Perfect/Absolute Pitch

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SplendidSnail
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28 Sep 2017, 7:58 pm

SabbraCadabra wrote:

Yeah, so it would be more of a "relative pitch".

I'd still call it some level of absolute pitch unless you're using something else as a reference.

Relative pitch is all about ability to reliably produce a note that is a particular distance from another note.

Perfect/absolute pitch is all about being able to identify or sing a note without having anything to compare it with. If you're correctly singing the exact notes of a song you know well (exact notes, not just in relation to each other) having not recently heard any other notes to compare them with, I would call that some level of perfect/absolute pitch.

And if you're just memorizing what it feels like to be at the top of your register? I would argue that might not be either relative or perfect pitch. But I'd be surprised if there's anyone who can accurately do this without either something to compare with or some level of perfect pitch because what the top of your register is will vary a little bit from day to day.

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SplendidSnail
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28 Sep 2017, 8:16 pm

Leeds_Demon wrote:

What if you can hear a note & sing it, but aren't musical - that is to say, you can't read/write music, or play a musical instrument?

When I was auditioning for my school choir, many years' ago, I was told I had a good singing voice. But if you were to ask me to name the notes on a piano, I'd look at you as if you asked me to translate some Serb-Croat - a blank stare.

If you're hearing a note and singing it, that indicates you have some level of music talent (I definitely know of people who can't do this), but it has nothing to do with perfect/absolute pitch, or relative pitch either for that matter.

Perfect/absolute pitch is your ability to identify or sing a specific note without having anything to compare it with (eg. without warning, I suddenly ask you to sing a middle C).

Most people think perfect pitch cannot be taught and is something you either are born with it or without it, although there are some people who think it can be taught at a very young age (3-5 years old). There is general agreement that it cannot be taught at an older age, although I have also seen some articles suggesting that those on the spectrum might be able to be taught it at a somewhat older age, and that might be why more people on the spectrum have perfect pitch.

Relative pitch is your ability to identify or sing a note based on a reference note (eg. I play a note, tell you the note I played was middle C, then ask you to sing an E). There is general agreement that relative pitch is something that can be taught and learned, but some people will certainly find it easier than others!

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Edna3362
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28 Sep 2017, 8:50 pm

I might be, yet...
I'm not much of a fan of music. :lol: I can't read notes, I can't play any instruments, and I barely listen to music. I barely knew a thing about it.
However, I can recall it's exact tones, find the differences or if it's off key, mentally replay and alter it.

Whether I have a gift for it or not, I'm not interested enough to pursue it. Maybe not yet, or never.

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SabbraCadabra
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29 Sep 2017, 8:11 am

SplendidSnail wrote:

And if you're just memorizing what it feels like to be at the top of your register? I would argue that might not be either relative or perfect pitch.

Well if I know that my voice starts to crack right at F (just as an example), and I know the song I'm singing has a high F note that I can barely hit, I can find that note and then the rest of the song would be relative to that.

But yeah, I'm trying to say that I don't think that counts =) It's about as "perfect pitch" as knowing where to find a C on a guitar (right above the G!).

Quote:

...what the top of your register is will vary a little bit from day to day.

When I'm having "a good day", it feels like it's always in the same spot. I don't know, I haven't tested it at all, but I've gotten so used to singing in a noisy factory, that I can "feel" the notes (the tightness of my vocal cords) better than I can hear them.

But I suppose, over time, your vocal cords would loosen and that would all change a bit.

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Leeds_Demon
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29 Sep 2017, 2:51 pm

The only notes I know of are EGDF and FACE. I have no idea what Middle C is & as for the demi quavers, I honestly know what they sound like. I'm not tone deaf & I can tell if someone is off-key, but if you showed me a piece of music and asked me to tell you what key it was in, I would stare at you blankly.

The frustrating thing is that I come up with songs quite easily, but because I can't write music, or play a musical instrument, I'm doomed never to write songs. Before you say it, yes I do know that Mark Knopfler can't read or write music. I don't even play by ear.

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29 Sep 2017, 4:35 pm

All depends on what you are playing. I have played a ton of things since I was 13, bass, tenor banjo, Uke, mandolin. I currently make and play 3 and 4 string cigar box guitars and play them with a slide in open G. Anyone can play them, absolutely anyone. They are a totally democratic instrument. I play a ball of my own stuff as well as the traditional delta blues...great fun and dead easy to play

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SabbraCadabra
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30 Sep 2017, 8:19 am

Leeds_Demon wrote:

The frustrating thing is that I come up with songs quite easily, but because I can't write music, or play a musical instrument, I'm doomed never to write songs.

I wouldn't say "never", you can always hum your tunes into a tape recorder

I've done that before with my 3DS; I'd have an idea while falling asleep, and I didn't want to forget it or leave my bed.

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StampySquiddyFan
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30 Sep 2017, 12:26 pm

I don't think I have perfect pitch, but the only thing I have close to it is the ability to hear a song and then play it on an instrument (that I know how to play, of course!). I don't consider this perfect pitch because I still mess up and I cannot do it for some songs. I wasn't born with this trait either, it just came about from playing the violin a lot.

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SplendidSnail
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30 Sep 2017, 1:07 pm

StampySquiddyFan wrote:

No, it probably isn't. But if you can hear a song and then play it on an instrument, it means you have a good ear (and therefore could probably quite easily develop a very good relative pitch). Honestly, relative pitch is probably more important than perfect pitch.

Don't think People with perfect pitch absolutely make mistakes too! The ability to hear a note and know what it is doesn't guarantee that everything is right the first time, or that those notes will be memorised correctly.

If you're doing violin lessons, I'm assuming there is some form of ear training done as part of that? Do you have to identify major thirds, perfect fifths, etc.? If so, try to identify the notes in addition to the interval (eg. Major third, C and E).

Identifying the interval is testing your relative pitch. Identifying the notes is testing your perfect pitch. If you actually do start identifying the exact notes, it will probably impress your teacher a lot!

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Black Spot
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30 Sep 2017, 2:38 pm

Lol. I can hit a note if played, but can't hold a tune. I've always said I could clear a pub in 5 seconds flat if I started to sing. :lol:

Voxish
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30 Sep 2017, 4:03 pm

I can definitely play by ear, no doubt about that. I can improvise too with the framework of something like 12 bar blues, but then I started playing the blues 40 years ago

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Leahcar
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30 Sep 2017, 5:30 pm

I have perfect pitch, and although I've not had proper piano lessons, I can play tunes by ear on the piano with one hand. But because my hand-eye coordination is terrible and I haven't practised that much, I can't play things properly (i.e. with chords), though in my head I'd know which chords to play next and when.
I can attempt to sing notes without reference but I'm not too good at singing, so I'll probably end up singing a note halfway between two semitones!

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livingwithautism
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30 Sep 2017, 6:26 pm

I don't have perfect pitch. I have relative pitch. Relative pitch means you can tell the next pitches relative to the previous pitches. Perfect pitch and relative pitch can both be learned.

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30 Sep 2017, 10:07 pm

Voxish wrote:

I can definitely play by ear, no doubt about that. I can improvise too with the framework of something like 12 bar blues, but then I started playing the blues 40 years ago

Ooo, can you SING, too? I've just been turned-onto another Blues singer: "Saint Paul and the Broken Bones" (well, some call them "soul singers"). If you love "Alabama Shakes" (as *I* do), I think you'd like "Saint Paul".

In response to the OP: If "perfect pitch" means being able to sing "ON-pitch", then I have that----but, I don't think that's what it means.

My entire family can sing really well (one of my sisters and I used to sing on a Gospel radio show)----but, even though I learned to play two instruments, I couldn't tell you which note, was what (I mean, I know where Middle C is [and other notes], on the piano, but I couldn't tell you that that was the note that was played, just by hearing it); but, I can sing a song, and then play the song (play the CD, for instance, as someone suggested - and, I often wake-up with a song in my head), and I will have sung it, correctly----and, I've never made a dog, howl (LOL).

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