07 May 2014, 11:23 pm
mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
The American left will never understand the simple concepts of peace through strength or weakness invites attack.
Thier idea of peace is through disarmament (one sided disarmament, that is) and anti-bullying legislation.
Thier idea of peace is through disarmament (one sided disarmament, that is) and anti-bullying legislation.
I'm not a part of the American left, I'm a part of the Canadian left.
lololol...Whatev........
Quote:
I don't agree with disarming civilians who have proven that they can competently handle firearms however.
1. Mass disarmament would soon turn into literally a bloody mess for the disarmers and the disarmees.
2. Having to prove competence is too far into infringement. Before we go there, it's not like driving a car which is a licensed privilege and not a right.
Quote:
In fact, I would argue that there should be a Canadian equivalent to the Second Amendment, except that our firearms laws do a pretty good job of keeping guns out of the hands of idiots, while not making life too hard on people who can handle guns responsibly.
If an idiot in Canada wants a gun he can get one. You have a black market and illegal gun trade just like other countries.
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/ci-rc/reports-rapports/traf/index-eng.htm#c
Quote:
That said, if the laws could be tweaked a bit so that someone could own an AK as a "range toy", then it would be better.
Don't hold your breath for the AK. An AR-15 is designated as a restricted firearm but still obtainable.
Quote:
Yeah, describing myself as a left-winger is a bit... odd. I have a bit more in common with the left than the right, but I'm not a granola-munching "save the whales" hippie either. I just believe in things that make sense. I have issues with some leftist values, I have issues with some conservative values, and I even have issues with some moderate values. You can't really put me on the conventional political spectrum.
The only online political test I felt was definitive enough showed me as being 66% or 68% conservative so that's how I identify myself. With all the liberals on WP I lean more heavily (obnoxiously) conservative.
I never said I was in favor of mass disarmament, if anything I said I was against it. Now, one of the main differences between the US and Canada is that armament is not a constitutional right here, and you know what, considering that we don't live in a perfect world where everybody who can pick up a gun is automatically competent with handling one, I'm fine with that. Cars can be dangerous in the wrong hands, and so can guns, so I think it's perfectly sensible that a person should have to prove their competency before they drive or own a gun.
AR-15s are restricted, but not outright prohibited. AK-47s and their many many variants on the other hand, are all prohibited, even ones that aren't made to go full-auto. I think it's kind of stupid that AR-15 variants are OK, but AK-47 variants aren't. I think it can be chalked up to Cold War-era thinking, like "oh, these are the guns the good guys use (the AR-15 variants), and these are the guns those filthy commies use (the AK-47 variants)." They are both capable of the same sorts of things, but one just looks "scarier" than the other.
One point I will make, I am not in favor of the US changing its firearms laws. Why? It's too late to. If they tried to change their laws over to something more like what we have, then they'd have a bunch of pissed off people toting machine guns to deal with.
That would cause a major shitstorm.well you can get a CZ58 which is a better design then an ak and uses the same round. You can also have short guns without having to jump thru hoops and then ask permission to move it. Cause a 16" barrel is ok but a 15..5" barrel is evil!! !
08 May 2014, 3:45 am
mr_bigmouth_502
Veteran
Joined: 12 Dec 2013
Age: 30
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 7,028
Location: Alberta, Canada
08 May 2014, 3:59 am
sly279 wrote:
mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
The American left will never understand the simple concepts of peace through strength or weakness invites attack.
Thier idea of peace is through disarmament (one sided disarmament, that is) and anti-bullying legislation.
Thier idea of peace is through disarmament (one sided disarmament, that is) and anti-bullying legislation.
I'm not a part of the American left, I'm a part of the Canadian left.
lololol...Whatev........
Quote:
I don't agree with disarming civilians who have proven that they can competently handle firearms however.
1. Mass disarmament would soon turn into literally a bloody mess for the disarmers and the disarmees.
2. Having to prove competence is too far into infringement. Before we go there, it's not like driving a car which is a licensed privilege and not a right.
Quote:
In fact, I would argue that there should be a Canadian equivalent to the Second Amendment, except that our firearms laws do a pretty good job of keeping guns out of the hands of idiots, while not making life too hard on people who can handle guns responsibly.
If an idiot in Canada wants a gun he can get one. You have a black market and illegal gun trade just like other countries.
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/ci-rc/reports-rapports/traf/index-eng.htm#c
Quote:
That said, if the laws could be tweaked a bit so that someone could own an AK as a "range toy", then it would be better.
Don't hold your breath for the AK. An AR-15 is designated as a restricted firearm but still obtainable.
Quote:
Yeah, describing myself as a left-winger is a bit... odd. I have a bit more in common with the left than the right, but I'm not a granola-munching "save the whales" hippie either. I just believe in things that make sense. I have issues with some leftist values, I have issues with some conservative values, and I even have issues with some moderate values. You can't really put me on the conventional political spectrum.
The only online political test I felt was definitive enough showed me as being 66% or 68% conservative so that's how I identify myself. With all the liberals on WP I lean more heavily (obnoxiously) conservative.
I never said I was in favor of mass disarmament, if anything I said I was against it. Now, one of the main differences between the US and Canada is that armament is not a constitutional right here, and you know what, considering that we don't live in a perfect world where everybody who can pick up a gun is automatically competent with handling one, I'm fine with that. Cars can be dangerous in the wrong hands, and so can guns, so I think it's perfectly sensible that a person should have to prove their competency before they drive or own a gun.
AR-15s are restricted, but not outright prohibited. AK-47s and their many many variants on the other hand, are all prohibited, even ones that aren't made to go full-auto. I think it's kind of stupid that AR-15 variants are OK, but AK-47 variants aren't. I think it can be chalked up to Cold War-era thinking, like "oh, these are the guns the good guys use (the AR-15 variants), and these are the guns those filthy commies use (the AK-47 variants)." They are both capable of the same sorts of things, but one just looks "scarier" than the other.
One point I will make, I am not in favor of the US changing its firearms laws. Why? It's too late to. If they tried to change their laws over to something more like what we have, then they'd have a bunch of pissed off people toting machine guns to deal with.
That would cause a major shitstorm.well you can get a CZ58 which is a better design then an ak and uses the same round. You can also have short guns without having to jump thru hoops and then ask permission to move it. Cause a 16" barrel is ok but a 15..5" barrel is evil!! !
Just looked up the CZ58. Apparently they're quite popular here. There's a bit of a dispute brewing over the VZ58 "pistol" variant, as it takes the same magazines as the CZ58, and if it ends up actually being classified as a pistol, then it'll create a loophole where the CZ58 will be allowed to take 10 round magazines, as pistols are allowed to have them, but rifles normally aren't. http://globalnews.ca/news/1105841/rcmp- ... -loophole/
08 May 2014, 11:12 am
mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:
sly279 wrote:
mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:
Raptor wrote:
The American left will never understand the simple concepts of peace through strength or weakness invites attack.
Thier idea of peace is through disarmament (one sided disarmament, that is) and anti-bullying legislation.
Thier idea of peace is through disarmament (one sided disarmament, that is) and anti-bullying legislation.
I'm not a part of the American left, I'm a part of the Canadian left.
lololol...Whatev........
Quote:
I don't agree with disarming civilians who have proven that they can competently handle firearms however.
1. Mass disarmament would soon turn into literally a bloody mess for the disarmers and the disarmees.
2. Having to prove competence is too far into infringement. Before we go there, it's not like driving a car which is a licensed privilege and not a right.
Quote:
In fact, I would argue that there should be a Canadian equivalent to the Second Amendment, except that our firearms laws do a pretty good job of keeping guns out of the hands of idiots, while not making life too hard on people who can handle guns responsibly.
If an idiot in Canada wants a gun he can get one. You have a black market and illegal gun trade just like other countries.
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/ci-rc/reports-rapports/traf/index-eng.htm#c
Quote:
That said, if the laws could be tweaked a bit so that someone could own an AK as a "range toy", then it would be better.
Don't hold your breath for the AK. An AR-15 is designated as a restricted firearm but still obtainable.
Quote:
Yeah, describing myself as a left-winger is a bit... odd. I have a bit more in common with the left than the right, but I'm not a granola-munching "save the whales" hippie either. I just believe in things that make sense. I have issues with some leftist values, I have issues with some conservative values, and I even have issues with some moderate values. You can't really put me on the conventional political spectrum.
The only online political test I felt was definitive enough showed me as being 66% or 68% conservative so that's how I identify myself. With all the liberals on WP I lean more heavily (obnoxiously) conservative.
I never said I was in favor of mass disarmament, if anything I said I was against it. Now, one of the main differences between the US and Canada is that armament is not a constitutional right here, and you know what, considering that we don't live in a perfect world where everybody who can pick up a gun is automatically competent with handling one, I'm fine with that. Cars can be dangerous in the wrong hands, and so can guns, so I think it's perfectly sensible that a person should have to prove their competency before they drive or own a gun.
AR-15s are restricted, but not outright prohibited. AK-47s and their many many variants on the other hand, are all prohibited, even ones that aren't made to go full-auto. I think it's kind of stupid that AR-15 variants are OK, but AK-47 variants aren't. I think it can be chalked up to Cold War-era thinking, like "oh, these are the guns the good guys use (the AR-15 variants), and these are the guns those filthy commies use (the AK-47 variants)." They are both capable of the same sorts of things, but one just looks "scarier" than the other.
One point I will make, I am not in favor of the US changing its firearms laws. Why? It's too late to. If they tried to change their laws over to something more like what we have, then they'd have a bunch of pissed off people toting machine guns to deal with.
That would cause a major shitstorm.well you can get a CZ58 which is a better design then an ak and uses the same round. You can also have short guns without having to jump thru hoops and then ask permission to move it. Cause a 16" barrel is ok but a 15..5" barrel is evil!! !
Just looked up the CZ58. Apparently they're quite popular here. There's a bit of a dispute brewing over the VZ58 "pistol" variant, as it takes the same magazines as the CZ58, and if it ends up actually being classified as a pistol, then it'll create a loophole where the CZ58 will be allowed to take 10 round magazines, as pistols are allowed to have them, but rifles normally aren't. http://globalnews.ca/news/1105841/rcmp- ... -loophole/
The VZ-58 is a new-and-improved version of the AK-47. But I'd like to see how the VZ-58 compares to the AK-74. But to my knowledge, civilian possession of automatic firearms is illegal in Canada without exception. And furthermore, legally possessing automatic weapons here in the USofA isn't as easy as you think! You nead a Class III firearms license. And the ATF will only issue those to gun dealers with a Federal Firearms License and not to individual collectors. That doesn't stop you from getting them on the black market.
As for me, if I were going to get an automatic weapon I'd go for something German. Like an MG-3 or a G4 rifle. Or even an MP-44(the ORIGINAL assault rifle
). Germans make the best small arms in the world.
mr_bigmouth_502
Veteran
Joined: 12 Dec 2013
Age: 30
Gender: Non-binary
Posts: 7,028
Location: Alberta, Canada
08 May 2014, 2:20 pm
10 May 2014, 6:21 pm
Don_Pedro_Zamacona wrote:
The VZ-58 is a new-and-improved version of the AK-47. But I'd like to see how the VZ-58 compares to the AK-74. But to my knowledge, civilian possession of automatic firearms is illegal in Canada without exception. And furthermore, legally possessing automatic weapons here in the USofA isn't as easy as you think! You nead a Class III firearms license. And the ATF will only issue those to gun dealers with a Federal Firearms License and not to individual collectors. That doesn't stop you from getting them on the black market.
As for me, if I were going to get an automatic weapon I'd go for something German. Like an MG-3 or a G4 rifle. Or even an MP-44(the ORIGINAL assault rifle ). Germans make the best small arms in the world.
As for me, if I were going to get an automatic weapon I'd go for something German. Like an MG-3 or a G4 rifle. Or even an MP-44(the ORIGINAL assault rifle
). Germans make the best small arms in the world.while the Vz 58 looks similar to the ak, it is not a ak. It was designed independently by the Checs. It's design is better then the ak in many ways. Had it not been for the soviet union the rifle would have used a different round. The VZ is lighter, milled receiver, short stroke piston compared to the heavier stamped receiver with long stroke piston ak. It also has better selector switch and a bolt hold open on last round. Some report that its hand guard gets hot but inhaling a heat shield solves that. also the vz is striker fired while the ak is hammer fired. The vz is more similar to the sks then ak.
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