The Real Reason Dave Ramsey is promoted in churches

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Hi everybody,
As many of you know I am into personal finance.Dave Ramsey was my first introduction to personal finance way back in the day. I have since moved on but I still watch stuff from his company. Dave Ramsey's whole schtick is that he provides financial advice for Christians and promotes financial literacy in churches. However the churches that have Dave Ramsey classes have a ulterior motive. Dave Ramsey is so popular with church classes because the leadership in the churches have realized that tithes and offerings will increase if they get their members to increase their financial literacy and become debt free. I first became away of this ulterior motive when I read a church finance book that said teaching your members about Dave Ramsey is a great way to increase the tithes and offerings.

Good insight.

It doesn't surprise me that it's ultimately self-serving.

I used to be a big Dave Ramsey fan, in fact his guidance helped me get out of bad financial mess in my late 20s. However, over the years, I started finding some of his stuff was unworkable or just practical. i.e not worrying about a credit score, never having a credit card, and against financing a car.

Without a credit score, at least here in the USA, that can disqualify you for a lot of things. I use a credit card sparingly, but it makes life easier if you have to return something that doesn't fit right or doesn't work. Buying old cheap cars is not a bargain, it actually costs money having to fix some old clunker then having a reasonable car payment.

TBH, after so long, you get burned out on working tons of overtime to make his plan totally work. In my experience at least.

Then I started reading into his company and some of the weird policy's they have, it sounds like a toxic culture.
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With Churches, this does not shock me in the slightest. IMO Churches are nothing but a money-making scheme.

Not surprising. On the one hand you have prosperity churches that are all about money. But on the other hand, you've got a cultural shift resulting in the decline of church attendance. So if your church attendance drops from a hundred tithe payers down to three broke pensioners, then yes, you'll consider financial strategies.

While we should all try to avoid debt, Dave Ramsey's ideas are indeed unattainable.

It think what the debt is for makes a big difference too.

Going into debt to purchase a home usually makes sense, the property will be worth more than one paid for it over enough time. Going into debt for a business is another example, if you increase how much the business earns the debt will pay for itself.

Going into debt over toys that depreciate in value is a bad idea though. A new TV or a fancy car are usually poor investments, although with cars sometimes something rare at the bottom of it's depreciation curve can be a smart investment (ie: Hondas with a Type R badge, Porsches with an RS badge, Mustangs with a Boss or Shelby badge, etc).

Technically he does not even believe in mortgages its just that he will "allow" his followers to get 15 year mortgages but he prefers everyone to pay for their home 100 percent in cash which is a pipe dream.I think he basically said he will tolerate a 15 year mortgage but thats the only debt he will allow his followers to have.He wont even let his listeners have a 30 year mortgage in his plan.I think some guy on youtube or tiktok said you would need to make 170 grand a year in order to qualify for Dave's mortgage plan for median home price when the median household income is between 60,000 to 80,000 a year.People cant afford mortgages anymore or even rent in many places.I cant even afford rent anywhere myself.I have even heard you need to make 300,000 a year to afford a Dave mortgage.300,000 is way out of reach for vast majority of Americans.

Last edited by Texasmoneyman300 on 12 Jul 2024, 3:50 am, edited 2 times in total.

Well then I would not suggest getting a place in his vicinity, idk sounds kind of culty and you'd probably do best to steer clear of that kind of crap. Not trying to tell you to give up your faith if that is important to you, but some people who claim to have that faith are just tricksters and con-artists so you have to decide what is right for you regardless of what others who claim to have your same faith say. LIke if it does not seem right to you, don't agree to it.

But yeah me and my boyfriend are hoping to be able to afford apartments, and that may be the best we ever get as houses are very, very expensive too much to afford on our income.

Idk think of what jesus would have wanted...and I can guarantee it wasn't church pastors living in mansions that wouldn't even open up their church to hurricane refugees, Jesus would have opened that church up and turned whatever water soaked bread anyone had to fish and fresh bread to feed the poor people who had just had to flee their homes. And he'd have probably thrown that greedy pastor/preist or whatever to the storm for being such an ass.

Dave is all the way in Nashville so he is a long ways from me and besides I would find it very hard to find a church in Nashville.My church does not require its members to give any money to them.Its strictly on a voluntary basis so I dont donate or tithe anything.

Dave Ramsey applies to a niche of people. Middle class to upper middle class people who waste money on bad purchases. For those people, just the basics of spending less, saving, etc. works.

But once you have the financial basics down, there's not much else Ramsey can do for you.

And if you're legitimately poor/working-class and have little disposible income, and you're already avoiding bad purchases, Ramsey's advice doesn't apply.

It seems like his advice is pretty unrealistic for most people and the people it can benefit might have high enough incomes that any amount of discipline would lead to becoming wealthier, meaning no degree of expertise is needed to advise them.

Ya a big reason why I have been turned down for credit cards is because I was so against credit cards and credit scores when I was in college back in the day because I was too afraid of being in so much credit card debt.I think you do have a point with some makes of cars but I think buying a toyota corolla with 100,000 to 300,000 miles could suffice for a beater until you can afford a little bit of a nicer car and pay for it in cash but hey thats just me.

Thanks Ya I paid 130 dollars a few years ago for a Dave Ramsey class at church and it was such a scam.I had already learned his plan on the radio all those years ago but I just wanted fellowship and edification.

Well that may sound good but I dont even agree that everyone should avoid debt.There is a big difference between good debt and bad debt and Dave Ramsey mistakenly believes all debt is bad debt.

Good points.I think Dave Ramsey is a good example of "do what I say, not as I do" because he is not really into small business ownership and self-employment for his audience as much as some other people are.Dave Ramsey is more for people who more or less want to just live the 1950's American Dream and works for other people.I just watch him for enterainment not really very good ideas now.

Ya I would agree with that for most part but I think going into debt for "toys" like cars and stuff with engines can be a good thing if you can make more money via arbitraging the borrowed dollars and making a higher rate at the stock market for example having a 1 percent car note and investing in the market and making 7 to 10 percent.