Students protest male student's access to girls' facilities

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It appears more than 100 students walked out in protest of an intact male, claiming he is really a girl, attempting to access girls' facilities:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/02/us/te ... .html?_r=0

Those opposed to intact males accessing girls' and women's facilities seem to be getting better organized. I think that trans activists are going to have a harder time on this issue in the future.

The Justice Department's questionable interpretation of Title IX regarding this issue was last month soundly rejected by a federal judge:

http://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/federa ... der-89059/

It's not a male, it's a transgender female.

She is a girl. She is transgender, and should have every right to use the girl's facilities as she is a girl.

This person is not female. This individual is biologically male despite his brain wiring/his gender.

The issue at hand is that the girl's rights are being trampled upon to accommodate this person's wants.

I've no problem with this person being called she or that this person wants to and will lead his/her life as a female. All power to her. However when it comes to matters of privacy this person needs to understand and be part of the process that females do not want a penis-wielder in the bathroom with them while they change/get naked/etc.

The school already has a transgender bathroom. Frankly I find it arrogant to demand access to female's facilities given this fact.

In my opinion, this person and others like her should become part of the process of accommodation and acceptance rather than demand that everyone else comply with their wants. Is this person female? No. Not biologically and not in gender...she is thirdgender... a biological male with female mind/spirit/whatever. In all legal aspects she should have the right to be treated as female if it is her wish but when it comes to matters of privacy she has no right to step on other's right to privacy. Its not her fault she wasnt born biologically female but it is also not the fault of the other girl's in that school either.

What she is doing is the equivalent of disabled people demanding that every parking lot and every bathroom stall be assigned as disabled parking/bathroom and that non-disabled people must always give up their parking and always give them first use of the toilet facilities because they are disabled. That is not accommodation that is discriminatory privilege.

What do you think happens in bathrooms? People do not go around showing off their genitals. They go in, use the stall, leave. I myself have used male changing rooms at shops because sometimes I present and have identified as a guy. Did I harass the men and boys there? No. Why would it be different for her?
It is not about discriminatory privilege. It is about right. It's honestly worse to demand a toilet/room specifically for transgender people than it is asking for the use of the facilities already there (yes I am aware they have a trans toilet there).
The male/female facility is honestly more about gender, if a transgender person became a student at that school but was already presenting as the gender they identified as it is very unlikely that anyone would make a deal about them using the facilities they would want to. The m/f facilities are okay for general population, put the male identifying males with similar, put the female identifying females with similar. When there's a cross over, it should be up for the trans person in question.
Transwomen who use female facilities are not predators.

Have you seen this person? Basically a very male-looking person wearing a Halloween-quality wig. I'm not surprised that many people question whether this is a true transsexual, or merely an opportunistic voyeur.

Your right, people usually don't go around showing off their genitals in restrooms, so there should be no issue with this 'female' using the biologically appropriate facilities. I don't get where the 'rights' of one person trumps the rights of many people. This is the tyranny of the insignificant minority and is wrong!

By "facilities" I would assume they mean the changing room or showers. If it's just the bathroom, that doesn't seem like quite such a big deal.

As long as a bathroom is designated for females, males should not be allowed to use it.
Otherwise, any male could just claim they are transgender or feel like a girl and go into the female bathroom.
What transgender is, I am not sure, but feeling like a girl or thinking one should be girl doesn't mean the brain or mind of a girl or a brain or mind that is not male.

This is where things clash: What about the rights of the girls? They are being tossed aside out of political correctness. That is where it ceases to be a right and becomes a discriminatory privilege.

Why is it worse to demand a transgender bathroom? What is it about being transgender that non-transgenders have to forfeit their right to privacy for?



That's your biased assumption. What is happening in this school obviously contradicts that. Its interesting you claim that if a new student transferred in and said 'hey i was born a guy but im transgender so ill be using the girl's facilities from now on and not the transgender facilities' that guys and girls there would be perfectly ok with it. That to me makes no sense. If anything, a small population such as a school would be far more readily accepting of someone who they already know for years rather than a newcomer. This obviously wasn't the case.



Why should it be when there is a transgender specific facility available?



That is not the issue nor did I notice anyone mentioning that in the article or here. It's about the girls using the bathroom being forced to allow a biological male person to use their facilities.

As you may have noticed, there is an apparent line drawn between this person being pre-sex change and having a sex change. It is understandable young girls of school age would have less issues accepting this person if the sex change had occurred. Thing is, this person has not committed for whatever reason (medical or financial or whatever) to that sex change hence the chances of being accepted as non-male among the girls is difficult.

Look at it from the girl's perspective. You walk into the bathroom and there's a guy with a wig who you have heard of but do not know personally in there. You can see how the comfort level goes to zero and yes, alarms go off. Its natural. They do not know this person that is quite visibly a guy with a wig. For however long this person is in the bathroom with the girl, the girl will feel zero privacy (again: this is a girl that does not know this person, personally as a friend or what not).

I've seen M->F trans pre-op people who literally look more female than natural born females. But not all have this gift of looks/body type to achieve nor access to hormones/surgeries to achieve that (if that is what they want to achieve to begin with). When you impose that males with wigs who identify as female yet remain quite visibly biologically male can, just like those who have undergone full sex change and look more female than natural born females, use the girl's bathrooms you trample on the privacy rights of said natural born girls.

Saying that providing a bathroom facility for transgendered individuals is denying them access to what they identify is to take their rights away makes no sense. It's providing FOR their rights to be transgendered. On the flip side, transgendered individuals demanding to use the facilities of male or female because its what they identify as is literally playing the victim (when no one, not even themselves is at fault for them being born into the wrong biological sex) and forcing the other genders to 'pay' for this 'wrong' by forfeiting their right to privacy.

edit: corrected parenthesis use.

By that I meant if the student was stealth, if they didn't reveal to anyone their assigned birth gender. How would you know, unless told, what genitals someone would have?
To make it clearer, hypothetical situation: a boy moves to a new school. He uses the toilets and changing rooms alongside other boys. He happens to have a vagina, but has lived as a boy for a long time, he feels like a boy, and has never disclosed to people at the new school his birth sex.
Take it the other way: a girl moves to a new school. She uses the toilets and changing rooms alongside other girls. She happens to have a penis, but has lived as a girl for a long time, she feels like a girl, and has never disclosed to people at the new school her birth sex.
There is nothing wrong with that, and nothing wrong with being public about being transgender.
Why does it matter to you? Do you personally inspect everyone's genitals when you use a facility? It should not matter.
It's not about privacy for girls. The transgirl in question likely is attracted to boys. She's not using those facilities to impact anyone's privacy. She wants to use those facilities to feel more comfortable.Why would their privacy be compromised?

That's called deception not accommodation or acceptance by others.

To answer your question.. yes. Their privacy is compromised from the first moment this person 'stealthily' uses the facilities.

I do not need to inspect a person's genitals in a bathroom if Im a girl in this school and see a guy with a wig inside. On the flip side, if this guy was more female in appearance than most females I may not spot the difference ...but the day I found out he was not a girl then I'd probably be very offended at knowing this person deceived everyone plus breached my privacy.

Bear this in mind: Only those who are friends (and perhaps close friends at that) of this more female than female transgender guy..or of a visibly male with a wig one, have the friendship bond to not feel this offense or feel threatened in any way or form. That is because they are willing, as their choice, to share their privacy with this person. Those who do not have this bond are being FORCED to.

That is where the problem is.

Definitely a creepy male, Kudos to the students male and female for standing up against a peeping tom.

Yeah, the thought that he might be a peeping tom who was misusing a legal loophole did cross my mind, also.

After a while of not using this site I came back because I needed support.
But.
Then this post reminded me why I stopped.
Everyone here is so transphobic. Trans people are NOT deceiving anyone. Trans people are NOT preying on anyone. This is a non-issue, she should be allowed the same treatment as ANY OTHER BIOLOGICAL GIRL.

Considering all the aspects of this issue doesn't make us transphobic, it's called having a discussion. In some segments of society, it's also called being open-minded and fair.