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Is it ''abnormal'' for a 25 or 30 year old to be a virgin ?

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cyberdad
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05 Mar 2024, 2:26 am

funeralxempire wrote:
You must be a special case, most of the guys who complain about being virgins until their mid-20s or later consistently mention lack of opportunity as a major contributing factor.


I was marriage orientated. So alas I was also picky. I probably hurt a lot of girl's feelings but had it done to me too. By my mid-30s I realise the marriage market in Australia was dried up and looked overseas.



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05 Mar 2024, 2:27 am

Nades wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Nades wrote:
It can apply to many things beside virginity so I don't see why virginity is somehow free from scrutiny.


scrutiny from whom?


From anyone. I don't understand why it's acceptable to say someone's fear of flying or refusal to learn to drive is irrational assuming they have no underlying reasons for their fear, yet somehow mentioning a fear of losing virginity being irrational despite no underlying reasons is judgmental.

Some people are just naturally anxious and they need to realise that what many people do with ease won't come naturally to them and they'll need to give themselves more of a push. The problem starts when they fail to analyse the situation and just hide instead.

There really are people who just refuse to step outside their comfort zone as funeral said and I don't see the purpose it serves by pretending they don't exist. I've seen plenty of them including one virgin.


Fair enough



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05 Mar 2024, 2:56 am

cyberdad wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
You must be a special case, most of the guys who complain about being virgins until their mid-20s or later consistently mention lack of opportunity as a major contributing factor.


I was marriage orientated. So alas I was also picky. I probably hurt a lot of girl's feelings but had it done to me too. By my mid-30s I realise the marriage market in Australia was dried up and looked overseas.


Seems like a special case, I noticed that women have a tendency to wait until marriage more than men but like you said, eventually the options begin to dry up.

I think it's important that the average age for having a child is considered. People who have kids usually have their first by around 30 so it gives an indication of where men and women want to be around that age involving their love loves. While many have their own ideas as to what they personally want, those ideas wil have to roughly fall into what general society wants at the time.

I consider virginity past 30 to be unusual and a sign of a possible problem as a result. It's not always the case, but if someone is being a distinct out-layer at that age then it's a possibility.



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05 Mar 2024, 2:58 am

Nades wrote:
cyberdad wrote:
Nades wrote:
It can apply to many things beside virginity so I don't see why virginity is somehow free from scrutiny.


scrutiny from whom?


From anyone. I don't understand why it's acceptable to say someone's fear of flying or refusal to learn to drive is irrational assuming they have no underlying reasons for their fear, yet somehow mentioning a fear of losing virginity being irrational despite no underlying reasons is judgmental.

Some people are just naturally anxious and they need to realise that what many people do with ease won't come naturally to them and they'll need to give themselves more of a push. The problem starts when they fail to analyse the situation and just hide instead.

There really are people who just refuse to step outside their comfort zone as funeral said and I don't see the purpose it serves by pretending they don't exist. I've seen plenty of them including one virgin.


I have legitimate reasons for my fear of driving, fear of flying and fear of intimacy/sex

With driving I am afraid of getting into a car accident

With flying I am afraid of a plane crash

And finally...

With intimacy/sex I am afraid of pregnancy/childbirth and the pain resulting from a man sticking his dick in my vagina

This is the reason that making out and passionate kissing is the farthest I have gone!

The only one of those I actually did was flying in an airplane which was scary but it was just a short ride from San Francisco to Anaheim for Disneyland

Let me put a quote from a certain blue-eyed yellow cartoon character that sums all of this up nicely:

"I don't want to face my fears!" "I'm afraid of them!"- said by SpongeBob SquarePants in the episode "Roller Cowards"

Yep me too Spongie!! ! :heart: :heart: :heart:


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funeralxempire
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05 Mar 2024, 3:41 am

I might fall down the stairs when I use them, but if fear of falling down the stairs was enough to keep me from using the stairs, it would be an irrational fear.

Yes, overall the likelihood of being in a car accident or plane crash isn't enough to justify refusing to use those methods of transportation. That's what causes that level of fear to be described as irrational.


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05 Mar 2024, 3:46 am

funeralxempire wrote:
I might fall down the stairs when I use them, but if fear of falling down the stairs was enough to keep me from using the stairs, it would be an irrational fear.

Yes, overall the likelihood of being in a car accident or plane crash isn't enough to justify refusing to use those methods of transportation. That's what causes that level of fear to be described as irrational.


Well for what it's worth in the episode of SpongeBob "Roller Cowards" him and Patrick eventually overcome their fear of riding The Fiery Fist of Pain roller coaster

So are you saying the only way to get rid of those fears is to just face them anyway?

Like learn how to drive and have sex?


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05 Mar 2024, 3:57 am

Nades wrote:
I think it's important that the average age for having a child is considered. People who have kids usually have their first by around 30 so it gives an indication of where men and women want to be around that age involving their love loves. While many have their own ideas as to what they personally want, those ideas wil have to roughly fall into what general society wants at the time..


They are valid points



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05 Mar 2024, 4:01 am

Nades wrote:
, I noticed that women have a tendency to wait until marriage more than men but like you said, eventually the options begin to dry up.


This is something I have posted before. Here in the English speaking west (US, UK Australia, Canada NZ etc) the market really does dry up. I don't want to comment on what's left but in China any woman over the age of 27 is called "leftover women" (A female chinese colleague told me this). The local men tend to avoid them for marriage. That's pretty much the same thing for > 35s in the anglosphere.



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05 Mar 2024, 4:06 am

Mikurotoro92 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
I might fall down the stairs when I use them, but if fear of falling down the stairs was enough to keep me from using the stairs, it would be an irrational fear.

Yes, overall the likelihood of being in a car accident or plane crash isn't enough to justify refusing to use those methods of transportation. That's what causes that level of fear to be described as irrational.


Well for what it's worth in the episode of SpongeBob "Roller Cowards" him and Patrick eventually overcome their fear of riding The Fiery Fist of Pain roller coaster

So are you saying the only way to get rid of those fears is to just face them anyway?

Like learn how to drive and have sex?


Pretty much. If it's something that you're really stressed by, you can take baby steps and manage risk, but ultimately work towards those goals rather than flinching away from opportunities.

But also, to not let a single bad experience discourage you from further attempts at gaining a skill or trying an experience.

I don't say this as though it's not an issue I struggle with constantly, it's just one that I know I can't let win. Ultimately it's a self-defeating tendency.


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05 Mar 2024, 4:12 am

Mikurotoro92 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
I might fall down the stairs when I use them, but if fear of falling down the stairs was enough to keep me from using the stairs, it would be an irrational fear.

Yes, overall the likelihood of being in a car accident or plane crash isn't enough to justify refusing to use those methods of transportation. That's what causes that level of fear to be described as irrational.


Well for what it's worth in the episode of SpongeBob "Roller Cowards" him and Patrick eventually overcome their fear of riding The Fiery Fist of Pain roller coaster

So are you saying the only way to get rid of those fears is to just face them anyway?

Like learn how to drive and have sex?


Comment was for funeral but yes.



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05 Mar 2024, 4:25 am

cyberdad wrote:
I don't want to comment on what's left but in China any woman over the age of 27 is called "leftover women" (A female chinese colleague told me this). The local men tend to avoid them for marriage. That's pretty much the same thing for > 35s in the anglosphere.


Not just China. Lucky Star has a bit where the Ms. Kuroi buys a Christmas cake on December 26th because she overheard the girls roasting the leftover Christmas cakes and felt self-conscious about 'no one wants a leftover'.

They often compare marriage to Christmas, like how 25 is past the end of the line.
Once you're past 25 a Christmas cake is just another cake. It looks stale so you lose your appetite.

As she walks home with her cake they spell it out clearly, Nanako Kuroi, 27, single.
Also, it ain't a leftover because I bought one.


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05 Mar 2024, 5:14 am

cyberdad wrote:
Nades wrote:
, I noticed that women have a tendency to wait until marriage more than men but like you said, eventually the options begin to dry up.


This is something I have posted before. Here in the English speaking west (US, UK Australia, Canada NZ etc) the market really does dry up. I don't want to comment on what's left but in China any woman over the age of 27 is called "leftover women" (A female chinese colleague told me this). The local men tend to avoid them for marriage. That's pretty much the same thing for > 35s in the anglosphere.


This has been going on for a long time. Even in the religious periods of generations gone by, singles were called "spinsters" and "thorn backs" if they remained unmarried past 25.

I don't know exactly why this was the case but I'm assuming biology played a role. Once past 35 fertility starts to decline in males and females so it was probably an intentionally created stigma in the hopes of discouraging "leaving it too late".

There's also the possibility of negative personality traits like being overly picky or habitually avoiding stepping outside ones comfort zone once they get to that age.



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05 Mar 2024, 5:52 am

funeralxempire wrote:
Mikurotoro92 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
I might fall down the stairs when I use them, but if fear of falling down the stairs was enough to keep me from using the stairs, it would be an irrational fear.

Yes, overall the likelihood of being in a car accident or plane crash isn't enough to justify refusing to use those methods of transportation. That's what causes that level of fear to be described as irrational.


Well for what it's worth in the episode of SpongeBob "Roller Cowards" him and Patrick eventually overcome their fear of riding The Fiery Fist of Pain roller coaster

So are you saying the only way to get rid of those fears is to just face them anyway?

Like learn how to drive and have sex?


Pretty much. If it's something that you're really stressed by, you can take baby steps and manage risk, but ultimately work towards those goals rather than flinching away from opportunities.

But also, to not let a single bad experience discourage you from further attempts at gaining a skill or trying an experience.

I don't say this as though it's not an issue I struggle with constantly, it's just one that I know I can't let win. Ultimately it's a self-defeating tendency.


I guess this stuff is scary to me only because I have yet to experience them!

Once I finally have sex and start driving I will have freaked out over NOTHING!! !

Now like you said I MUST start taking baby steps and managing the risks

I know what needs to be done in order to drive (go to DMV and take a driving test) but what about sex?

How can I actually put myself in the position to have sex without having to wait until marriage?

How do I get to that point?


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05 Mar 2024, 6:13 am

Mikurotoro92 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Mikurotoro92 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
I might fall down the stairs when I use them, but if fear of falling down the stairs was enough to keep me from using the stairs, it would be an irrational fear.

Yes, overall the likelihood of being in a car accident or plane crash isn't enough to justify refusing to use those methods of transportation. That's what causes that level of fear to be described as irrational.


Well for what it's worth in the episode of SpongeBob "Roller Cowards" him and Patrick eventually overcome their fear of riding The Fiery Fist of Pain roller coaster

So are you saying the only way to get rid of those fears is to just face them anyway?

Like learn how to drive and have sex?


Pretty much. If it's something that you're really stressed by, you can take baby steps and manage risk, but ultimately work towards those goals rather than flinching away from opportunities.

But also, to not let a single bad experience discourage you from further attempts at gaining a skill or trying an experience.

I don't say this as though it's not an issue I struggle with constantly, it's just one that I know I can't let win. Ultimately it's a self-defeating tendency.


I guess this stuff is scary to me only because I have yet to experience them!

Once I finally have sex and start driving I will have freaked out over NOTHING!! !

Now like you said I MUST start taking baby steps and managing the risks

I know what needs to be done in order to drive (go to DMV and take a driving test) but what about sex?

How can I actually put myself in the position to have sex without having to wait until marriage?

How do I get to that point?


You analysed your situation correctly. You're experiencing anxiety about it simply because you never tried it before. Your response is the correct one with pushing ahead regardless knowing it'll get easier from there and one day the anxiety will melt away.

As to how to get to that point without getting married, you just don't need to get married. Most people lose their virginity outside of marriage in a haphazard manner anyway. My first time was in a grubby university flat half drunk. It might be worth either progressing kissing into touching (baby steps and he mentioned) or even setting a time and day but not putting any emphasis on overcomplicating it.



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05 Mar 2024, 6:21 am

Apparently I was reasonably attractive, but when I was a teen I was extremely unpopular and mostly got negative messages about my appearance. I did not have the sort of confidence that women "typically" say is needed to attract them. I was developing some incel-like tendencies before losing my virginity 3 months before my 21st birthday. It helped that this person had just learned that her boyfriend was now with someone else, and that she was probably on the autism spectrum. The next person I had sex with was someone my first girlfriend had known in school. I think her knowledge that I had been in an intimate relationship with her school chum made me an acceptable sex partner and she was very horny after having gone many months without. The next after that was six years older and approached me for sex because she was horny and probably didn't want to spend the night alone.

Except possibly the very first one, these women, in today's world, would have probably just found a casual hookup on Tinder to relieve their horniness. I refuse to judge modern-day incels. I think I could have easily become one of them.


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05 Mar 2024, 6:53 am

Nades wrote:
Mikurotoro92 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
Mikurotoro92 wrote:
funeralxempire wrote:
I might fall down the stairs when I use them, but if fear of falling down the stairs was enough to keep me from using the stairs, it would be an irrational fear.

Yes, overall the likelihood of being in a car accident or plane crash isn't enough to justify refusing to use those methods of transportation. That's what causes that level of fear to be described as irrational.


Well for what it's worth in the episode of SpongeBob "Roller Cowards" him and Patrick eventually overcome their fear of riding The Fiery Fist of Pain roller coaster

So are you saying the only way to get rid of those fears is to just face them anyway?

Like learn how to drive and have sex?


Pretty much. If it's something that you're really stressed by, you can take baby steps and manage risk, but ultimately work towards those goals rather than flinching away from opportunities.

But also, to not let a single bad experience discourage you from further attempts at gaining a skill or trying an experience.

I don't say this as though it's not an issue I struggle with constantly, it's just one that I know I can't let win. Ultimately it's a self-defeating tendency.


I guess this stuff is scary to me only because I have yet to experience them!

Once I finally have sex and start driving I will have freaked out over NOTHING!! !

Now like you said I MUST start taking baby steps and managing the risks

I know what needs to be done in order to drive (go to DMV and take a driving test) but what about sex?

How can I actually put myself in the position to have sex without having to wait until marriage?

How do I get to that point?


You analysed your situation correctly. You're experiencing anxiety about it simply because you never tried it before. Your response is the correct one with pushing ahead regardless knowing it'll get easier from there and one day the anxiety will melt away.

As to how to get to that point without getting married, you just don't need to get married. Most people lose their virginity outside of marriage in a haphazard manner anyway. My first time was in a grubby university flat half drunk. It might be worth either progressing kissing into touching (baby steps and he mentioned) or even setting a time and day but not putting any emphasis on overcomplicating it.


I still want to get married mostly for the wedding and honeymoon experience (and the fact that you can have sex basically at command!) but that is very true what you said!

So you're suggesting like how my ex Robbie tried to initiate sex with making out and passionately kissing only this time it actually moves into the bedroom?

Well I mean that's obvious

My question was NOT about how to get a man to initiate sex or vice-versa

The real question is... how do I get a man to invite me to his house or vice-versa in order for sex to actually take place?

I am tired of being here in my boring house in the middle of nowhere every weekend when I would MUCH rather spend the night at a man's house and have some fun with him!! !

Again, how do I get to that point?


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