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Gay athletes cannot have a shower?

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appletheclown
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04 Apr 2014, 12:41 pm

Fogman wrote:
All this is, is Rush Limbaugh doing what he does best. --Being a demagogue.

Under his idea, what would be the recourse if one of the guys in the 'gay shower' was being sexually harassed by another? --None at all, because with gay people such behavior is to be expected.


Under this idea, what would be the recourse if one of the women in the co-ed shower was being sexually harassed by a man? --None at all, because with straight people such
behavior is to be expected.


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Robdemanc
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04 Apr 2014, 12:47 pm

Ann2011 wrote:
But aren't you pushing nudism on others?


I am not pushing nudism on people. All I am saying is that not everyone has an issue with nudism. Not all male athletes are going to be concerned that one of their team mates is gay and they share the showers. For those who are then they have the problem, not the gay athlete.



appletheclown
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04 Apr 2014, 12:51 pm

Robdemanc wrote:
Not all male athletes are going to be concerned that one of their team mates is gay and they share the showers. For those who are then they have the problem, not the gay athlete.


Not all female athletes are going to be concerned that one of the guys are straight and they share the showers. For the women who are then they have the problem, not the straight guy.


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jrjones9933
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04 Apr 2014, 12:52 pm

appletheclown wrote:
Fogman wrote:
All this is, is Rush Limbaugh doing what he does best. --Being a demagogue.

Under his idea, what would be the recourse if one of the guys in the 'gay shower' was being sexually harassed by another? --None at all, because with gay people such behavior is to be expected.


Under this idea, what would be the recourse if one of the women in the co-ed shower was being sexually harassed by a man? --None at all, because with straight people such
behavior is to be expected.

No.



appletheclown
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04 Apr 2014, 12:56 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
appletheclown wrote:
Fogman wrote:
All this is, is Rush Limbaugh doing what he does best. --Being a demagogue.

Under his idea, what would be the recourse if one of the guys in the 'gay shower' was being sexually harassed by another? --None at all, because with gay people such behavior is to be expected.


Under this idea, what would be the recourse if one of the women in the co-ed shower was being sexually harassed by a man? --None at all, because with straight people such
behavior is to be expected.

No.

Yes.

Why not?


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jrjones9933
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04 Apr 2014, 12:58 pm

No one should expect harassment. To call it expected makes it too close to accepted.



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04 Apr 2014, 12:59 pm

appletheclown wrote:
Robdemanc wrote:
Not all male athletes are going to be concerned that one of their team mates is gay and they share the showers. For those who are then they have the problem, not the gay athlete.


Not all female athletes are going to be concerned that one of the guys are straight and they share the showers. For the women who are then they have the problem, not the straight guy.

Athletes seem to have a familiarity with their bodies and level of comfort that seems to transcend to comfort with others' bodies.
Maybe the problem isn't gender specific though, so then it's a question of which is the priority - the people who are uncomfortable or those that are comfortable. Probably practicality will prevail, but I won't be going into one freely.


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appletheclown
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04 Apr 2014, 1:10 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
No one should expect harassment. To call it expected makes it too close to accepted.


No one, your absolutely right!

That is why I don't want to be ogled by some guy. I actually have no problem with it right now, but only cubicles work for me. I don't even shower with straight dudes.


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visagrunt
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04 Apr 2014, 2:22 pm

What's the difference between another person seeing you naked, and another person who might (or might not) be sexually attracted to you seeing you naked?

The fact of the matter is that all men who have shared locker rooms and showers have been seen by gay men sharing the facilities with them. And they came to no harm.


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appletheclown
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04 Apr 2014, 2:24 pm

visagrunt wrote:
What's the difference between another person seeing you naked, and another person who might (or might not) be sexually attracted to you seeing you naked?

The fact of the matter is that all men who have shared locker rooms and showers have been seen by gay men sharing the facilities with them. And they came to no harm.


The same reason why women don't want to shower nude in front of men.


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jrjones9933
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04 Apr 2014, 2:29 pm

So, we agree to consider ogling and harassment unacceptable, but we have different solutions.

You want to divide people up, inconveniencing the innocent. I want to shame the guilty into ceasing their unacceptable behavior, inconveniencing the guilty.



appletheclown
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04 Apr 2014, 2:32 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
So, we agree to consider ogling and harassment unacceptable, but we have different solutions.

You want to divide people up, inconveniencing the innocent. I want to shame the guilty into ceasing their unacceptable behavior, inconveniencing the guilty.


How are you shaming the guilty?

Dividing people up into cubicles actually stops the issue.


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jrjones9933
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04 Apr 2014, 2:38 pm

It removes one opportunity for sexual rudeness, and does nothing to stop the issue.

You actually want me to explain how shaming people works? For crying out loud, just look at any behavior that people once considered acceptable but now consider unacceptable.



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04 Apr 2014, 2:44 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
It removes one opportunity for sexual rudeness, and does nothing to stop the issue.

You actually want me to explain how shaming people works? For crying out loud, just look at any behavior that people once considered acceptable but now consider unacceptable.


No, how was your idea would shame them at all? What were you going to do?
Cubicles is all we need.


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04 Apr 2014, 2:44 pm

jrjones9933 wrote:
So, we agree to consider ogling and harassment unacceptable, but we have different solutions.

You want to divide people up, inconveniencing the innocent. I want to shame the guilty into ceasing their unacceptable behavior, inconveniencing the guilty.


Who is guilty in this discussion though? No one has done anything. The OP is talking about gay athletes in the male showers. It doesn't say anyone is guilty of anything. No one has committed "unacceptable behavior".



appletheclown
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04 Apr 2014, 2:47 pm

Robdemanc wrote:
jrjones9933 wrote:
So, we agree to consider ogling and harassment unacceptable, but we have different solutions.

You want to divide people up, inconveniencing the innocent. I want to shame the guilty into ceasing their unacceptable behavior, inconveniencing the guilty.


Who is guilty in this discussion though? No one has done anything. The OP is talking about gay athletes in the male showers. It doesn't say anyone is guilty of anything. No one has committed "unacceptable behavior".


This^

I thought we were only talking about the ogling.


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