmer), but when it comes to personal / social stuff, it just doesn't seem to work for me. Expressing logic in Danish is easy for me - feelings and abstract ideas are totally different. Over here you are expected to speak the local language if you want to get serious stuff done ... english covers the casual, but it's not going to open doors for you.

I'm not very social. I have a wife - talking to her is more than enough to keep me socially fulfilled. I cannot stand hanging out with people making small talk - in fact, it's downright excruciating. Needless to say, I don't have a lot of friends, here or anywhere. Most of the friendships I've had in the past were based on either science, music, gaming or some other burning interest.

Bear with me, we're getting there ... I'm a self-trained photographer/graphic arts enthusiast - I started about two years ago just for fun, but I've become totally consumed by it. The problem is there are limits to what you can teach yourself. At best it's slow. I prefer learning alone from books, but I've reached the point where I just know that I need to see how other people do things. I'm into strongly textured dark/surrealistic horror - technique is ESSENTIAL for me. It's not good enough that my work has a bit of this and a bit of that - I really need to have the mood AND the narrative AND the technique all overlayered and 300% there, and anything less is a complete failure and I will tear it up and go sit in a corner for a week and mope. I also need to find other people to work with, like models or costume designers, but once again most art people seem totally stuck on chitchat and hanging out and this isn't going anywhere.

So ... does anyone else go through this? Can anyone suggest ways to get past this? Personal experiences? I've tried several times to approach people for modeling or collaboration, but nothing's panned out, and I'm frustrated. Feel like I'm fighting two losing battles here : asociality AND language

Even though you are already knowledgeable about the field I would enroll in a class at the University. You will find a lot of focused dialogue there and peers that are highly interested in refining their technique. When I was in art school I enjoyed the conversations about technique but if I happened to be at a social situation with my professors they didn't want to talk about it.

Thanks the reply. I've tried looking a bit for night courses, but haven't been lucky yet with ones that are at the right level - most part-time courses that I find are at the beginner level, and then once you get more advanced I guess you start doing day courses. Maybe I just haven't figured out where to look.

what kind of graphic arts? I do a lot of that for fun (3d renders, and I'm nowhere near good...but it's fun...

There's sites like 3d commune, Renderosity, Daz 3d, etc., where artists of all sorts get together. All sorts of types come there. There's tutorials, forums, etc., to get started. If you can find some web sites that cover your particular form of expression, there should be a forum somewhere that you can ask questions of.

There's all sorts of interest groups (at least in the US, though I don't doubt you'll find them everywhere), either online, or in person. Find small ones at first, and maybe as you get comfortable with the idea, you can ratchet up to larger groups. People like to help (sometimes), and it's a place to start.

I guess it would fall under "fine art". It's mostly photography with a lot of texturing, occasionally with some some drawing mixed in (I have a small portfolio site at www.manafeed.com). It mixes up a bunch of stuff, which I suppose adds to the difficulty of finding formal training. Plus I'm really impatient, and won't sit through learning things I can't directly use Yes, a lot of my problems are just my own quirks, but I guess that's what having AS is about.

I use a few forums for information. Since I started drawing with a Wacom tablet I've hit some fantasy art forums to pick up pointers, many of them useful, but from experience I know I learn a lot just by watching someone else work, so that aspect is missing. Sometimes you have really basic questions, like how do you do brush strokes, and what specific brush settings do you use, and how do you micromanage colours, and having someone there in the flesh to explain it would be easier.

Anyway, I think I just wanted to hear how other aspie artists get past social problems ... I need some ideas

I've been through two art schools in New York and they don't require much socialization. In life classes with models you work and occasionally the instructor makes a point or two but you work at your own level. I attended a school back in 1949 called "The Cartoonists and Illustrator's School" It since has changed to "The School of Visual Arts" (SVA) but Burne Hogarth was director then, the guy who used to draw Tarzan comic strip and he was a terrific artist and since has published a book on anatomy that is very good, My favorite anatomy book is Bridgeman's "Complete Guide to Drawing From Life" that pays attentions to muscles but deals with bulk and dynamic movement. Artists mostly learn by example and drawing on their own. It doesn't require socialization. The Google image section is a great reference source. Good comic artists like Walt Kelly are worth paying attention to. Buy good tools. A good Windsor Newton watercolor brush is expensive but if you care for it and keep it clean it's a great tool for learning all the techniques. A number 6 or 7 brush is a standard for working with ink. If you know computers you can really screw around with Photoshop and a scanner to get great effects. It'a a lonely difficult business and you have to turn out a mess of garbage to get things right. Work on cheap paper and keep at it. It requires more sweat than talent but if you keep at it you'll get there.

Thank you. That right there was what I was hoping to hear. I'm grinding away, drawing every day, producing what I consider to be crap. I figure a little bit out each day, and all of those bits slowly settle to the bottom and condense to form a base on which to work, but I would like to know that others feel this too. I'm sure it would go faster if I went to school but I cant see myself doing that now. I'll continue plugging away at home.

re : google image as a reference source, yeah, it is

Another question : in your opinions, is it worth the while getting short, private tuition? I don't want to throw lots of money at it, but I'd be willing to pay someone for a few focused lessons, if I can find someone who can understand what it is I'm trying to do. Or should I just continue plugging away alone, and assume I'll end up at the right place eventually? I wold like to point out that I'm a self-educated professional programmer. Almost everything that I know I learned from books, and the few short courses I took didn't do much for me. Doing it that way took longer than a proper education would have, but I wasn't really in a hurry. I guess the same could work for art?

Since your work is already clearly past the beginner level (based on your portfolio) I second the suggestion of taking classes at an art school or University. (Especially art school.)

For one thing, when you get past the level of classes that cater to the hobbyist artist, you'll find the it's more likely that the other students will already be quite passionate and knowledgeable about art. The more like that they are, the more they tend to be hungry for conversation about art and technique (since they can make small talk just about anywhere else).

I found this to be true when I took a few classes at an art and design school years back.

If you're lucky you might get a great teacher but that happens only once in a lifetime. At Pratt Institute I had a great sculpture teacher but she had a very fixed agenda and was marvelous within that very limited agenda but I've learned more since. Go to museums and galleries and see what is and has been done. The amount of crap there is stupendous but once on a while lightning strikes and you learn something. Graphic art, like literature, is a very wide field. There are great comic books, advertisement, type designs, street graffiti, classical painters, modern artists of all varieties, and even coffee stains on the kitchen table. The thing that makes a creative person is that he or she is wide open and very aware and not willing to swallow BS ( although even BS can be interesting on occasion). And don't get discouraged or angry and try to save what you might think at first is terrible and put it aside and look at it again after a week or so. I've done stuff I never could believe I did.

I made my comments before I looked at your work. I am impressed. You obviously have discernment a good sense of design and taste, and I don't think you have any basic problems aside from a sense that you may not appreciate your own capabilities.

My own taste runs towards imagery derived from integrating random forms and colors into some image that appears almost magically on paper with only subconscious direction. Here is one of my pieces.

Wow, cool art ! !!

ok, you're waay past where I am... Sounds like a little Photoshop, Gimp, or other packages like that.

Can't think of anything to add here, all the good points are covered.

hi man, saw your flickr account, great portfolio!

About what to do about your path, I'd suggest you to take classes.
There you'll be able to learn more and with foundations, and you'll have access to models and poses and all that, and (hopefully) socialize =P

Go to art schools and ask. Some teachers are painters, and I'm sure they'll know someone who gives classes or they themselves give classes.
But, even if you don't have a very clear idea in your mind what you want to learn: is it painting, is it illustration, or is it photoshop techniques? you'll still be better (:

BTW there are always magazines and Google for reference, poses and all that.
And books. get some books about photoshop, some texture books, some art books about artists you like.
HRGiger for example, he paints mainly with an airbrush.

Posers. Avoid them, those are the worst.


you like malevolent creation? I think I have somewhere a pic of me with a malevolent creation cap

I hope you can excuse me for recommending these artists since you are obviously quite sophisticated in your knowledge but on the slight chance you might have missed them, it seems to me they have some relationship to your moods if not your style.

George Tooker http://www.tendreams.org/tooker.htm

de Chirico http://www.abcgallery.com/C/chirico/chirico.html

Francis Bacon http://www.ibiblio.org/wm/paint/auth/bacon/

Giger http://images.google.fi/images?hl=en&cl ... e&resnum=1

Thanks so much for the encouragement and kind words. I guess I don't really know how to evaluate my own work because I'm so caught up in where I'm trying to go with it. I can see that a picture of mine meets some kind of technical benchmark, but whether it's good or not, that depends greatly on what day it is.

I guess art school it is then, in some or other form It really helps to have read your various insights. A lot of the time I feel like I work in a hole in the ground. I know every bit of it inside out, but never really see what's happening above.

At least we could give you a bit of an idea that your work is quite good.