Is there any proof God exists?
Anyhow, the best (most precise and succinct) definition of time that I know of is "time is the rate of succession of events". No events and no succession thereof = no time. It's an enchantingly beautiful definition if you think about it.
I don't suppose you have proof there is concensus among scientists that the BB theory is nonsense?
And time is not just for timekeeping, time is part of spacetime and is actually something "physical" as it can be altered by high gravity or high speeds.
AngelRho
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Cannot be eternal? I'm not so sure. I haven't made my mind up on this one: If God is immutable in every sense, how could God be the Creator before the act of creation?
I can't think of a good solution to that one. It would appear that God changed with the act of creation. The only solution I can think of in which God would remain immutable and still be a Creator before/after the act of creation might be in God's eternal nature. One way of explaining God as eternal is by postulating that God exists at all points of time simultaneously. God knows the future because He's already in the future. From God's perspective, all events have already happened and are as static as written words on a page. C.S. Lewis made the analogy that if all events of the universe are represented by a line drawn on a page, God is the paper the line is drawn on. Therefore, God was already the Creator before the actual act of creation.
Probably not a very sophisticated solution, maybe not even remotely the best one, but it's better than anything else I can come up with.
heh…
Now how about how many angels can fit on the head of a pin?
Canadian1911
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I'm tired of this merry-go-round of nonsense.
Look here if you dare.
http://www.catholicapologetics.info/lib ... orrupt.htm
Last time I got a count there were 135 of these inexplicable preservations recorded... some of which were chopped up for souvenirs for various dignitaries.
And if you are exceptionally brave;
http://www.miraclehunter.com/marian_app ... cles1.html
I'm not presenting this as "proof" of anything but the arrogance and ignorance of the perverse. In about the last 200 years no "miracle" has been accepted as such unless it has been acknowledged by secular authorities as "inexplicable" according to the best science available.
Compare that scrupulousness to the credulity of Materialists who blithely accept fairy tales of "Singularities", Black Holes, Worm Holes, Multiverses and so on... none of which can be justified or verified by observation or experiment.
The incorruptile saints are examples of embalming and microclimates. Lenin is similarly preserved although not at all saintly.
AngelRho
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Meh…you can keep the porn. Personally, I find the real deal to be much, much better.
Tea, on the other hand…that sounds good right now. I just drank the last of the day's pot of coffee and am not in the mood to brew more. I *think* I still have some green tea somewhere. Not really what I'm in the mood for, but it will do. I'd prefer a jasmine/darjeeling blend. I'll just have to take what I can get.
Can't think about groceries right now…I'm fasting for 3 more hours. Will likely skip a full dinner and just have a bowl of popcorn.
Canadian1911
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Meh…you can keep the porn. Personally, I find the real deal to be much, much better.
Tea, on the other hand…that sounds good right now. I just drank the last of the day's pot of coffee and am not in the mood to brew more. I *think* I still have some green tea somewhere. Not really what I'm in the mood for, but it will do. I'd prefer a jasmine/darjeeling blend. I'll just have to take what I can get.
Can't think about groceries right now…I'm fasting for 3 more hours. Will likely skip a full dinner and just have a bowl of popcorn.
I'm enjoying my cup of tea right now. I gotta go low income grocery shopping in a bit. Noodles, KD, pop.
AngelRho
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Ugh…don't miss the low-income shopping at all. We just buy the most-used stuff in bulk. We stock up on 100 lb. of rice and 100 lb. of bread flour at a time, peanut butter by the gallon, canola oil, and instant oats. I can stretch 6 cups of flour per week into 16 rolls for the kids' lunch boxes and two pizzas every Friday night, plus Asian-style steamed rice in the pressure cooker in less than 10 minutes. Paycheck-to-paycheck grocery shopping is really only for one meal a day+weekends, and I don't eat for 24 hours beginning Friday night. It's unreal how far a family of 5 can go on a combined income of less than $30k and no welfare.
I'd like to set aside a lot more money and massively stockpile frozen veggies and only hit the grocery for meat, fresh apples and bananas. Being broke I can handle. Being broke and starving is the scary part. One of the benefits of fasting no less than once a week is you don't take it for granted.
Any - any - act of creation presupposes the existence of causality, so to say that 'the Big Bang created spacetime' is to acknowledge the existence of causality on a level that transcends spacetime.
'Trollcatman', you don't sound very confident here. I had always been given the very strong impression that extreme atheists (like Dan Dennett, Susan Blackmore) believed that, regardless of the probabilistic basis of Q.M., nature was, at bottom, purely deterministic. Now you are trying to say it might not be. So which is it?
If nature is not strictly deterministic, then free will exists. Free will is an issue that makes most, though certainly not all, atheists uncomfortable.
Admitting defeat? That's understandable
I'm sure the "Big Daddy in the Sky" would approve, wholeheartedly!
I'm sure he's laughing up there!
A 'big daddy' who also happens to be a strawman. Why do committed atheists always insist that the big sky daddy is what ALL theists believe in? I guess they do this because they can't argue against the more sophisticated philosophical claims made by those who point out the logical necessities that naturally follow given the existence of the reality we know. It's just too much of a challenge for them.
Did you seriously just post this on an autistic spectrum forum? Go ahead and report me to the mods, but I'm wondering if you're an NT and/or a troll. It's one thing to debate ideas and hold the views of others as ridiculous. It's entirely something else to attack someone outright with that level of insensitivity.
People, let's play nicely please.
Yes, we don't want this thread closed down by the moderators!
Pope John XXIII (also not at all saintly) is preserved with world best preservation tactics and "triple sealed" in an inert atmosphere but still inexorably deteriorating.
AngelRho
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Admitting defeat? That's understandable
Eh…don't be too hard on him. This stuff will take over your life if you don't watch it. I'm only in here frequently at the moment because this project I'm working on is trying my patience.
AngelRho
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Did you seriously just post this on an autistic spectrum forum? Go ahead and report me to the mods, but I'm wondering if you're an NT and/or a troll. It's one thing to debate ideas and hold the views of others as ridiculous. It's entirely something else to attack someone outright with that level of insensitivity.
People, let's play nicely please.
Yes, we don't want this thread closed down by the moderators!
90 pages on this topic in PPR has got to be some kind of record.
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