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Men, Math and Marriage--arguments against marriage

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The_Face_of_Boo
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08 May 2013, 4:01 am

Logically, the number of married men who cheat would be sightly more than their fellow married women since men tend to have sex with women younger than them, so there are more single women involved in the cheating industry than single men, those are not considered to be cheating and hence not added to the stats.

I think that married women are more likely to cheat with married men.



Anomiel
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08 May 2013, 5:40 am

BlueMax wrote:
That's what bugs me about modern feminism... there's no objectivity, no fairness, no real desire for equality... only self-interest and destroying the opponent. If they cared about what was best for the kids, they wouldn't be working so hard to destroy their fathers (not to mention those people in happy marriages!)


The feminists that marry are probably in happy marriages themselves, so what's with the strawman attacking?
http://www.thefrisky.com/2011-03-10/guy ... ism-wrong/
http://goodmenproject.com/ethics-values ... -feminism/



Last edited by Anomiel on 08 May 2013, 5:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

restlesspirit
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08 May 2013, 5:42 am

BlueMax wrote:
You could quote a million links, Tyrion, the people from the zealot camp will concede nothing. I remember reading the manifesto of ~50 rules such as; "NEVER give an inch, no matter how right they are!" "If they make a valid point, ridicule it so no one will take it seriously."

His personal experience from the law firm with 90% majority in one direction should be convincing enough... you'll note how that point (among others) was conveniently ignored. That's what bugs me about modern feminism... there's no objectivity, no fairness, no real desire for equality... only self-interest and destroying the opponent. If they cared about what was best for the kids, they wouldn't be working so hard to destroy their fathers (not to mention those people in happy marriages!)

Unfortunately, this is why marriage is simply a bad idea for men today... there's a very, very low chance of finding someone who is genuinely kind, MEANS their marriage vows of "for life", and puts someone else's interests before her own. (Of course, the husband is also supposed to be putting her interests before his - so if both people are doing what they should, both parties will be very pleased with the other!)

I'd love to be married to a good person not taken over by greed... any volunteers? ;)



This works both ways,, I am unable to find men that value their vows and dont want to get a little on the side or keep looking to up grade to a newer model..my ex husband didn't value my opinions at all and did what HE wanted,, didn't matter what I thought or what my needs wrere,, BOTH genders don't honor marriage any more..

AT my age i see little reason to marry,, im beyond that child bearing age, I support myself.. and I have my own assets which I will NOT risk losing as my son is disabled and those will be sold off for him,, and the added stress of having to change my autistic rituals to suit someone else.. NO thanks.

a long term bf with separate residences MIGHT work but few men my age will settle for that,,they are looking for a nurse with apurse and I am neither,,


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The_Face_of_Boo
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08 May 2013, 6:12 am

Men cheat more than women, but not much:
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/17951664/ns/h ... Yohq6IhqGA


I find this chart very interesting too:

Image

It reminds me of real-life cases of wives who agreed with the idea that their traveling husbands get one night stand sex or have sex with prostitutes while they are in long business trips. "He has needs but he loves me" one said.

And in my macho country, it's not very uncommon for some girlfriends to be wanting to remain virgins till marriage while literally allowing their boyfriends to get sex from elsewhere as long they're committed with them in term of relationship, believing that their guys would stop doing so after marriage.

This tolerance encourages males to cheat too.

I had 4 colleague buddies back at the university who tried to invite me more than once to go with them on "brothel nights" on weekend nights - , they all had gfs, when they asked me for the first time I naively reacted in shocker "Don't you have gfs?!" - they laughed and one was saying the two matters are unrelated, what's more disturbing that two of the gfs were colleagues too and their guys weren't very discreet about it as they invited me in the open.
I am not sure if their gfs were aware of all this but these guys were used to frequently go to that same place on weekend nights, I can hardly believe that none of the four gfs (who know each other) sensed something, the four of them are now married to the same gfs.



Last edited by The_Face_of_Boo on 08 May 2013, 6:31 am, edited 3 times in total.

ArrantPariah
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08 May 2013, 6:25 am

Lebanon sounds like a great country. :wink:



The_Face_of_Boo
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08 May 2013, 6:32 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
Lebanon sounds like a great country. :wink:


Where do you live? Afghanistan?



ArrantPariah
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08 May 2013, 7:23 am

USA.



The_Face_of_Boo
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08 May 2013, 7:46 am

ArrantPariah wrote:
USA.


The Great Satan!! ! :o


Let's switch places, I love Satan :lol:



BlueMax
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08 May 2013, 9:25 am

restlesspirit wrote:
This works both ways,, I am unable to find men that value their vows and dont want to get a little on the side or keep looking to up grade to a newer model..my ex husband didn't value my opinions at all and did what HE wanted,, didn't matter what I thought or what my needs wrere,, BOTH genders don't honor marriage any more..

AT my age i see little reason to marry,, im beyond that child bearing age, I support myself.. and I have my own assets which I will NOT risk losing as my son is disabled and those will be sold off for him,, and the added stress of having to change my autistic rituals to suit someone else.. NO thanks.

a long term bf with separate residences MIGHT work but few men my age will settle for that,,they are looking for a nurse with a purse and I am neither,,


An excellent argument with excellent points. I agree - all too few people on both sides are not taking those vows seriously... people, in general, are too damned selfish for their own good.

I'll bet both of us would be singing a different tune had we beaten the odds and found partners that were kind to us... instead, we found what most people did - someone selfish, greedy and downright cruel. With the last couple generation of humans (particularly in North America and Europe) the slogan "greed is good" has never been more popular.

Those that are NOT part of this greedy culture are generally dismissed as the uncool, wimps, losers, etc. (unless they're also super sexy.) Worse... the greedy people will actually work hard to convert others the do selfish acts just like they are, purely for self-justification. For example, my ex's "friend" cheated on her husband a few times... and convinced other women to cheat on their husbands too. Hey - if everyone cheats, it's not "bad" anymore.... right? Right??? I suppose the same goes for the rest of the "mob mentality". Join in the [insert rotten act here] and revel in it with the group so no one feels the guilt/negativity that comes from someone actually saying, "No - what you're doing is wrong."

If you find a good person, don't let 'em get away! 8O



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08 May 2013, 10:24 am

AnonymousGIrl wrote:
ArrantPariah wrote:
Nonperson wrote:
So self-absorbed. I suppose he thinks things are just fine and dandy for divorced women with custody, who have to provide most of the childcare and most of the money to support those kids on their own, who might have fled an abuser or been abandoned by a cheat. They end up barely better off than single moms, having to do the work of two people and only getting a small check once in a while from their ex if they're lucky. And as for the kids, should kids be shipped back and forth between two different homes, or sent to live with a parent who had only a minor role in raising them before the divorce? As long as women are the primary caregivers most of the time (and I'm not saying they necessarily should be, but I don't see dads lining up to stay home or work fewer hours - probably because they'd end up making as little money as women do if they did) they ought to be getting custody most of the time. They put in the hours, they built the relationship with the child, and the child's well-being comes first.

But no, we all have to feel sorry for the dad who ends up paying child support and (*gasp*) driving an old car. Boo friggin hoo.


This would seem to support Mr. Elam's contention that men should stay well away from women.


Egh it seems more to support that gals should stay well away from guys.


I think that Feminism isn't so much about "gals should stay away from guys" as "gals should go to work and undo millions of years of evolution that make men what they are", and that gals should have legal, moral, and other advantages over men.

Mr. Elam's point of view seems to be that "gals are nothing but trouble! Stay away from them! They just aren't worth it!"

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBW-51xzZNE[/youtube]



BlueMax
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08 May 2013, 10:29 am

Image



Anomiel
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08 May 2013, 12:34 pm

BlueMax wrote:
Image


Congratz finding one of the few sexist strips from that comic, I'm sure you've been searching fervently since I posted the link to it the other day.
That series is all about the text under them that explains the news or stereotypes (about the countries) it is based on. Apparently this is the context to that strip:
http://satwcomic.com/monster wrote:
"When I went to England I noticed that people would apologize or even freak out if they as much as touched my little finger. At first I thought that maybe I was putting people off, but later it was explained to me that English people are just incredibly nervous about touching people they don't know very well.

I've been to conventions in quite a few countries by now, and England is the only country where most people asked for a handshake rather than a hug."


I believe the writer/cartoonist is a woman, btw.



Last edited by Anomiel on 08 May 2013, 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Anomiel
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08 May 2013, 12:52 pm

ArrantPariah wrote:

I think that Feminism isn't so much about "gals should stay away from guys" as "gals should go to work and undo millions of years of evolution that make men what they are", and that gals should have legal, moral, and other advantages over men.


If you don't understand that gender is a social construct, and you think the things feminism wants to "undo" - like rape, violence, being incapable of housework, thinking they deserve bigger salaries for having penises - comes from evolution and are something natural to men then YOU must really hate men a lot.

It's a made up social construct. Are you any of those things? Are you a rapist?!? Why not, if you think evolution made all men that you have some explaining to do if you're not. Are you abusive? If it were evolution, you should probably be locked up already, and all others that are like you.

Here's someone that could teach you a thing or two:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTvSfeCRxe8[/youtube]

http://goodmenproject.com/bits-and-pieces/hesaid-violence-silence-jackson-katz-asks-whats-going-on-with-men/ wrote:

“Calling gender violence a ‘women’s issue’ is part of the problem.”

Jackson Katz, an anti-sexist activist who works extensively with the military and university sports culture, gave a TED Talk in February about men’s role in what has largely been built as a “women’s movement.” He asks, “Why do so many men abuse, physically, emotionally, verbally and other ways the women and girls and the men and boys that they claim to love? What’s going on with men?”

Using linguistics and logic, Katz directly challenges anti-feminist mentality and reframes gender violence prevention as a men’s issue. His “bystander approach” aims to create a culture in which gender violence is categorically unacceptable in the peer culture, among men and women alike. That includes violence of all kinds perpetrated by men against women, men against children, women against men, and men against one another.

“This isn’t about individual perpetrators. That’s a very naive way to understand what is a much deeper and more systematic social problem…How can we change the socialization of boys and the definitions of manhood that lead to these current outcomes?”

His conclusion is powerful and inspirational:

“We owe it to women, there’s no question about it, but we also owe it to our sons. We also owe it to young men who are growing up all over the world in situations where they didn’t make the choice to be a man in a culture that tells them that manhood is a certain way. They didn’t make the choice. We that have a choice have an opportunity and a responsibility to them.”



BlueMax
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08 May 2013, 12:57 pm

Anomiel wrote:
Congratz finding one of the few sexist strips from that comic, I'm sure you've been searching fervently since I posted the link to it the other day.
That series is all about the text under them that explains the news or stereotypes (about the countries) it is based on. Apparently this is the context to that strip:
http://satwcomic.com/monster wrote:
"When I went to England I noticed that people would apologize or even freak out if they as much as touched my little finger. At first I thought that maybe I was putting people off, but later it was explained to me that English people are just incredibly nervous about touching people they don't know very well.

I've been to conventions in quite a few countries by now, and England is the only country where most people asked for a handshake rather than a hug."


And congrats to you for, once again, assuming the absolute worst. Hostile feminism has a lot of people downright terrified that one wrong (and innocent) move will cost them their job, land them in court, or lock them in jail.

Think I'm over-reacting? It's happened to me and my friends often enough to agree with the stats. What really sucks is that instead of attacking the savage men who are committing the crimes against women, they attack the gentle, defenceless ones who never would have hurt them in the first place (then date the strong, "confident" men worthy of their respect.)
Talk about walking the tightrope... if a man is too gentle, she won't respect him. If he's too forceful, she'll resent it and cry "abuse" (some will then gain their "power" back by attacking a weak man instead of the abusers.)

...but I suppose it's useless to complain about it - it's human nature running rampant and wild. I just think it's time to expect both genders to be called to task for their actions.

...and I want my dang kids back from their legal kidnapper mother.



Anomiel
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08 May 2013, 1:13 pm

BTW you guys: Did you know that the autistic brain, which is different in so many other ways, also is different in that our brains are like the midpoint between NT-males and NT-females brains? That goes for all genders of autistics.
So you all can just f**k off.

Quote:
Beacher FD, Minati L, Baron-Cohen S, Lombardo MV, Lai MC, et al. (2011) Autism attenuates sex differences in brain structure: a combined voxel-based morphometry and diffusion tensor imaging study. AJNR. Jan 33(1): 83.9 doi: 10.3174/ajnr.A2880.



Tyri0n
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08 May 2013, 1:53 pm

Anomiel wrote:
BTW you guys: Did you know that the autistic brain, which is different in so many other ways, also is different in that our brains are like the midpoint between NT-males and NT-females brains? That goes for all genders of autistics.
So you all can just f**k off.

Quote:
Beacher FD, Minati L, Baron-Cohen S, Lombardo MV, Lai MC, et al. (2011) Autism attenuates sex differences in brain structure: a combined voxel-based morphometry and diffusion tensor imaging study. AJNR. Jan 33(1): 83.9 doi: 10.3174/ajnr.A2880.


That's very interesting. My brain is like split between being more male than NT male brains in some ways and being feminine in others. It's like autistic extremes, basically.

Definitely, from a social processing/affective point of view, I am hyper male. I have quite low affective empathy. But, in terms of cognitive empathy, I am quite feminine.