I feel cheated out of life...

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I choose neither... so I guess that means morality is whatever I want it to be.

Sounds good to me.

God or Science should be your foundation of truth, from which you base your morality. But who realy does this.

Sympathise with somebody’s so called irrational behaviour until you can understand why. Science brings that understanding. For Christians, they turn to God for understanding.

If this doesn't looks like a attempted justification for suicide, I'm not sure what is. And trying to rationalize it by saying he's explaining how Fearless feels doesn't make sense, because Chav is obviously using his own personal experiences and personal thoughts to describe a similar situation that Fearless is going through. It is even pointed out that Chav feels like Fearless does.

Regardless of the rationale, it is saying that suicide is OK, which it is clearly not.

I don't think anybody can realistically claim that not having a loving companion in a sexual relationship is means to justify suicide. I don't think anybody can claim that anything it means to justify suicide.



Well sadly enough, that is what the topic of not having a companion has boiled down to, a topic about suicide. So if you want to share your views, I think it makes sense to.

Aspie Chav

You couldn't be more wrong.

Most of the women in my family married aspie men with LESS money.

The times were different lets not forget, today's woman has higher standards (and less religion) and is status seeking, less inhibited, etc.

Aspies that cracked under the pressure of their upbringing and are in the poorest bracket are outcasts.

Many more intelligent men and philosophers that have written extensively would disagree with you (i.e. Hume, etc) when one's life ceases to have value or is too much of a struggle to maintain then one has the choice to opt out of living.

Well I don't know how Hume meant it, but I'd rate that as when, can't take myself to the toilet, can't get out of bed, none of my body works well enough to stand up, someone else has to bath me etc. And the killer would be when I couldn't communicate anything. Intense pain wouldn't be good either. Ie the last stages of death by cancer or MS or similar.

However I've heard of people happily living like this (without the intense pain) for years. So go figure.

I guess what I'm having trouble with here, is someone with an apparently healthy body, wanting to waste it because of mental pain caused by irrational thinking. Might not be such a waste if you could figure a way to become an organ donor.

Not justifying but merely getting to the truth, because as I said the truth is what you need as a foundation before you build any kind of morality, without truth morality is merely man made manipulation in descise. When I think about it, that is what negative view on suicide is.

Could it be that in the past suicidal people would do things truly suicidal for a good and noble reasons like winning a war, and conquering other lands? Or could people on the brink of suicide become more easy to mind wash then totally happy people.

I know that Christianity tend to get new recruits from the poor and heartbroken opposed to the rich and happy people. My trip to Turkey was an eye opener, in a country that is starting to make money and wealth, and maybe a bit of happiness, they are starting to leave behind there religion, even though Islam is much more stronger and stricter then Christianity.

I have come to the conclusion that as we have evolved as humans we have developed a very negative view of suicide not because it is immoral but because this belief gives us more power and if one has a suicidal person on your side then you have a very brave soldier who will risk anything.

We live in an NT world and it is all about aquiring power for the sake of having power.

Of course one has the choice to opt out of living. We always have a choice. It doesn't mean we should. Especially when the pain that is felt is self-inflicted. It can be changed. The pain can definitely go away. It doesn't make sense to commit suicide when the pain is just a temporary thing.

The reason I feel so strongly about this is because I was suicidal in my past, and I now see the error of my ways. I tried to OD once, and I tried to bleed myself once. I now see how wrong I was and I see many of the same destructive thought patterns in many of posters here. If you don't want to agree, fine don't. But if those who want advice on how to improve their lifes want it, I'll be more than happy to try and assist those that were once like myself. Furthermore, if you're commenting on this board, I really don't think you want to commit suicide because the concept about talking about is really asking for help.

I don't wish to encourage anyone to commit suicide. Regardless of whether people believe suicide is immoral or not, it isn't exactly desirable. Like you say, there is often life after depression, but there is nothing after suicide. And as far as I'm aware, Fearless didn't even say anything about suicide in the first place.

Ah, my bad. I thought you were defending the position of it, thus supporting it.





Yeah, it was in the first post, but it also came up in dialogue between posts too.

Sorry for the double post, but a user that couldn't log in sent me an e-mail regarding this topic:


Fearless I'm trying to find the words to strongly show how going to college will help you.

First if you have no money(I did not) you can get grants,loans to cover it all. Its just filling

out paperwork. You absolutely do have access to the money you need to go. Many schools

have open addmission so if you have a pulse they will admit you. (having at least a GED

and taking some admissin test is needed,but even if you bomb the test they will still

admit you) Sure it will be very stress full at first. I felt like killing myself the first week of

college. The first year even the rejects rejected me. I'm average looking with odd

behavior but I had many chances for female relationship. I was very shy but several

females express intrest in me,. Plus I made many male friends. To be honest I went to

school to get the government grant money. I stayed because of the social contact.

(before I lived as you do no job, housebound, no money, no hope). Take a lite load

12 hours (min for full time, thats like 3 or 4 classes). Take easy classes. Live in the

dorms. You are depressed you likely need to get on an anti-depressant(I was).

who cares if you get a degree? To tell the truth I would love to be at college now.

I went to college at 23 but there are many older students. You will have alot of young

women to choose from! You know at your house you have zero. You need to get out of

the house and the places to go is college.

Last edited by JohnnysEntertainmentFan on 14 Jun 2006, 3:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

"Some of us don't feel the rewards as strongly as we feel the punishments. We don't see life's beauty as clearly as we see the disorder. The comfort we receive doesn't cancel the pain. Suicide is the only relief from that kind of life." --Tom Day

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I'm hearing from you quoting that is that you reject all of the advice and hints people have given you, and you aren't willing to try them. May I ask why?

I think (and I believe other people that have posted think the same as well), that the reason you posted, and keep posting to the forums about this issue is because you wanted help with it? Am I wrong? You seem to be against any thought besides suicide and think that your life will never change. I really don't understand it. Maybe you could explain it for me.

Who is Tom Day, when did he live and write?

I don't happen to agree with him.

Pain is pain, it isn't a reason to live or die. You can actually learn to tune it out if you want to, this is actually easier if the pain is only in your head and not caused by something more obviously tangible like a rat chewing off your leg. You can use drugs if you want to. Some people like pain and seek it out. Lots and lots of people live with pain of all kinds and don't feel suicidal.

Have you ever worked with a volunteer helping organisation like a soup kitchen or the salvos or the red cross or medecine sans frontiers or the rspca or the local hospital and focussed on people outside of yourself and your own problems whose problems may well be worse than yours. They're very inspiring. They make me feel better about myself and the world. They definitely give you more to think about than your own will to live or lack of it.

Have you thought about how suicide affects people who have to clean up the mess? Maybe you should spend some time with St Johns Ambulance or similar.

Have you thought that maybe you don't know everything there is to know that you need to know, that is important?

By the way, something I do find attractive in a bloke is one that is an expert in his field and can teach me new things. So you could become an expert in ballroom dancing perhaps? Never enough blokes. Or sewing, or hair dressing or baking - I do find a bloke who can cook nice food very attractive. My last bf specialised in roasts. Not very difficult, but very delicious.

Do you know loneliness does to the immune system? Someone who is alone has less then half the antibodies then someone who is happily married. Actually be single and depressed is worse then a drinker, smoker who is married and loved.

I would bet that they even have fewer antibodies then some who has to live in physical pain. It was only last week that one member of staff died of a hart attack, relatively young; he lived alone with his mother. Now I bet his mother will follow seen after. Sometime you can ague with what the mind does, but you cant with what the body decides to do. I know that I will not be worrying about making any social security plans for old age; I will probably not reach it unless I make other plans.