jesus is saviour

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Dussel
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11 Feb 2009, 10:31 pm

JoJerome wrote:

In other words, the translation I'm reading and the translation you're reading ... contradict each other.

And unless we are to have this discussion in Greek, neither of us is reading the original, and presumably 'correct' translation.

Even the original old Greek text is not Certain. There are 1000s of variants within the text. The so-called King James Bible is based on the first Greek text edition of Erasmus of Rotterdam of the early 16th century which has been proven as one of the less reliable ones (which was not personal fault of Erasmus of Rotterdam, he just did not had better sources for his work).

BellaDonna
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11 Feb 2009, 10:31 pm

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Jesus saving me because he died on the cross for ME.

How a man under reign of Tiberius could know anything about you (or me)? And so how he could die for you or me?

because it say's it in the bible and if you want to know any more answers - Why don't you read it? :rambo:

Dussel
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11 Feb 2009, 11:21 pm

BellaDonna wrote:

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Jesus saving me because he died on the cross for ME.

How a man under reign of Tiberius could know anything about you (or me)? And so how he could die for you or me?

because it say's it in the bible

Be be stated in a nearly 2000 year old collection of books, of dubious origin, is hardly an argument of any creditability.

BellaDonna wrote:

Why don't you read it?

I read it and I did not found anything which stays any critical investigation. Causa Finita.

BellaDonna
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11 Feb 2009, 11:23 pm

Why have some of the most expertised scientist become christian then?

Dussel
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11 Feb 2009, 11:28 pm

BellaDonna wrote:

Why have some of the most expertised scientist become christian then?

"Become"? Some stayed on sentimental reason in the faith they were grown, but no one converted to Christianity. Within the scientific community you find that the vast majority consist of atheist or agnostics.

BellaDonna
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11 Feb 2009, 11:44 pm

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Why have some of the most expertised scientist become christian then?

but the best of them. The most experienced scientist changed thier faith to Christianity.

Dussel
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11 Feb 2009, 11:48 pm

BellaDonna wrote:

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Why have some of the most expertised scientist become christian then?

but the best of them. The most experienced scientist changed thier faith to Christianity.

Who?

BellaDonna
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11 Feb 2009, 11:49 pm

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Why have some of the most expertised scientist become christian then?

but the best of them. The most experienced scientist changed thier faith to Christianity.

Who?

I don't have time to research the info now but you could, in your time.

Sand
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11 Feb 2009, 11:49 pm

BellaDonna wrote:

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Why have some of the most expertised scientist become christian then?

but the best of them. The most experienced scientist changed thier faith to Christianity.

According to your standards, of course.

Dussel
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11 Feb 2009, 11:51 pm

BellaDonna wrote:

but the best of them. The most experienced scientist changed thier faith to Christianity.

Who?[/quote]

I don't have time to research the info now but you could, in your time.[/quote]

In my humbleness I do not ask for a long list, just a few names.

BellaDonna
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11 Feb 2009, 11:53 pm

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

but the best of them. The most experienced scientist changed thier faith to Christianity.

Who?

I don't have time to research the info now but you could, in your time.[/quote]

In my humbleness I do not ask for a long list, just a few names.[/quote]

Okay but my memory isnt that good. I will get back to you.

slowmutant
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12 Feb 2009, 8:00 am

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Jesus saving me because he died on the cross for ME.

How a man under reign of Tiberius could know anything about you (or me)? And so how he could die for you or me?

Jesus died for the entire human race, past-present-future. Not just for the people alive in his time or in that part of the world.

Sand
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12 Feb 2009, 9:16 am

slowmutant wrote:

Dussel wrote:

BellaDonna wrote:

Jesus saving me because he died on the cross for ME.

How a man under reign of Tiberius could know anything about you (or me)? And so how he could die for you or me?

Jesus died for the entire human race, past-present-future. Not just for the people alive in his time or in that part of the world.

People can live for a cause but dying for a cause, unless you supply body parts for it, simply doesn't happen. When you die, you fail, period.

General Patton put it a bit more directly

No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country.
George S. Patton

Using Patton's conception in the case of Christ, just exactly who was demanding Christ's death to repair mankind's sinfulness and why was it necessary for that forgiveness. Of course, the Romans did the deed but obviously it was arranged by someone higher up. Who was that?

slowmutant
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12 Feb 2009, 10:01 am

First of all, I don't think you can compare General Patton to Jesus Christ. There is no basis for comparison.

Quote:

When you die, you fail, period.

Not in this case. In this case, Die =/= Fail.

benjimanbreeg
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12 Feb 2009, 10:26 am

It wouldn't make any difference if Jesus had "died for our sins, or not" Doesn't make any sense to me. I find it hard to see how people can be religious in this day and age. Unless god wrote the bible himself, how do you know that the things in their are the right things to follow? In my view, its just full of tales. The stuff in there is looking more and more ridiculous as time goes by. I think religion was created cause as a species. People thought we need direction. Which is probably true actually lol. But religions have spiralled out of control now.

_________________
I'm now midwifeaspie's piece of meat.

slowmutant
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12 Feb 2009, 10:37 am

Quote:

Of course, the Romans did the deed but obviously it was arranged by someone higher up. Who was that?

There was no one higher-up than the Romans at that time and place. Who arranged the death of Jesus? Not the Mexicans.

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