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Awesomelyglorious
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07 Aug 2012, 6:41 am

JakobVirgil wrote:
edgewaters wrote:

The LTV - which actually has its origins with Adam Smith, not Marx - states that labour is the source of all value, including capital. The cash being exchanged as wages, was expropriated, as was the capital the worker is using (from other workers who made that capital).


Making Marx a more Conservative economist and heir to Smith than say Mises or Friedman. crazy world.

Marx isn't a more conservative economist. He's just closer to classical economics in some of his assumptions, but he's a radical economist by most metrics. I mean, Marxism isn't just classical economics plus left-wing ideology, but rather it is more of it's own sub-branch, something Friedman really does not have. Even Mises didn't go so far in his context. (And both Mises and Friedman lived in a context where the LTV was often considered debunked, making the conservative point odd, because then we'd have to say that the closest historical heir will be the more conservative figure)



Declension
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07 Aug 2012, 6:59 am

There are billions of functioning communist communities all over the planet right now. They're called families.

The question is a matter of scale.



TallyMan
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07 Aug 2012, 7:10 am

Declension wrote:
There are billions of functioning communist communities all over the planet right now. They're called families.

The question is a matter of scale.


Extended families less so; the local community / tribe even less so and beyond that negligibly so. The further from the atomic family the more dysfunctional and corrupt communism becomes.



ruveyn
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07 Aug 2012, 8:21 am

TallyMan wrote:
Declension wrote:
There are billions of functioning communist communities all over the planet right now. They're called families.

The question is a matter of scale.


Extended families less so; the local community / tribe even less so and beyond that negligibly so. The further from the atomic family the more dysfunctional and corrupt communism becomes.


Blood is thicker than ideology.

ruveyn



JakobVirgil
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07 Aug 2012, 8:37 am

Awesomelyglorious wrote:
JakobVirgil wrote:
edgewaters wrote:

The LTV - which actually has its origins with Adam Smith, not Marx - states that labour is the source of all value, including capital. The cash being exchanged as wages, was expropriated, as was the capital the worker is using (from other workers who made that capital).


Making Marx a more Conservative economist and heir to Smith than say Mises or Friedman. crazy world.

Marx isn't a more conservative economist. He's just closer to classical economics in some of his assumptions, but he's a radical economist by most metrics. I mean, Marxism isn't just classical economics plus left-wing ideology, but rather it is more of it's own sub-branch, something Friedman really does not have. Even Mises didn't go so far in his context. (And both Mises and Friedman lived in a context where the LTV was often considered debunked, making the conservative point odd, because then we'd have to say that the closest historical heir will be the more conservative figure)


I think LTV was "Debunked" not because it was "wrong" but because it made Marx "right".

I put the truth value words in quotes because economics like all social "sciences" does not have the rigor to produce anything better than conjecture especially dear old Mises with his just so stories.

The idea is that if LTV holds than Marx is right so lets destroy LTV.
In the context of the cold war.


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edgewaters
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07 Aug 2012, 8:44 am

JakobVirgil wrote:
I think LTV was "Debunked" not because it was "wrong" but because it made Marx "right".


No, the problem with LTV is that it doesn't account for scarcity, while marginal value does.



JakobVirgil
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07 Aug 2012, 8:54 am

edgewaters wrote:
JakobVirgil wrote:
I think LTV was "Debunked" not because it was "wrong" but because it made Marx "right".


No, the problem with LTV is that it doesn't account for scarcity, while marginal value does.


The context of its creation is a little too perfect.
Although Supply and demand can be made to fit into a Marxist context.
One could argue that the marginal profit also "belongs" to the worker.


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?We must not look at goblin men,
We must not buy their fruits:
Who knows upon what soil they fed
Their hungry thirsty roots??

http://jakobvirgil.blogspot.com/