aspie rights, aspie wrongs

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Curious in what areas people here think aspies deserve a break or more understanding, and also in what areas you think aspies should be held accountable if our words or actions offend.

An online group I belong to somewhat peripherally includes a woman who has been diagnosed with both Asperger's and ADHD. She used to be extremely vocal in the group, and sometimes made statements about minority groups she does not belong to (people of color, gays/lesbians), thereby offending people in who do identify in those ways. When a man in the group spoke up about it, she used her diagnosis as an excuse, which only made things worse and resulted in a lot of the usual NT policing/snarking behavior.

As another aspie, I get that her statements stem from social clumsiness rather than deliberately trying to hurt or offend anyone. However, I also sympathize with the people who feel bothered by the things she wrote. While I believe we aspies have the right to be ourselves and not conform to NT norms, I think we're still obligated to have some consideration for other people. In a way I feel that she made aspies look bad by using her diagnosis as a shield, but I didn't like that she became a target for the NT's who began using her condition as a means of denigrating her. Since I have never been that active in the group and also since I have mixed feelings, I have continued to keep a low profile as the drama plays out. Still I have been thinking about the issues involved.

I'd be interested to hear the thoughts of others on this--when is an aspie just being an aspie and when is an aspie being an as?

I think we are obliged to conform to the standards of society as much as we possibly can. I can't imagine how it might be impossible for a person to not make racist (et al) comments, and I cannot see how AS would cause someone to not be able to help themselves do that unless they were in the middle of a meltdown. I don't think AS is an excuse for any offensive behavior, although it may be a reason that some engage in offensive actions in public, it's not an excuse. I believe that if you can explain well enough that you have AS, what AS is, etc, you are certainly capable of not spouting offensive comments.

ETA; for myself, the only time I would ever presume to excuse my behavior with AS is if I had a meltdown that I could not avoid.

_________________
I'm giving it another shot. We will see.
My forum is still there and everyone is welcome to come join as well. There is a private women only subforum there if anyone is interested. Also, there is no CAPTCHA.

The link to the forum is http://www.rightplanet.proboards.com

I second what OliveOilMom said. I'll add that I try not to be an a$$, but fail sometimes. And I seem to just let people think I'm "weird" than have a "condition". Less trouble that way (due to their ignorance). If I could have my rathers, I'd rather NT's would embrace the differences in each of us, rather than pointing them out. But alas, that is not to be. So, in order to avoid the most trouble, we must conform to the societal norms. *sigh* (Can we colonize Mars??)

conform ? Surely, you jest. LoL.


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMplb_VQWkk[/youtube]

TheSunAlsoRises

Asperger's may have contributed to her willingness to make those statements publically, but it did not cause her to have the beliefs in the first place. In her case, it is bigoted beliefs that make her an ass. The Asperger's only outed her as one.

If I offend, I either apologize or I defend the statement that offended people (if I think it was something that truly needed to be said). I don't make excuses.

I think an aspie expressing their views on gays or politics such as abortions or about rather the poor should have kids or not or on race or homosexuality, etc has nothing to do with AS. On Babycenter it's very easy to offend people there with your views. People offend each other all the time there and get defensive and mean because they feel attacked. But I don't think people need to apologize for offending others in that area. I sure don't. I am not sorry for what I said but I am sorry they got offended. But no point apologizing for them being offended. So to use AS for this is BS. I also say me not apologizing has nothing to do with AS because I have seen NTs refusing to apologize too for things.



I think an aspie should conform to social norms to make their lives easier. If they refuse to even try or to even learn, I see it as their fault. Heck if someone refused to use their wheelchair to get around or refused to use ramps, I would see it as their fault too or if someone refused to wear glasses or contacts to see, I would think of it as their fault for their vision problems or if a deaf person refused to wear hearing aids I would see it as their fault for their hearing problems. Same as if they refused to learn sign language to communicate, I would see their issues as their fault. If I were to refuse to wear a pad or use tampons or even use a soft cup or a moon cup or whatever, it be my fault I am dripping blood in my clothes and having a bloody mess. So I see AS as the same way.


In fact I always find it insulting when people try and put blame on my condition for my opinions or things I express or how I act. As long as I keep seeing NTs do the same thing, I will keep saying AS has nothing to do with it. I just think some people like to use AS as a scapegoat because it's easier for them to let it go and forgive the person and not judge them for it. But they forget to even think of the times they see normies to it too so what is the different between aspies and NTs doing it? It just frustrates me how you have to have autism to get a free pass but when NTs make the same mistakes, they get no free pass so people are hard on them while they go easy on us. Not fair. Who says NTs can't make the same mistakes as us?

I agree, certain people that commit crimes in the name of hate and malice shouldn't be excused because they are on the spectrum, they give us a bad reputation and bring down the general perception people have of us. Of course, she was aware she was making the comments and her intent behind that seems dishonest and malicious.

A little more background:

The group is composed of people who are involved in progressive causes, but the woman lives in an area which has a reputation for being very conservative. She clumsily tried to tell the group she was more sophisticated and liberal than someone would expect given her zip code, comparing herself to her neighbors by saying they were homophobic but that "I treat gay people just like regular people." She also tried to make a joke using her idea of black slang. It seemed to me it wasn't malice behind her words as much as ignorance. When people told her they were bothered by the way she expressed herself, she had an opportunity to admit to making a mistake, and to show respect for their feelings. She might have felt a bit foolish but she could have also learned something about invisible privileges and the dangers of seeing prejudice only in other people.

Instead, she tried to explain away her words by announcing that she was diagnosed with both ADHD and Asperger's. She said she would talk to her doctor about adjusting her medications, but she took no responsibility for her words. It seemed like she was trying to use her condition as a free pass out of looking at her white and heterosexual privilege. Unfortunately, at that point, some people reacted by making anti-aspie statements. People started posting about how Asperger's people were all irresponsible and rude, drawing parallels between her and other aspies they knew. From my perspective, it seemed like the group was using their NT privilege to punish her. Although I disliked her original statements and felt uncomfortable with her "but I'm an aspie, I can't help it" defense, their way of dealing with the situation also seems wrong.

dp