Albert Einstein

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Well gosh, and then there was:





I don't know "steve", and maybe he hasn't realised that wikipedia, though an admirable idea, is subject to the same input from the control freaks as normal folk (moreso in fact... think about it!) but I know "Sophist" by name and nature from way back, and then,there's that quote:



Did Hans Asperger imagine his name would be transmuted to "aspie"????

If he DID have aspergers, who cares? None of us are him. Does it make us look better? Maybe, I guess, not sure why.

Instead of talking about an Einstein, go out and be one!

I don't see why Albert Einstein has to be either a genius OR an aspie. Why can't he be both? IQ is variable over a lifetime, and just because he was a genius in one particular field as an adult (the field he happened to have focused on obsessively since childhood, which is NOT coincidence) does not mean he was born a genius. In many ways he created his own genius by his perseveration on the subjects that interested him. Everything about him strongly suggests AS or HFA.
Here's a controversial question for you: Is there such a thing as an NT genius at all? It seems throughout history that all those we have judged to be "geniuses" have suffered impairments of some kind... perhaps genius itself is merely a symptom of neurological differences, always comorbid with others?

Last edited by Melantha on 22 Jan 2007, 7:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I suggest you all read Einstein's quotes and make your own conclusions. I think I agree with 90% of them.

Quite!

Examples (from memory):

"The world we live in is a product of how we think. To change the world, we must first change the way we think..."

[Which should be of special interest to those who think the human race will survive without giving up SUVs etc.] and

"Adherence to authority is the greatest stumbling block to scientific advancment"

Which is exactly why us auties can hardly get jobs in science any more; independant thinking and the willingness to challenge orthodoxy is no longer deemed desirable in such circles! Challenging autism orthodoxy is particularly needful if us auties are ever to get recognition as a different minority (mostly non-disordered) and so enjoy the rights most other minorities now have enshrined in law (and I for one am heartily sick of being treated like a piece of s**t, simply because some inferior "socially superior" type has, having misread my body language, concluded that my wishes and opinions can be ignored).

Had Einstein enroled on a site like this, he may well also have observerd: "Those who vehemently deny the truth of something they appear not to believe, probably have a hidden agenda" (think about what motivates such denials).

This, Corvus, is why genuine auties should care: the public at large like to think of Einstein as a cute and cuddly normal genius, and that us auties are just disordered weirdos, but, as Melantha's question begs, a "genius NeuroTyipcal" is an oxymoron. Most of everything which makes "us" homo sapiens came from autistics, but left unchallenged, the current establishment campaign to define us as just "normal people" with disfunctions (as opposed to a personality type which excels at scientific reasoning) will lead to the human race being deprived of its most creative and inventive element.

Now the s**theads who rule the world don't care about anything other than their own quest to grab it all for themselves and their own kind, to the detriment of the rest of the population (just check the news to see this process at work on a daily basis; why, for example, do the media routinely describe the quest for continuous economic growth as if it's a necessity? Given that non management salaries have remained static throughtout the last 15 years of growth, who benefits? Not the working class majority, that's for sure! Since 2001, US corporate profits have gone up 74%, but average houshold income has gone down in real terms...see anything wrong with this picture?) and clearly don't give a hoot about what happens after their lifetimes (check their attitudes to global warming) and so are determined to eliminate us irritating autistics, simply because they can now generate profit without us (using the mass production techniques and computing that our kind invented) and consider us superfluous (and anything they can't exploit need not exist, as far as they are concerned!).

Imagine that they succed in eliminating our genes before they consign us to the next dark age (which now appears inevitable, and a lot sooner than most realise) as history teaches us is inevitable(and you may have noticed that the likes of Cheney and Rumpsfeld are pretty immune to the lessons of history)? Who in the next cycle of civilisation will reinvent fire, or the wheel?

It looks to me that if we don't do something to counter the establishment campaign, and convince the public at large that we are an essential part of humanity (using association with their heroes like Einstein etc,) then the chances of humanity ever getting to the stars is zero. In fact, without autism, the chances of humanity even re-emerging from the next dark age look pretty grim, and given the damage we've done to the environment, and the proliferation of weaponry, the next version will give a whole new meaning to "nasty, brutish and short", and the remnants will probably devolve into nothing but warlike, talking apes.

I don't know how the rest of you feel about the continued existence of mankind as constructive, reasoning entity, but to me it seems fairly important.

Yes, it is claimed that Albert Einstein may have possesed many of the symptoms and traits of AS, these include: his complete and obsessive focus on his work and interest, his unsuccesful female relationship with his cousin, his imagination that helped him visual gravitational lensing and time dilation through thought experiments, and less significantly; his bizarre (normal) expressions and inability to smile, his confessed boredom during school lessons.

I am also a lover of Physics and I spend most of my time imagining by applying the physics in our world..
What I cannot understand is why other people can't share with me the phenomenon of physics and how and why everything exists and works? Why can't people see the world like I do rather than concentrate on human inventions like politics and celebrities?
What is it with people?
Are they blind or stupid???????????????

this one i found interesting:

was einstein vegetarian?

How quickly negative versions of autism appear, and wrap up such threads...

Well, I've got other causes, and if you guys won't defend yourselves, I must look for other means...

I just responded to an apparent PM on AFF...and got inundated with more spiel than most of you have endured in a lifetime! But I'll keep on trying...after all, I am gwynfryn and I will always try to print the truth

So WHAT is your point, if you even have one? I HAVE seen this on OTHER sites, and other similar stuff has been mentioned. Wikipedia was used ONLY as a reference!

Sophist didn't dispute what I said, but merely said that others have disputed it, and that it might not be true. As for Asperger, aspie might even have been his nickname!

Steve

I'm not sure if I completely believe Einstein had AS because it's Einstein. If I had to bet though I would say he did but before reading this, I just wouldn't have bet. If I had no idea who these men were they were referring to, I would have been more apt to believe they had it then not. AS is here now and I would say it's been around for a long, long time. I wouldn't be at all surprised if Mr. Einstein had it for sure.
Like it says at the bottom though, without them being here now, it's really hard to know for certain.



Einstein, Newton, and Asperger Syndrome
From Mary Kugler, R.N.,
Your Guide to Rare Diseases.

Did both men have the disorder?
Researchers believe both Albert Einstein and Isaac Newton may have had Asperger syndrome, a developmental disorder in the autism spectrum. Professor Simon Baron-Cohen, of the Autism Research Centre at Cambridge University, and Ioan James, of Oxford University, studied the behavior of both famous scientists. The researchers felt Einstein and Newton displayed personality traits characteristic of Asperger syndrome.

Asperger a recent diagnosis
Although the behaviors known as Asperger syndrome were first described in the 1940s, the diagnosis was not officially recognized until 1994. Since Einstein and Newton lived before then, it is difficult to come to a definitive answer, since neither can be questioned or examined now.

What the researchers noted in biographical information about both men were behaviors seen with Asperger syndrome, such as:

limited but intense range of interests, especially specific intellectual areas
difficulty in social relationships, especially responding appropriately to others
problems communicating, such as difficulty making conversation or understanding others
The researchers pointed out that Einstein was a loner as a child and often repeated sentences obsessively until he was seven years old.
His career was centered on complex mathematical topics. He gave very confusing lectures.

As for Newton, the researchers noted that he hardly spoke, had few friends and was often bad-tempered around them. He often became so engrossed in his work (the science of physics) that he forgot to eat. He always gave his scheduled lectures, even if no one came.

Others not convinced
Others feel that the case is weak for the diagnosis of Asperger syndrome for either scientist. "One can imagine geniuses who are socially inept and yet not remotely autistic," said Dr. Glen Elliott, a psychiatrist at the University of California at San Francisco, in an interview published by BBC News. Without Einstein or Newton here to ask, it's difficult to be certain.

Updated: October 17, 2005

http://rarediseases.about.com/cs/asperg ... 041003.htm

Yes, according to that book, everything Steve said is true; it was cited from journals and the like. Unfortunately, the journals and research just weren't very good and the media really went with it and publicized it.

It's too bad his brain is no longer viable for study. But anyone who's interested in Einstein's brain, I do recommend the last chapter in that book.

What's this? You acknowledge his brain is no longer available for study? Oops; I should say "viable".

So tell me Sophist (interesting name) what do you make of the supposed reconstructions, on the web, of the supposed modelling of Einsteins entire cranial matter?

According to a neurologist friend of mine who tried to get a sample of Einy's brain to study, there was no longer any viable pieces available anymore.

As for the reconstructions, I can't really say. I've never seen or heard of them. I'd have to assume they're taken from the pictures that were taken before his brain got dissected the first time.

i didn't read this entire post, but i have heard this about Einstein before.
i do not believe Einstein had AS. but i do believe Sir Issac Newton did. and i like Newton way more. in math and physics, his stuff always was always my favourite. Einsteins work in physics seems....unnatural and ockward to me. but Newtons sits very well. i understand it w/ no effort, see where it came from, how it works, etc.
I read on some site a while ago, that some1 who knew Einstein in person, claims he did not have AS or dyslexia or any of these disorders people claim he did have.

I have heard something similar, but this comes from people who don't know any of those conditions very well (i.e., only familar with the classic Kanner's head-banging, institutionlized version, etc.). The reason I've infered this? Because one comment was [paraphrased] "Einstein was too social, he couldn't have been autistic". This shows a very inexperienced viewpoint of ASDs because autistics can be social, though perhaps some have more of a want and ability to do so than others.

That's true because researchers who I talked with whist doing their tests, note me as a keen conversationalist on their result statements, and it's true, once you speak to me, I never shut up and become almost too social... (I wonder if Einstein was the same way)

I swear I was rather intimidating to those researchers and doctors, and I was purposely at times too (just to show them that a HFA is more capable than what's expected)... Because they probably expected an HFA like myself, to not be able to speak so much coherently or to be a social creature at all