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lady_katie
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05 Oct 2012, 1:59 pm

I do consider myself to be a Christian, but I haven't been able to find a church that actually follows the bible, so I've pretty much been on my own in my "spiritual journey" or whatever you want to call it.

For the life of me though, I just cannot understand why Christians claim to follow the bible when it's so obvious that they do not. I'm not talking about Christians who try to follow it but fail here and there, I'm talking about the ones who blatantly disregard the scriptures on the premise that they somehow do not apply to them, or that they mean something different when they obviously do not.

For example, the bible clearly states that women should dress modestly, yet I'll walk into a church and the lady in front of me will have her jeans wedged up her butt and hooker boots on. I've talked to more than one guy that has admit to looking away from the pulpit because the woman who was talking or dancing or whatever was dressed too provocatively and he did not want to have lustful thoughts.

Of course, any church person I've ever talked to about my 'confusion' has basically told me that I'm the one with the problem, or that I'm the one who's misinterpreting the bible. 8O

Now, to me, this doesn't speak of a problem with Christianity - it speaks of a problem with the people who embrace Christianity...but I still can't understand it for the life of me. I like the Christianity that the bible has to offer, but I just can't seem to get along with any Christians to save my life.



GGPViper
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05 Oct 2012, 2:19 pm

Christianity is not like Al Qaeda, Lashkar-e-Taiba, Hamas, Boko Haram or the Taleban *because* it does not follow the bible... except the occasional Santorum.

... It is the main redeeming trait of the Christian faith...

Now be silent, woman (1 Corinthians 14:34).



MrMacPhisto
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05 Oct 2012, 2:20 pm

As. a Christian myself I tend to agree with you a lot of churches seem to be turning a blind eye to the Word of God. I have been in a church and it was a hot summers day and the pastor of that particular church was wearing T-Shirt,Shorts and Sandals now And a womansinging at the front with a very short summer dress. I think when you are in a the House of God especially when you are standing up the front you should try and make yourself smart don't have to wear a suit but try your best though I am a worship leader at my church and I try my best to be smart at my church.



ruveyn
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05 Oct 2012, 3:06 pm

Some Christians believe that Christ -fulfilled- the Old Law and it is no long operative. They believe that Christ gave a New Law.

That is why some Christians do not keep kosher and eat rare meat soaked with blood.

ruveyn



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05 Oct 2012, 3:07 pm

Perhaps Christians don't follow what the Bible teaches because...

... The Bible contradicts itself in many verses.

... The Bible contradicts reality in many verses.

... The Old Testament teaches that God directed His chosen people to engage in conquest through genocide.

... The Bible promotes slavery, and even has rules on how slaves should behave toward their masters.

... The Bible promotes the subjugation of women as second-class citizens, and even has rules on how women should remain in silent submission to their husbands.

... The Bible dictates that adulterers and homosexuals should be put to death.

... The Bible has not one single verse in praise of intelligence.

:evil:


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ruveyn
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05 Oct 2012, 3:14 pm

Fnord wrote:
Perhaps Christians don't follow what the Bible teaches because...

... The Bible contradicts itself in many verses.

... The Bible contradicts reality in many verses.

... The Old Testament teaches that God directed His chosen people to engage in conquest through genocide.

... The Bible promotes slavery, and even has rules on how slaves should behave toward their masters.

... The Bible promotes the subjugation of women as second-class citizens, and even has rules on how women should remain in silent submission to their husbands.

... The Bible dictates that adulterers and homosexuals should be put to death.

... The Bible has not one single verse in praise of intelligence.

:evil:


Wisdom is praised especially in the case of Solomon and Samuel.

ruveyn



lady_katie
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05 Oct 2012, 3:26 pm

Thanks for your thoughts everyone...

Does anyone have an opinion as to what the most logic-based Christian denomination might be? I quite like watching the Duggar family (19 kids and counting) simply because they seem to practice what they preach for the most part. As far as I know they attend a non-denominational home church, which may or may not contribute to them seeming to be less hypocritical. The best I've found has been Presbyterian because they actually read the bible, which you would think would be a given but sadly it is not always the case.



Pyrite
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05 Oct 2012, 3:51 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Some Christians believe that Christ -fulfilled- the Old Law and it is no long operative. They believe that Christ gave a New Law.

That is why some Christians do not keep kosher and eat rare meat soaked with blood.

ruveyn


Unless it involves sodomy. Then the old laws are still valid because Christians later realized that completely wiping the slate clean would deny them divine authority for things they still wanted it for and decided to be really picky. :roll:



Kraichgauer
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05 Oct 2012, 4:12 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Fnord wrote:
Perhaps Christians don't follow what the Bible teaches because...

... The Bible contradicts itself in many verses.

... The Bible contradicts reality in many verses.

... The Old Testament teaches that God directed His chosen people to engage in conquest through genocide.

... The Bible promotes slavery, and even has rules on how slaves should behave toward their masters.

... The Bible promotes the subjugation of women as second-class citizens, and even has rules on how women should remain in silent submission to their husbands.

... The Bible dictates that adulterers and homosexuals should be put to death.

... The Bible has not one single verse in praise of intelligence.

:evil:


Wisdom is praised especially in the case of Solomon and Samuel.

ruveyn


But without Solomon, disputes over children would end up with the child getting cut in half right and left! :lol:

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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05 Oct 2012, 4:16 pm

Because they have seen the light and have come to either realize he is not real or that he is an invisible fascist dictator who is prejudiced against all other cultures and religions.


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Fnord
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05 Oct 2012, 5:16 pm

ruveyn wrote:
Wisdom is praised especially in the case of Solomon and Samuel. ruveyn

Intelligence and wisdom are two different things. The former is the ability to learn new things, while the latter is the ability to apply what you've learned. Learning any things from secular science is frowned upon by many Christians. Applying known Biblical principles to everyday living is considered praiseworthy by many Christians.


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Kraichgauer
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05 Oct 2012, 5:19 pm

Fnord wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Wisdom is praised especially in the case of Solomon and Samuel. ruveyn

Intelligence and wisdom are two different things. The former is the ability to learn new things, while the latter is the ability to apply what you've learned. Learning any things from secular science is frowned upon by many Christians. Applying known Biblical principles to everyday living is considered praiseworthy by many Christians.


Well, fundies. The rest of us actually love science.

-Bill, otherwise known as Kraichgauer



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05 Oct 2012, 5:32 pm

lady_katie wrote:
Thanks for your thoughts everyone...

Does anyone have an opinion as to what the most logic-based Christian denomination might be? I quite like watching the Duggar family (19 kids and counting) simply because they seem to practice what they preach for the most part. As far as I know they attend a non-denominational home church, which may or may not contribute to them seeming to be less hypocritical. The best I've found has been Presbyterian because they actually read the bible, which you would think would be a given but sadly it is not always the case.


You would be better looking for some believers nearby and starting up some home meetings of your own. True Christians are few and far between. As a fellow Christian who also attempts to follow God's commandments to believers in the New Testament, I can say based on my own experience that most "churches" will not have any true believers in them. As you say, most professing "Christians" are blatantly disregarding Jesus' commands, and are clearly not his sheep at all. If they were, they would be following his voice, and they're not. They're following something else instead: society. Hence why there is a blatant disregard for modest apparel in so-called "churches," despite modesty being a biblical commandment.



cubedemon6073
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05 Oct 2012, 5:39 pm

ladie_katie, please read this verse. http://bible.cc/romans/3-23.htm

My impression is in order to be sinless one has to follow 100% of what God says for all of your life. If you break any of his commandments at least once then you have sinned. All of us have sinned. None of us can come to his glory whatsoever. None of us can follow his 100% of his rules for 100% of our lives. We have all broken the commandments from time to time and have sinned. You are looking for a perfect church. It doesn't exist. All will have sin in it.

We are not saved by following any of these rules. We are saved because Jesus died on the cross for our sins. God loved us so much that he gave his only son for us. All we have to do is believe this and he is our lord and savior. IN addition, we have to confess we are a sinner and ask for his forgiveness. That is the whole point. All are welcome into his church and all need to be saved by the blood of the lamb.

Some of the commandments, statues, and laws are a good idea to follow. Some will keep you out of the hospital. Some will keep you out of prison. Following these things will not keep you from being damned.

Fnord, this is why the bible has these contradictions. It is not the laws, commandments and legalism we need to pay attention to we need to pay attention to our relationship with our lord and savior. We have to love our lord with all of heart and might and love our neighbor as we do ourselves. ladie_katie, don't bash anyone in there, pray for them :D :D

What Jesus did was two things.

1. He kept the law in its entirety
2. The penalty for breaking the law has been canceled out. We are still under the law. Murder and stealing are still wrong.



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05 Oct 2012, 6:57 pm

To the above poster: obedience is not legalism. That is a very commonly used accusation from people who profess faith in Christ but do not actually want to do what he said. They say: "if I did what he said, and dressed modestly, I'd be a legalist." That is wholly untrue. Legalism is the attempt to gain entry to heaven by works by following Old Testament law. It is not the same thing as obedience. An obedient, modestly-dressed Christian woman is not hoping to gain her admittance to heaven on the basis that she was modest. Rather, her admittance is solely on the basis of the blood of Christ - and it is precisely because she follows him that she wishes to obey his commandment mentioned specifically in the New Testament, by wearing modest apparel. Legalism and obedience are NOT the same thing. You cannot excuse disobedience by claiming "I didn't want to be a legalist" because legalism involves keeping all the commandments given under the Old Covenant, whereas obedience involves keeping those given under the New. New Testament commandments to women believers include modest dress. Hence, modesty is not "legalism" at all. It is basic Christianity. Your claim that all we have to do is believe in Jesus and confess is a false claim. The Bible points out that demons also believe in Jesus. Believing alone does not save you. You must REPENT of your old life. The two things Jesus commands are REPENTANCE and belief, not confession and belief. Please do not make statements about the Bible that are wrong and do not use the word "legalism" without knowing what it means, otherwise you will confuse people seeking to lead a holy life.



ruveyn
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05 Oct 2012, 7:56 pm

Pyrite wrote:
ruveyn wrote:
Some Christians believe that Christ -fulfilled- the Old Law and it is no long operative. They believe that Christ gave a New Law.

That is why some Christians do not keep kosher and eat rare meat soaked with blood.

ruveyn


Unless it involves sodomy. Then the old laws are still valid because Christians later realized that completely wiping the slate clean would deny them divine authority for things they still wanted it for and decided to be really picky. :roll:


Cafeteria Obedience to God's Commandments. Choose one from column A and two from Column B .

ruveyn