If only I was more...

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Last edited by the_enigma on 27 Mar 2006, 6:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Something tells me Ashley needs a big, warm hug, and needs to be loved for who she is!

You sound like a very bright person, but having such a pessimistic attitude will not get you places in life. Just by the way you express yourself in your post, you are capable of composing a paragraph better than most eleventh graders in my grade can. Although you may not be able to recognize your abilities, focusing on your disabilities will not get you anywhere. Everyone has their quirks and makes mistakes.

Hi Enigma Person

I don't mean to patronise you, but you are obviously anything but unintelligent! Actually, I would say you seem quite bright! . I'm not sure as to how useful any guidance I can provide you with will be, but you are not stupid. Intelligence does not always pertain to booksmarts, you know!

Being a generally good person shows intellect too - Intelligence testing hasn't factored this in yet! It is a pleasure to converse with you; don't be so tough on yourself!

Take Care

Greg

If you believe it would put you at ease, why not consult a psychologist. Have your parents take you to your family doctor [or paediatrician], who will refer you to a reputable clinical psychologist. Another option could be to see a registered psychologist privately, although that could be quite costly! Chin-Up

I think it's wrong that people are taught to be proud of who they are just because of what they can do. I think that when autistic people say "I am proud of who I am because I have a lot of intellectual skills," then it does send an insulting message to people who either don't have them or don't think they have them. (Autistic people aren't alone in this, by the way: Physically disabled people do it pretty often too. And some intellectually disabled people say they're more worthwhile than people with fewer people skills than they have, which of course can be hurtful to autistics.) Basing one's sense of self-worth on being better than someone else at something or on having a skill has consequences for whoever a person is being described as better than or whoever does not have that skill.

I don't know what your intellectual skills are, but I know that you are a worthwhile person (because I don't believe in non-worthwhile people.) I went to special ed as well. One of the first friends I ever made was one of the people you would call a "ret*d" (which does hurt them to be called as much as it hurts you to be called it, by the way) ? her IQ score (and I don't put much stock in IQ tests, by the way) was probably around 20, she was also autistic, and she did not show any outward savant abilities. And she was quite a worthwhile person. All of my current friends are disabled in some way (most autistic). They are all worthwhile people and it's not because of some "special talent". I have also felt inferior to people because of lacking some skill that other people were saying made them worthwhile. But it wasn't true; skills aren't what makes a person worthwhile.

Most disabled people (of any kind) are taught to view ourselves as worthless, and it sounds like you get a fair amount of that. It's not true, though. Even if you feel worthless, it doesn't make you worthless. And concentrating on a skill to make you feel worthwhile ? even if you gained that skill, if you lose it later on you'll have to deal with feeling worthless again.

I am not meaning to sound like I'm telling you what to do or what to think, though. I just know that really hanging onto the idea that a skill is what makes you worthwhile is a very temporary thing and there are more lasting things to base your sense of value on. I also know that's not easy to learn, particularly in a society that looks down on you as "less than other people" for being disabled. (I don't mean that skills are bad things to have, just that a person's intrinsic value isn't based on what skills they have.) But it's possible to learn it, and from what I've seen, people who do eventually learn it (and it takes most people years) end up happier than people who are always looking for a skill to hang onto as proof that they're worth something.

I also know that a few messages like this won't automatically destroy all the messages you're getting from everywhere else that say you're not worthwhile. So don't feel bad if none of us manage to make you feel better. But whether your IQ score or any similar rating is 10 or 210, or where you are in your grade level (and you could just be being undereducated, by the way ? special ed taught me several grade levels below where I'd been before I came there, just because they had lousy teaching), doesn't make a single bit of difference to me, at any rate, in viewing you as worthwhile.



You might have, and you might not have. Simply being autistic, regardless of IQ or other measures (or supposed measures) of intellect, is enough to get people called a "ret*d" and a "psycho" by the other kids, and high-IQ kids can end up in special ed as well. I get called a "ret*d" and a "psycho" just walking down the street, but people who know me tend to consider me fairly intelligent. (I don't really like being considered "really intelligent" or "really unintelligent", frankly; I'd rather just be considered me.) And I was put in special ed and institutions and stuff and have been through a fair bit of crap in my life.

I think, though, that getting out of school, moving out, and knowing people who valued me for what I was rather than what I could or couldn't do helped me a lot. And I'm completely bad at most expected skills for a person my age. So (and this ended up needing to be fought for) I have an assistant here (in my own place) every day who helps me with things most people consider pretty basic. I no longer see that as a horrible thing, though — it's just part of the way I am. There are people who'd consider me a leech and a drain on taxpayers for not being able to do some things, but that's their problem; I'm not less than them just because I can't (in the current setup of society) do a lot of the things that they do without using help that they consider strange. I never thought, by the way, that I'd ever encounter people who understood and valued me as I was, but I've encountered a few and that has made a fair amount of difference in reversing the messages I'd gotten up till then which was that I was the worst person in the world and better off dead. I now don't see myself as better or worse than anyone else, and I'm starting to (for the first time since I started school, really) be happy.

Hey. all of you, settle down!! !! I have never met a better, more sympathetic bunch of people. A long time ago, I decided that it doesn't matter what you do, or how you do it, it's how you feel. I get the definite vibe that some of you are feeling a bit down - is this because you are valuing yourselves in the nt world, or because you think a's b's and c's make you a person? Well I got all the a's I could possibly wish for, but that didn't make me a better or smarter person! To quote some dodgy singer - respect yourself!! !! I'm on more medication and councilling than you could possibly dream of! IT IS DEfinitely not how other people see you, but how you see yourself. You look great, you are intelligent - the others have absolutely no idea!! !! !! ! trust me....

I think it is impossible that you are stupid, why exactly do you think you are not intelligent, any specific examples?

Perhaps your parents placed you in such school because they've thought your Aspie 'weirdness' means you are ret*d.

We all have our moments in life where we feel like trash. But I think your main inhibitor here is the fact that you feel "stupid" because you got put into a school for ret*d people. I was in a similar situation when I was younger. I was falling behind in school, I frustrated really easy, and the only way I could cope would be to repeatedly slam my head up against some covient solid object like the classroom door or wall, some times hard too. Hard enough that school administrators thought I would hurt myself. The district psycologists wanted to send to "Riverview", the school for the ret*d. I was given a full "psyco-educational" exam. The results said I was socially mal-ajusted, and angry young little boy, who would act out in scary and inapporiate ways when stressed. My parents refused though, and I was stuck with all my other classmates.

By the time I got to the end of junior high school, I had reached rock bottom, both socially and emotionally. I had no friends, and was enduring daily bulling. I felt the same way the_enigma does right now.

During my summer of solitude though, I had a moment of revalation. All the problems I've ever had with other people came from the fact that they all had pre-concieved notions of me that I was to be an abject failure in the game of life. I realized that if I became just that, I would be letting all the other people win, and they would be smug and happy in the knowledge that they were right. So, starting in high school, I dedicated myself to proving all those other people wrong. My battle has been long, and sometimes painful, but so far it has paid off.

I work with a guy, who most likely is also an aspie, who feels like the_enigma who is now in his 30's, he's the most misreable person in the world. I don't want to see you, the_enigma turn into that.

Thanks for all of your help, everyone. I'll never let words tell me who I am because they are just mere words from people who don't even know about me that well but only by the label that I wear.
I'll never look at a paper and let a bunch of letters and numbers printed on it show me what kind of person I am.
I'll never let an average person, a doctor or a paper determine who I am and tell me how much I'm worth because only I could measure what a great person I am.

Now you've got it! *thumb up*

You seem very Intelligent to me. I can see it in your typing. I was in Special Ed through School and I don't feel that makes me slow or dumb. I just learn differently. Your sister and her friends are just jealous.

It just sucks that I have to prove myself more than normal people. If I don't do better than a lot of those jerks, I'll still be patronized and belittled.
The thing that sucks about this is that the only thing I'm truly good at is writing while a good majority of people are multi-talented. I'm not even sure if I'm all that great with writing or not.
I've tried sports, instruments, other intellectual subjects, etc but I'm not good enough on either of those things to give me sucess. I am good at other stuff but not any better than the normal person...
It's as if it's more pressure on me to be more rich and famous than most NT's. It just has to be that way to prove my self worth. I don't want to spend the rest of my life being "the NT's burden" as in a waste of space, time and energy.
I don't really have the talents that these internet articles say that an autistic should have. I hate math, I don't have much interest in computers, science is ok, I'm really poor at doing anything in the arts, I don't think I have a savant skill, I don't know very much about engineering but from what I've heard it's not that interesting.
I've met plenty of kids my age who have accomplished far more than I have and the ones who didn't are just bad kids who don't give a s*** about their future.
I'm just so worried about what I have to offer to the world. It would really suck to live and be a person who's either a burden, someone to belittle or living proof that people should be lucky not to be like me and then die for no reason. I just want my entire life to have a point, that's all.

You have a talent: writing. What the internet say a person with an ASD should have as a specific talent is all judgement and should not be compared to yourself. You are going into 10th grade yet you write better than I do and I am going into 12th, you are a very talented writer. Weather or not you have to prove yourself is up to you. Let people think what they want to think of you (I am not saying to give up though). Because you're not an NT doesn't mean you should not be treated differently from one.

the_enigma,

[I am not sure if I should be entitled to say what I want to say here. I hope that you would not find my post patronizing. I sincerely believe in what I wrote below.]

I am reading your posts and one thing comes to my mind - that you are an achiever. You want your life to have a point, and if you keep this determination, you will most likely achieve your goals. These goals might be difficult to find, but I believe that you will succeed.

I disagree with this point. Most people are zero-talended, unfortunately, they only attempt to give impression of the opposite. If you are good at even one thing, then this is a tremendous advantage.


I think that this is a very good situation. Pressure motivates for action. The_enigma, try to become more rich or famous than most! Most people do not even try and just survive from one day to another. Be different, that's a rare trait!

i would love to finish books in a day, i really would. i have so many untouched fascinating books that my eyes cant even follow the lines for more than 5 pages sometimes.
i had an accident that rendered me speechless for a year after, so im my own mind i am really 16 not 17. i was never put back a year, even though you could tell i was doing absolutely awful in the year i was in. set 4 and 5 for every single subject.
ummm yeah i cant remember the point now..
well when you leave school you will truly find your OWN intelligence. grading and marking can seriously put a downer on yur capabilities, and i know I didnt start learning and growing intelectualy until i was out of school. so yeah. cya